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The squibb that won't come out
- Thread starter HighValleyRanch
- Start date
bamaranger
New member
success
Hey..........good for you!
I note the inscription of " no less than 120 gr bullet weight" on the ejector shroud. That seems most interesting and I wonder if whatever engineering issue (sleeved barrel?) requiring that warning contributed to your (solved!!!!) problem?
Hey..........good for you!
I note the inscription of " no less than 120 gr bullet weight" on the ejector shroud. That seems most interesting and I wonder if whatever engineering issue (sleeved barrel?) requiring that warning contributed to your (solved!!!!) problem?
HighValleyRanch
New member
44 AMP, I did freeze it and try to knock it out, but it did not work. But I only left it in for a few hours, but it was frozen cold.
The 120 grain or higher only applies to .357 magnum, not .38 special +P so that wasn't a contributing factor.
Yes, I will just hold tight for the crane screw to try firing it. No need to press my luck.
Just happy that it's all whole again!
I am sure that someone in the future is going to have this happen to them, so that is my reasoning behind an extensive writeup on these forums so that others can benefit from this procedure.
The 120 grain or higher only applies to .357 magnum, not .38 special +P so that wasn't a contributing factor.
Yes, I will just hold tight for the crane screw to try firing it. No need to press my luck.
Just happy that it's all whole again!
I am sure that someone in the future is going to have this happen to them, so that is my reasoning behind an extensive writeup on these forums so that others can benefit from this procedure.
Driftwood Johnson
New member
The bullet is solid copper?
Why?
Stick to lead, or copper jacketed lead.
Why?
Stick to lead, or copper jacketed lead.
Stick to lead, or copper jacketed lead.
Why?
HighValleyRanch
New member
LeHigh's all copper defense bullet design has had great testing results:
"The nose design is the key. The Fluid Transfer’s radial flutes force the hydraulic energy inward and then as the energy is restricted, it accelerates outward creating high pressure spikes severely damaging surrounding tissue. This very rapid increase in fluid flow creates cavitation and massive tissue damage away from the projectile equivalent to those of the best hollow points on the market. The result of the Xtreme Defense is a permanent wound cavity that is two to four times greater than what a flat or round nose bullet generates and often larger than traditional or solid copper expanding bullets."
So no need for hollow point expansion, which the .38 special is borderline on.
"The nose design is the key. The Fluid Transfer’s radial flutes force the hydraulic energy inward and then as the energy is restricted, it accelerates outward creating high pressure spikes severely damaging surrounding tissue. This very rapid increase in fluid flow creates cavitation and massive tissue damage away from the projectile equivalent to those of the best hollow points on the market. The result of the Xtreme Defense is a permanent wound cavity that is two to four times greater than what a flat or round nose bullet generates and often larger than traditional or solid copper expanding bullets."
So no need for hollow point expansion, which the .38 special is borderline on.
Jim Watson
New member
Wow, straight from the advertising agency.
Light fast bullets in a light gun are subject to inertia pulling.
I note the inscription of " no less than 120 gr bullet weight" on the ejector shroud. That seems most interesting and I wonder if whatever engineering issue (sleeved barrel?) requiring that warning contributed to your (solved!!!!) problem?
Light fast bullets in a light gun are subject to inertia pulling.
Bob Wright
New member
For removing bore obstruxtionc, I always use a steel rod slightly smalleer that bore diameter and wrapped with duct tape. The thicker the diameter the rod, the better.
Bob Wright
Bob Wright
oldmanFCSA
New member
I know I'm going to be screamed at but here goes ......
Load another cartridge with primer and powder - stop - carefully load cartridge into firearm vertically, close cylinder, aim to a safe place and pull the trigger. It should come out or at least move. If it moved, repeat process until out.
We learned this process the hard way with squibs in our 50BMG target rifles. If shooting a Hornady Amax you cannot drive it out from front (don't ask how I know) because the aluminum tip expands copper out into bore (Had to drill it out of center of a 38" long barrel).
A good friend showed a bunch of us how to pull a projectile and load the powdered cartridge carefully into chamber, point in safe direction, and BOOM - it came out. This time it was a 795 grain brass solid projectile on another persons rifle.
