Thoughts on "survival rifles"

[MarkCO]

Thus, I have chosen a .223 bolt for myself.

That is cool and all, but given the matter, you might want to consider getting an action, barrel, stock and trigger assembly to go with the bolt.

If someone came to my door and said "Put one gun with ammo, one knife, one set of binos and some clothes and paracord in a bag and lets get gone forever" I know exactly which gun I would choose. My S&W 657. I can shoot 6 shots into 6" at 100 yards in 10 seconds. I can hit a man sized target at 200 yards 1 for 1. I have killed grouse, rabbits, deer, and elk with it, plus 4 rattlers with one dose of birdshot each. Plus, the maintenance is low. If you know how, other cartridges can be "de-milled" and made into passable revolver fodder if needed.

The 657 is a .41 magnum, but any 44 Mag or 45 Colt can do the same things. It is portable, concealable, accurate deployable under a wide range of circumstances, and it handles a wide range of ammo. From 800 to 1500 fps with JHPs, solids and birdshot.

If you let me choose 2...then it might take some thinking to choose the best two, but one is easy, a magnum revolver for sure. A Henry Mare's leg is about the only weapon that I think would be better, but I don't have one yet.

 

[osirus82]

curious how many people a have chosen their go to survival gun.. So the question has to be asked- how many of you folks actually have (that great survival rifle?)

If i had to choose one that I do own I think i would take my Sub2K glock .40-- it accepts other glock mags - 30 rounders- it folds up-- it fits inside a camleback with plenty of room for ammo-and mags, Its like 5lbs fully loaded- and is super accurate.

I did have other gun options like sig522 .22 with 25 round mags, or Fnar .308 with 5-20 round mags, or 12g semi or pump.

that innogun hybrid looks great= wonder how many thousands it is. id buy one.

 

[Deja vu]

This is my opinion but a survival rifle will likely be used to get food in hostial territory. I think some thing quiet (suppressed) is very important.

Mine is a suppressed 22lr or a suppressed 45-70 (yes I have both) I also think its good that they dont looks like (evil) black tactical riles that draw attention but look more like your grandfathers hunting rifle.

The other survival gun I thing would work well is a 12ga. I doubt any other gun can put food on the table like a 12ga.

 

[Boomer58cal]

I also thing its good that they dont looks like (evil) black tactical riles that draw attention but look more like your grandfathers hunting rifle.

Before SHTF you're probably right, But once its hit the fan I'd much rather have the fear factor of a 30 round mag. The media has condition the average person to fear evil black rifles and I think that should be used to your advantage.

In this day in age people are much more deterred by a group of guys with AK's than a couple guys with ther grandpa's deer rifles.

If you really think a wood stock would help then I'd get an SKS or a hunting variant of the saiga with a wood stock. They maintain most of the advantages of getting yourself an AK but without the evil black features. Heck you could even throw a 5 round mag in you're saiga if it makes you feel better.

Just my thoughts.

Boomer

 

[Colt46]

I've got ther Marlin 'Papoose'

It floats(if stowed in the case), is lightweight, accurate, compact(takedown) and you can carry a lot of .22lr to go with it. It's a short range small game getter(medium game if you get close and pick your shots), and will be acceptable for defense against people as well.
I wouldn't really think it was optimal in dangerous game country, but will feed you in just about any rural or backwoods environment out there.

 

[armoredman]

PeetaH has it right.

I chose my rifle based on a few criteria - 1), I already owned it, which is important due to today's financial world. 2), I have a local buddy who is a world class gunsmith and tinkerer who loves making things work. 3), I already load for and cast bullets in this caliber, so practice is cheap and easy.




CZ 527M converted into the CSR, "Camp/Scout Rifle" with reinforced pistol grip stock including spare magazine holder and adjustable rear iron sight. Very light, accurate, and handy as all get out. There are others that probably fit the bill better for the "bug out" rifle, but like I said, I went with what i have/know.

 

[ThomasT]

curious how many people a have chosen their go to survival gun.. So the question has to be asked- how many of you folks actually have (that great survival rifle?)

Got it. My Marlin 1894 in 357 mag.

 

[CCCLVII]

I think being quiet is some thing that is often over looked here in the USA. I feel a silencer would be nearly as important as sights to a survival gun.

