Ordered my 1851 .36 Navy today and ...

[Remington kid]

Steve, If you want to try any wads in that .36 I just found out out that a .40 caseing is perfect for a cookie cutter for the .36. I'm sure you have a few empty casesing's for a .40 laying around Don't be affraid to smack it hard with a hammer to do the cutting.

Kevin is lucky, he had some guy give him a perfect cutter for his .31
The #10 CCI you sent me Kevin are perfect for this Navy! Thanks again, Mike

 

[MPP1423]

i sure was mike,he's one hell of a guy!lol

 

[MPP1423]

well,dixie is sending me my hand out today.they are real easy to work with.i still have two more coming from vti so i should be able to keep my .31 going unless something else goes wrong.

 

[Remington kid]

Kevin, Get rid of any bugers and burs on that new hand before you install it and it may make life a little easier for you.
Got the casting down perfect now! A guy who has been doing it for years gave me some tips and boy was he right! The balls look great and the wrinkles are gone. In the past few days I have casted almost 700 balls already paid for this set Lee lead pot and molds. The lead was free and I have more coming. Now I don't have to drive a 110 miles round trip to get balls. There is a Mom and Pop store in who are going to carry the Pyrodex "P", Remington #10 and CCI #10 for me. They talked to there BP salesman Friday and he said no problem. This is going to be great!

 

[MPP1423]

yea,as long as i keep the mould and lead real hot they come out good.i have never cast any round balls before just conicals.

 

[Remington kid]

Kevin, The next molds I get will be the conical for both of these revolvers. If I can get the conicals to come out half as good as yours I will be a happy shooter.
I shot a 200g. conical out of my .44 Remington with 40g of Pyredex "P" and almost broke my ear drum! Anyone around me would have thought I was shooting a .44 mag! I kid you not, I had to go back in my shop and get my ear protectors on.
They say you can load equal amounts of pyredex to your goex loads by volume but after that cylinder full I don't believe it It actually raised both of my wrist a foot straight up with each shot but it hit right where I was pointing.

 

[MPP1423]

well mike,
i would think the heavier bullet would build up more preasure than a round ball at least thats what it seems like in my 58.there is more ft pounds down range as well i beleive.those 200 gr conicals of mine thump real hard!!

 

[Remington kid]

Yep, The heavy bullet makes a big difference but .40g of pyrodex does not equal 40g of Goex by any stretch of the imagination. It may equal the Swiss as it has always been hotter than Goex. I do know one thing for sure...I would not want to be on the recieveing end of your conical!

 

[Low Key]

Mike, How much does the pyrodex p compress under the rammer as compared to goex? I've shot some pyro RS, (same as ffg BP) and it compressed really well under the ball.

 

[Remington kid]

Kevin, I can only compair it to Goex. 40 g. of Goex and a 1/8" wad with one of your conicals will not work . If I leave the wad out it will allow the the conical to be seated just below the chambers mouth by really hauling down on the loading lever. If I use 40g of Pyrodex,1/8" wad and your conical it will seat fairly easy with the top of the conical sitting well over 1/8" below the chamber mouth.

 

[Low Key]

I kinda thought that the pyrodex was a little easier to compress than goex, but I didn't know if it was just me or if it really does compress easier. I had also wondered if the granulation is what made the difference since I have fffg goex and the pyrodex I have used is equivalent to ffg (its actually what I use in my rifle) but you answered all that for me, thanks!
After I shoot up what remains of my 777, I'll be buying some pyrodex p to try out 40gr under the ball. Big BOOM! Lot's of fun!

 

[Remington kid]

Low Key. Make sure you wear ear protection. I'm not jokeing when I say it's like shooting my .44 black Hawk

 

[Low Key]

COOL! I do always wear ear protection and am a big believer in doing so. I damaged my hearing at the gun range when I was about 16 yrs old and my ears ring all the time ever since. (Everyone reading this please take note...don't shoot without hearing protection, you'll regret it)
But I still like the big boom you can feel in your chest when you shoot.

 

[Old Dragoon]

And I thought my '58 with 40 grns of BP was loud...even with my ears on.

 

[Wayner]

