Got Surprised by a Bear this Weekend, Rethinking Carry Options

[LanceOregon]

My son ran into a good size black bear last September while trout fishing at a high mountain lake. The bear was feeding along the edge of the lake as my son and his girlfriend approached. However, the moment the Bear saw my son, he immediately turned and fled.

My son managed to snap this photo of him as he ran away:

I wonder why the bear was so scared of my son?? He is a nice looking young man. In fact, his girlfriend snapped this photo of him as they were hiking to the lake:

I wonder why the bear thought that my son was a danger??? Could it have been the .45 on his hip??


Here is a photo taken later that day, as my son hauled in one of the trout he caught:

 

[LanceOregon]

I could probably find a way to carry a 3.5 inch bbl 45ACP, but it probably lacks penetration too.

My son was carrying a SIG 45 with a 3.9 inch barrel on the trip that I just described. He has no problems hiking with it. He had it loaded with some 230 gr Winchester Ranger Law Enforcement ammo.

One of my Dad's neighbors back in California used to hunt black bears a lot with his Colt Gold Cup .45, until his hips got too bad. He told me that he killed them all with the Federal 230 gr Hydrashok load.

He told me his story in the Den of his house, where he has a full bear skin rug lying on the floor in the room, as well as another full bear skin mounted on one wall. And they are most impressive looking!

Here is a photo showing some recovered expanded Winchester Ranger T bullets. The .45 is the last one on the bottom:

And here is a close-up of the Winchester Ranger ammo, and some more recovered bullets:

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[Citizen Carrier]

I've always thought a Glock 20 loaded with 10mm FMJs approximating the original stout 200 grain Norma load would be a good pistol for bear country. 15 shots of the stuff available in the magazine.

It would also be good for predators of the two-legged kind as well. Much more than some single-action Casull or S&W .500 wunderblitzenpistol.

Why somebody from Ohio would ever think about such things is a mystery, but there you have it.

 

[CajunBass]

I live sort of on the edge of "out in the country." There have been a few reports of black bears in the area. They walk through peoples back yards, and steal their birdfeeders apparently. I haven't seen any of them, but it seems no one else can go to the mailbox without tripping over a bear.

I'm so worried about them that I carry a Ruger Bearcat with me on my morning walks.

To be honest, I worry a lot more about ticks and chiggers than I do bears.

 

[WIN71]

Copy of old 5x7 photo

Black bears can get big, even in California. This one was taken out with an 80,000 lb loaded log truck. Proof positive that big slow projectiles work.

 

[skoro]

Black bears tend to be pretty docile, even though they aren't timid about being in close contact with people. But if worst came to worst, I'd think that a shot of .40S&W would send about ANY black bear on his way in a hurry. You're not hunting him, you're only wanting him to scram, and fast. Your present pistol should do that without any trouble.

Be grateful that grizzles aren't Colorado residents these days.

 

[LanceOregon]

Be grateful that grizzles aren't Colorado residents these days.

What I am even more afraid of are wolves. The Yellowstone Wolf Population continues to spread out across our nation since they were reintroduced there. Idaho now has a population of over 500 wolves. And just this past month, both Washington and Oregon now have their first functioning wolf packs in the eastern parts of both states.

If you think that Black Bears don't mix well with humans, wait until the wolf packs come a calling.

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[mountainclmbr]

I agree that close car collisions with wildlife are the most common event around here. I have had so many close calls with deer and elk that I can't even count them. Never had a near collision with a moose, but have a friend that nearly collided with one while speeding downhill mountain biking.

 

[Sparks2112]

What I am even more afraid of are wolves.

Wolves are going to be more interested in sheep and other things most of the time IMO.

Here's a photo I took for a wildlife organization, and before you ask, no those aren't trained wolves. They seemed pretty friendly all and all.

 

[azredhawk44]

They're also apparently behind a fence and being fed.

Not likely to attack an animal larger than themselves when their stomachs are full.

Find a wolf pack in late fall that hasn't made a kill in a week, invite them into your backyard and get that same girl to go pose for another picture with the wolves.

 

[Sparks2112]

Not likely to attack an animal larger than themselves when their stomachs are full.

Any carnivore is dangerous when it's starving. My point was is that they're not going to seek out human interaction on their own, and aren't inherently more dangerous by nature than any other predator in the wild. I'm not some blinded by idealogy hippy treehugger who thinks all god's creatures are cuddly safe and cute in all circumstances. Was just saying all the ones I've encountered, both in the wild and in captivity generally aren't interested in eating people except under very limited circumstances.

Find a wolf pack in late fall that hasn't made a kill in a week, invite them into your backyard and get that same girl to go pose for another picture with the wolves.

I think I might have a hard time getting my insurance agent to sign off on that one.

 

[spacemanspiff]

psshawww! I could take that wimpy 200 lb bear with one hand tied behind my back!

 

[kayakersteve]

Dwight...

And unless you are willing to seriously punish your hands, wrists, and forearms, . . . stay away from the super boomers such as the .454 Casul. A friend has an Alaskan in .454, .

My 460V S&W barely kicks.... Of course it weighs 60+ ounces and is ported.

We had a black bear sighting in my neighborhood two days ago - Just a little guy, but the reality is that they are re-populating our area - I hike alone in our 40 acre gorge proerty a lot and usually have my 45 acp only, so I hope that would do the job if so be needed.