 

[MarkCO]

I agree quiet can be an important factor, and certainly, if you can afford the price of admission, worthwhile. Then again, in there is a total "collapse" having the necessary parts to suppress what you have might not be a bad idea.

Shotgun...too limited in speed, maintenance, distance and weight of ammo. Maybe in an Urban setting, but still, Book of Eli was still just a movie.

.22 rimfires, whether LR or Magnum, are not re-loadable nor weatherproof. However, a magazine fed integrally suppressed folding stock 3 pound .22 Magnum would certainly be high on the list of possibles. I think a .22RF pistol with a suppressor is probably the best choice for a second gun if you afford yourself the luxury. You can carry like 5K rounds as compared to 100 12 gauge.

When I look at ARs, I really like pistol configured 300 Blackouts with a SIG cuff and a suppressor.

But, if you really only have one, a Mares leg, Revolver or lever gun in .41 mag, .44 Mag or .45 colt has so many advantages, it is hard to find a better alternative, especially if you have a suppressor. .357 Magnum is certainly beyond some of the other options people fall in love with, and I would be happy with one of those too.

 

[ThomasT]

22 rimfires, whether LR or Magnum, are not re-loadable nor weatherproof. However, a magazine fed integrally suppressed folding stock 3 pound .22 Magnum would certainly be high on the list of possibles. I think a .22RF pistol with a suppressor is probably the best choice for a second gun if you afford yourself the luxury. You can carry like 5K rounds as compared to 100 12 gauge.

MarkCo I think suppressed and 22 mag are at odds to each other. The 22 mag with a 40gr bullet gets an average velocity of 1900fps and sometimes a little more. The lighter weight bullets are of course faster. If you want a suppressed gun a 22LR will always be the best bet over a 22 mag. I like the one shot theory. That is its hard to tell where a single shot comes from.

In a deer camp I was in many years ago I took a shot at a turkey with a 22 mag rifle on the backside of a hill near our camp. I missed the bird. But when I got back to camp I asked if anyone heard me shoot. Not one single person heard the shot. And the actual distance from the camp was not more than 300 yards. And they were all sitting outside around a campfire. So depending on terrain a suppressor is not always needed.

As far as being water proof the 22 RF rounds only have one opening. Thats the case mouth. a 22LR may be a loose fit but 22mags are really a tight fit. Plus if thats an issue a quick dip in fingernail polish or something should seal the rounds. Or maybe just store them ai zip lock baggies in 100 count packs.

I like these type of threads. They were the first I responded to when I joined the gun forums. And like Art pointed out in post #3 each situation dictates the best rifle. There will never be a one gun does it all situation.

Like I posted earlier I could get by with a leveraction 357 rifle. Throw in a .410 single shot shotgun and I am good to go.

 

[Omaha-BeenGlockin]

Depending on the situation

.30-06 bolt gun
AR15
10/22

Just cause its what I have

 

[ronl]

If I were to choose one it would have to be a lightweight AR-15. The versatility, dependability, and availability of ammo, plus the inherent accuracy all add up to a winner for me. It is much more capable of dealing with various situations one might face as compared to a bolt action.

 

[dakota.potts]

I think I'd have to say an AR-15. I don't know of another round that can adequately kill squirrels and other small game but also take deer. I bet it could also easily take a snake or even a gator, common things in my area. It would give me more comfort than a .22 for defense against people. I had thought about 12G or 20G. With that you can have buckshot, birdshot, slugs, and even flare rounds. But you could carry maybe 25-50 of each?

A .22 handgun would compliment a primary weapon very nicely.

 

[44 AMP]

Survival rifle?

I think I'd have to say an AR-15. I don't know of another round that can adequately kill squirrels and other small game but also take deer.

I can. In fact, everything from .22LR on up can do it. What differs is the range you are able to use, and how much work you have to do.

Lets get a few things straight, just what kind of "survivial" are you thinking about? We don't do the "zombie apok-key-clips" here, nor TEOTWAWKI threads, so count those out right now.

SO, what is left? Two basic situations. One, survival in the wilderness. Two, survival in civilization without basic law & order and food distribution services in your local area. (like a hurricane aftermath).

Now, both of these things have one big thing in common, they are TEMPORARY.