My squib was caused by a wet case (wet tumbling) that somehow got missed in drying process (process changed now). Primer and a partial burn pushed 750 grain Amax far into bore. Upon ejecting case, clumps of unburned powder dumped out.
Y.M.M.V.
Load another cartridge with primer and powder - stop - carefully load cartridge into firearm vertically, close cylinder, aim to a safe place and pull the trigger. It should come out or at least move. If it moved, repeat process until out.
We learned this process the hard way with squibs in our 50BMG target rifles. If shooting a Hornady Amax you cannot drive it out from front (don't ask how I know) because the aluminum tip expands copper out into bore (Had to drill it out of center of a 38" long barrel).
A good friend showed a bunch of us how to pull a projectile and load the powdered cartridge carefully into chamber, point in safe direction, and BOOM - it came out. This time it was a 795 grain brass solid projectile on another persons rifle.
My squib was caused by a wet case (wet tumbling) that somehow got missed in drying process (process changed now). Primer and a partial burn pushed 750 grain Amax far into bore. Upon ejecting case, clumps of unburned powder dumped out.
Y.M.M.V.
We learned this process the hard way with squibs in our 50BMG target rifles. If shooting a Hornady Amax you cannot drive it out from front (don't ask how I know) because the aluminum tip expands copper out into bore (Had to drill it out of center of a 38" long barrel).
Do you use the same amount of powder that was in the original load?
Glad you got it out, High Valley...how's it shoot now?
I'll relate this experience with squib loads:
In 1967, I was the range director while qualifying new USAFA cadets using the then standard issue S&W M-15 revolver. On our firing line we had over 50 points and a range officer for every ten or so new cadets as most of them had never fired a handgun before and safety was the prime focus.
The ammunition then was issued Remington, .38 Special, 130 gr FMJ's, and we loaded with five rounds as standard practice. Cadets were cautioned to raise a hand if there were any problems encountered.
At one point, one of the new cadets signaled a stoppage and our line range officer took the revolver and noted about 1/2 of a round nose, FMJ sticking out of the barrel muzzle and also that he was unable to open the cylinder.
We called in the range gunsmith and he found that the cylinder/forcing cone gap was blocked by a bullet. Taking the gun back to his work shed, he padded the vice, clamped the barrel in its jaws and used a steel drift to pound the protruding bullet back down the barrel.
With some care and a lot of hammering, he cleared the cylinder gap and opened the cylinder. The bullet that had blocked the gap was free in the chamber and fell out as he opened it. The other four were still in the barrel and he proceeded to pound them back through the forcing cone.
The theory we came up with was that the first round was a squib, and the inexperienced shooter did not recognize the lack of recoil and fired the rest of the loads, one after another. Each moved the preceding bullet a little farther down the barrel till the squib was left protruding at the muzzle.
The gun appeared to be unharmed after this rough treatment, with neither bore damage nor problems with the lock up et. al. After some discussion, we reloaded it with six rounds and fired off a rest at 25 yds getting the usual 3-4" group; about average for that military issue ammunition.
The pressures, we guessed, had been dissipated through the cylinder/forcing cone gap before any barrel damage ensued. One benefit, not often noted, of a revolver vs. an auto.
In another instance, my #2 son, once had a squib while firing a series of double tap drills with a Colt Series 70, .45 ACP. He recalled that the squib felt about normal, but the following round definitely had more recoil; and he stopped firing at that point. On inspection, the barrel was partially out of the locking hubs, and the slide/bbl. assembly couldn't be disassembled normally.
A gunsmith removed the bulged barrel with considerable pounding and replaced it, as well as the link & bushing. No damage was found to the frame, however. With the same target loads (200 gr LSWC's and a moderate load of Win 231), the formerly superbly accurate gun was just as good and every bit as reliable.
Best regards, Rod
I'll relate this experience with squib loads:
In 1967, I was the range director while qualifying new USAFA cadets using the then standard issue S&W M-15 revolver. On our firing line we had over 50 points and a range officer for every ten or so new cadets as most of them had never fired a handgun before and safety was the prime focus.
The ammunition then was issued Remington, .38 Special, 130 gr FMJ's, and we loaded with five rounds as standard practice. Cadets were cautioned to raise a hand if there were any problems encountered.