Here's our local newlink: http://observertoday.com/page/content.detail/id/507511.html

 

[Magnum Wheel Man]

while those pics of those "starred out hollow points" are impressive... they are the last thing I'd look at for shooting something ( any large animal capable of thick hide, & a matted wooly coat )... you'll likely get next to nothing for penitration shooting any of those bullets pictured at a bear...

my personal choice is a Ruger Alaskan... mine is in 454 Casull... but only because I already have a 44 mag snubbie... I could use a good 45 Colt cartridge in the Alaskan if recoil were a problem for me... but I shoot my Alaskan pretty good with Cassul ammo in it... speaking of 45 Colt... my Montado would also be a good choice...otherwise if you are more comfortable with an auto... the switch to 10mm... might be a better option...

 

[dairycreek]

I just love it when one of the so called "experts" say that a .40 S&W or a 45ACP should be "just right" for a 200 lb. black bear. A shot to the head should be right on with one of these calibers. BALONEY!!!!!:barf:

Folks who say this been spending too much time reading the net and have not been face to face with a real black bear in the wilderness.

First, black bears are, more than likely, going to run the other way when in they come in contact with humans in the woods. In 98% of my encounters with black bears they ran away as fast as they could. But not always!

Get between a mother and her cub (it is quite easy to do) and mama bear will try her best to deal harshly with the intruding human. She will not run the other way she will run right at you. The one time I had this happen I climbed a tree and waited for her and her cub to leave the scene.

Once I came face to face with a sick, fallow, female who (it turned out) had inflamed gums and teeth. She weighed in about 300 pounds and she was coming for me. I can remember that her head was down low and swinging from side to side. No head shot there.

I finally shot her with a Ruger 44 magnum and down she went.

Based on personal experience if a handgun it must be used the largest, biggest bullet thrower you can carry. 44 mag, hot 45LC, or even a 454 can probably do the job. Use anything smaller and, believe me, you are taking a king sized risk if the bear decides you are on its agenda.

 

[kayakersteve]

Dairy creek

I know your right about that. I have the 460V and can carry that, but its not practical when out for hike or just hanging out in the woods. That's when I carry my 45 acp. I know the chance of a violent encounter is low, but I would give it my best with my 45 acp if needed to. Might save the last round for me, if needed though!
Wonder if I should add amagazine of hard cast 45 acp to my mag pouch?? That might incraese my chance of success.. Wonder if I could change it in time when she was running at me waving her head back and forth???

I guess I could just put the hard cast mag inwhen i'm in the woods?!

 

[azredhawk44]

while those pics of those "starred out hollow points" are impressive... they are the last thing I'd look at for shooting something ( any large animal capable of thick hide, & a matted wooly coat )... you'll likely get next to nothing for penitration shooting any of those bullets pictured at a bear...

Those pics that LanceOregon provided were from a friend of his that hunted black bear and had bearskin rugs all over his den. The guy said he used .45acp hydrashocks to do his bear hunting.

Wouldn't be my choice either even if I limited myself to 45acp, but facts is facts.

According to the anecdotal evidence of LanceOregon, hydrashocks will bearhunt for blackies successfully, and were the desired bullet for 1 known bear hunter.

 

[skoro]

I just love it when one of the so called "experts" say that a .40 S&W or a 45ACP should be "just right" for a 200 lb. black bear. A shot to the head should be right on with one of these calibers. BALONEY!!!!!

And I just love it when a self-proclaimed bear authority comes in preaching that nothing less that a .44 magnum will deter a black bear.

I've been up close and personal with black bears while out camping/hiking on two occasions. As a matter of fact one of them was in Canada, where I DID inadvertently get between a mother and two small cubs. She angled around me and I backed off quickly while the cubs went up a tree. She sat at the base of the tree and grunted and they came back down. My heart was racing, I can tell ya, but she didn't exhibit any aggressive behavior.

The second time I was camping in New Mexico. There was a large dumpster at the campground. One night I took a bag of trash over to toss it in and got a big shock - a big male jumped out and scrambled about 15 feet up the hill and then stopped to check me out. I started to slowly back away and he took off running the opposite direction. But it was another adrenaline moment.

I wasn't armed in either case. And I was lucky in both times. It could have ended badly for me, for certain. But blackies just don't tend to be aggressive towards humans.

In your situation, that bear was no doubt sizing you up for dinner, and you were right to put her down.

All I'm saying about a .40 S&W is that caliber should cause a blackie to turn tail and head the opposite direction if it takes a body hit. I'm not advocating the pistol as a hunting round. It's obviously not suited and neither is a 45 ACP. But I think that caliber would be an effective deterrent, too. Not a bear killer, but a bear punisher.

These days, if I'm out in the boonies in bear country, I carry my 1911 and I hope I never need to use it. On a bear or anything else. But if I do, I feel like it'll be adequate.

If I was in grizzly country, I think I'd want a grenade launcher with a 12 ga full of slugs as a back-up. Whole different ball game.

We cool?

 

[Adventurer 2]

I've seen several black bears while camping/hiking. Some monstrous ones in WA (over 400 lbs). I had never been bothered by one until a trip in Colorado. I had a black bear charge at me - it was amazing to see something that big move so fast - he was doing over 30 mph and it was instantaneous - no getting up to speed. No fear because I was in a vehicle with the accelarator floored. That got me really thinking about all of the other bears I had seen in my life. They get a lot more room from me now.

 

[john in jax]

If my life was on the line I'd sign up for as much "over-kill" as I could comfortable CC. I think a 3" .44 mag by either Ruger or S&W would offer a great amount of firepower but would be fat/bulky and heavy. You might consider a Glock 29 or some other mid-size 10mm and load it with a heavy duty cast or JSP hunting load from Buffalo Bore, Core Bon or Double Tap.