People who choose one gun & caliber, based on what ammo is commonly available on the shelf , (such as choosing a .223 over a .22 Hornet, for instance) are missing a vital point. And that is that in a survival situation, NO AMMO IS AVAILABLE. All there is that you can count on is what you already have. PERIOD.

SO, everything is "available" right now, and nothing will be available in a disaster/lost in the wilderness situation. Think you are going to go to the local store and get some ammo in a survival situation? Think again.

People who choose a caliber based on the weight of the ammo MAY have a point, but realistically speaking, how much ammo are you going to need? HOW LONG do you think you are going to be in a survival situation? A week? possible, a month? highly unlikely.

But lets say a month, and lets say you're a lousy hunter and you need 3 shots average to bag a rabbit, or whatever. 100rnds will cover that for a month. Should cover that more than adequately, considering you aren't likely to be shooting every day. One deer will feed you for several days, even under totally primitive conditions, of course there will be a large wastage, and you might not like what you have to eat, but survival isn't a sport or a game. And, really, a month isn't realistic, unless you cannot move, and if you cannot move, hunting becomes a real problem.

Some have suggested silencers. While not needing earplugs is a nice benefit, why on earth would you need to be silent? Most folks, lost in the wilderness would be pretty glad to be found by someone (again, forget the evil hordes of whatever). Why would you need to hide?

One place where I can see a use for a large capacity repeater would be defense against a pack of wolves, or feral dogs. And a handgun will fill that role pretty well.

Several have spoken against the shotgun, mostly because of the weight of the ammo. Again, same things apply, how much you gonna need, do you think? Two boxes of 12 ga are a fair bit, but again, if you aren't stupid, (and assuming there is game to be taken), you are going to be returning to civilization (or it to you) at some level before you have shot up all of it.

Wilderness survival means more than just food. And for getting food, snares and general woodcraft go further than ever a good rifle. Also, where are you having to survive? A rifle & ammo are more useful in the woods than the desert.

And if its sitting home, waiting for the power to come back on, and worried about looters, etc. That is a different situation.

 

[MarkCO]

You make some very valuable points. My initial post was more of a "One gun for the rest of your life" thing, but the probability is certainly low that occurrence would ever happen.

I did spend 3 weeks in the wilderness with a .22 Ruger pistol and I actually ate pretty well. I took 200 rounds and only used 25. An acquaintance spends 3-6 months in the wilderness each year and the stuff he uses is interesting. He has a 4.5" 45 Colt, a longbow, a spear and a few knives. I contemplated to utility of a crossbow for this mythical role for a while.

Suppressors, they work on any firearm. Sure, to "silence" sub-sonic is needed, but they cut out a LOT on supersonic rounds. They accurize and reduce recoil some as well. I have used them hunting and well, the benefit is pretty significant. I have shot several animals with them where their "friends" just took a look and went back to grazing, or chipping pine cones or whatever. Call it kinder, gentler harvesting of game. There is a lot of value, especially if you need to harvest multiple animals at a time, makes it easy.

The only really major issue if you really want to pick out one gun, is to have it in a pack, with ammo, and other survival gear, while you are out in the woods camping, hunting, ATVing, etc, or stored in your mode of transportation. For most people, water, meds and hygiene deficiency are going to get them well before any zombies.

 

[SIGSHR]

I agree-no one size fits all. A 22LR is fine for rabbits or squirrels but relying too much on rabbit for survival food is not healthy. really depends on the terrain and climate. The AR-7s I have handled felt crude, sights a little too simple.

 

[TXAZ]

I'd take an under folder AK, full sized semi (9mm and up) semi-auto pistol, over a .22 "Survival" rifle any day. If I instance outlay need to survive, man any of those carrying a .22 Survival rifles won't.

 

[dakota.potts]

My 9mm handgun and .22 bolt action would probably see me through unless we're talking really nasty times. I would still pick an AR-15 if I could pick any gun, but the two guns I already have will do me fine if it comes down to it.

This thread reminds me that I need more .22 ammo.

 

[osirus82]

I think people that have their CCW's and carry are way ahead of the game if some unknown disaster happened, they already have a means of survival and protection.

 

[simonrichter]

@ MarkCO

a ".223 bolt ACTION", of course.