At one point, one of the new cadets signaled a stoppage and our line range officer took the revolver and noted about 1/2 of a round nose, FMJ sticking out of the barrel muzzle and also that he was unable to open the cylinder.
We called in the range gunsmith and he found that the cylinder/forcing cone gap was blocked by a bullet. Taking the gun back to his work shed, he padded the vice, clamped the barrel in its jaws and used a steel drift to pound the protruding bullet back down the barrel.
With some care and a lot of hammering, he cleared the cylinder gap and opened the cylinder. The bullet that had blocked the gap was free in the chamber and fell out as he opened it. The other four were still in the barrel and he proceeded to pound them back through the forcing cone.
The theory we came up with was that the first round was a squib, and the inexperienced shooter did not recognize the lack of recoil and fired the rest of the loads, one after another. Each moved the preceding bullet a little farther down the barrel till the squib was left protruding at the muzzle.
The gun appeared to be unharmed after this rough treatment, with neither bore damage nor problems with the lock up et. al. After some discussion, we reloaded it with six rounds and fired off a rest at 25 yds getting the usual 3-4" group; about average for that military issue ammunition.
The pressures, we guessed, had been dissipated through the cylinder/forcing cone gap before any barrel damage ensued. One benefit, not often noted, of a revolver vs. an auto.
In another instance, my #2 son, once had a squib while firing a series of double tap drills with a Colt Series 70, .45 ACP. He recalled that the squib felt about normal, but the following round definitely had more recoil; and he stopped firing at that point. On inspection, the barrel was partially out of the locking hubs, and the slide/bbl. assembly couldn't be disassembled normally.
A gunsmith removed the bulged barrel with considerable pounding and replaced it, as well as the link & bushing. No damage was found to the frame, however. With the same target loads (200 gr LSWC's and a moderate load of Win 231), the formerly superbly accurate gun was just as good and every bit as reliable.
Best regards, Rod
Last edited:
Recycled bullet
New member
I really like your homemade frame vise I keep looking at it
HighValleyRanch
New member
Rodfac,
I am waiting on the replacement crane screw before attempting to shoot it, but fairly sure that it will be fine as I checked the lockup and the condition of the barrel liner and all looks perfect.
I'm keeping that frame jig for future use. That way it won't happen again, because as everyone knows, If I threw it away, it dang sure to be another squibb again!
I am waiting on the replacement crane screw before attempting to shoot it, but fairly sure that it will be fine as I checked the lockup and the condition of the barrel liner and all looks perfect.
I'm keeping that frame jig for future use. That way it won't happen again, because as everyone knows, If I threw it away, it dang sure to be another squibb again!
101combatvet
New member
Loaded up some LeHigh Defense 130 grain. Their site stated 5.5 to start with HP38. Measured up 5 grains on a digital scale to start. I know that there was powder because I only loaded 2 and weighed each one.
Could you please let me know why you loaded it to 5 grains when the data mentioned starting at 5.5 grains?
Could you please let me know why you loaded it to 5 grains when the data mentioned starting at 5.5 grains?
Can't speak for the OP but my guess would be he used the old time rule of reducing starting load by 10%, just in case.
There are some powders that the maker /load testers will tell you NOT to reduce the starting load. I don't think HP-38 is one of them.
101combatvet
New member
Okay. I've never heard of anyone doing that.Can't speak for the OP but my guess would be he used the old time rule of reducing starting load by 10%, just in case.
There are some powders that the maker /load testers will tell you NOT to reduce the starting load. I don't think HP-38 is one of them.
Aguila Blanca
Staff
I think that's a misstatement of the rule. The way I have always seen it, it's to reduce the maximum load by 10% to get a starting load. I have never heard of any "rule" calling for reducing a starting load.44 AMP said:Can't speak for the OP but my guess would be he used the old time rule of reducing starting load by 10%, just in case.
HighValleyRanch
New member
I had just loaded some 158 grain Berrys round nose as low as 3.6 W231. HP-38 and W231 are noted to be very close, so going down to 5 grains should not have caused a squib load.
I believe now that the cause of the squibb was not tight enough of a crimp.
I believe now that the cause of the squibb was not tight enough of a crimp.