"51" Navy Colt

Like readin about a guy gettin a new gun. Tunin and slickin and such.Got a question for Steve499. Why do you want a gun with the chambers smaller than the grooves? Fouling and the subsequent shots thru the fouling? I wonder if Remington Kid has any problem with the heavy trigger/bolt spring of the Pietta and the soft cylinder metal and dangs and deformation from the bolt head hitting the cylinder notches. First thing I do before cycling the action of a Pietta is take it apart enough to loosen the trigger/bolt spring so as to adjust it lighter sos it won't make those dangs in the cylinder that look ugly and make the action rough as a cobblestone road. Second thing I do with any new cap&ball revolver is to take a small bright flashlight and look into the muzzle as I draw back the hammer and look for misalignment of the chambers to the bore(grooves in the barrel). The reflection of the light can show where the cylinder face is showing in the grooves and sometimes as high as the lands and beyond. Chamber alignment to the grooves of the barrel is a good indicator of how accurate the gun can be. Good alignment is good for accuracy.If the alignment is out some then that can be "adjusted". If the alignment of some chambers is good and others not then a new cylinder is needed. If the misalignment is too far off then it's too much trouble to fix and if the gun is new it should go back to the store. If the misalignment is just a little off then that can be adjusted.I don't read much about people checking the alignment of the chambers to the grooves of the barrel with new guns. I wonder why. Since the chambers are smaller than the groove dimension of the barrels on "most" cap&ball guns there will always be a little cylinder face reflecting in each groove in the barrel and it should be equal in each groove. Gotta look close. I just ordered a Pietta 1851 Colt Navy from Cabelas and sent it back. The alignment of the chambers to the barrel grooves was too far off to make it worth fixin on a new gun. The bolt head,even after being adjusted to strike the cylinder ramps as light as possible,danged the ramps right near the edge of the cylinder notches after only a few cycles and deformed metal into the notch sos the bolt didn't fully engage the notch to lock the cylinder into battery. Everything else on the gun was beautiful. Nice looking gun.I liked the way Pietta bottoms the arbor in the barrels arbor hole just right. The gun I got had bolt problems where it rides the cam on the hammer and I had to file a little to get the bolt to snap back onto the top of the cam sos the next chamber could be brought to the barrels breech. There were burrs here and there that I smoothed up and the action was smooth after that. The wedge was jammed in the gun like a hinge on a door to the vault at FT. Knox. I'm convinced that Pietta uses a slight bit of metal deformation to attain a good fit of the wedge in it's place in the barrel/arbor. Anyhow machining burrs in the arbor slot was one reason the wedge was so difficult to remove the first time. Smoothed them up too. What I didn't like was the fact that three Pietta cylinders(one in the gun,a spare that I ordered and one from my other new Pietta "51" Navy) were all out of alignment exactly the same amount with this gun. That tells me the cylinders are machined very close in tolerances and what I didn't like was that all three being out the same amount meant the frame window for the bolt head was off a good bit with this gun. Well I guess I'll wait a few weeks for the replacement to come back to me. Crap. See yas Buds.

 

[pohill]

Lots of good info there, Wayner. Cabelas should pay attention.

 

[Steve499]

Wayner, I wrote that wrong!! I was thinking to say the chambers were LARGER than the groove diameter on the pocket navy by Uberti but I said it backwards. I have a problem with buying a revolver which has the chamber diameter smaller than the groove diameter, seems to me that's the first step to accuracy that you can take before you buy if the dimensions are given. I know a lot of revolvers seem to shoot fine with the chamber diameter smaller than the grooves but I don't see how.

I always do the light down the barrel as the cylinder is turned to check for alignment. The Pietta 1858 Remington I have had one chamber that was off just the slightest amount. The Uberti pocket navy had all five chambers lined up perfectly. I had a Palmetto that was so mis-aligned I would have been afraid to shoot it! It went back.

Steve

 

[Remington kid]

Wayner, The remingtons have been my favorite for many years now and have never found any of the problems you mention above and I bought my Remingtons and my 51 Colt from Cabelas. I did have to smooth up the action on them and other things that I did to them was something I would have done to any reproduction guns. Chamfered the loading ramps on them as well as the cylinder mouths, chamfered the the outside edge of the nipples on all four cylinders and the extra 24 nipples I have.Lightened the trigger pull and the hammer springs so that they run super smooth. Dovetailed front sights.
As I said above , not all of this was something that had to be done , just wanted them to be to my personal liking. I have four cylinders that I can switch between the two Remingtons and they all line up perfectly
When I ordered my Remington's I also ordered two extra parts kits for both of them and have never had to replace a part and I shoot them constantly.

This new 51 that I bought from Cabelas could not be any nicer for fit and finish but I have reduced the trigger pull and hammer spring. The sight on this gun is point on and I wont have to change a thing. I was told that they raised there sights on the newer one's and this may be the case on this one. Acording to the letters on it , it was built in 2005.
So far I have only fired about 150 rounds from the Navy but have had zero problems with and I have relieved some of the metal on the frame by the hammer and a few other things and that really helped cure the cap in the works problem common with open tops. This by no means makes me think that I won't have problems down the line, anything is possiable.
A friend of mine has two Uberti Remingtons and has a lot of problems with one and no problem with the other. We still had to smooth up the action on both of them and the finish on them was no any better than my Pietta's. He paid way more than me for nothing.
When I'm are buying a reproduction revolver I don't expect it to have chrome blueing and the finish of a Weatherby but as you pointed out you want things to line up and work right and maybe I was just lucky with the Pietta's I bought from Cabelas but if that's the case, then so are many other guy's on this site and many others who are very happy with there Revolvers from Cabelas.

 

[mec]

I am pretty sure you new 51 has no alignment problems. That nice, round group you showed would do credit to a k-38. All of my present and recent Uberti .44s read .450" on the chamber mouths and land to land- could be off by .001 either way but the barrels and chambers are as close to that figure as I can measure.

I also got ideal measurments with two Pietta LeMats- though the dimensions were more like .447-448"
Also, all of the above have perfect alignment between barrel and individual chambers. I do have an unmarked Navy (no proofs, no maker, no nothing). the chambers are way out of line with the barrel but it will still group 3" or so at 50 feet.

 

[Remington kid]

Mec, Have you found that the Pyrodex will not tolerate any moister at all? The reason I ask is that I loaded my 51 last night with 25g Pyrodex "P" and then placed a dry wad over it with a little grease over the wad and then a 380 ball. Then I let it sit over night and planed to shoot it this morning.
Steped out on the back porch of my work shop and pulled the hammer and squeezed the trigger , just got a "POP". Sounded like a squib load but it did put a hole in the target so I tried the next one and got the same thing. On the last shot it was just a metalic "Pop" and then fire sizzled out between the barrel and the cylinder.
Took it back in the shop and tore it down. The barrel was full of half burnt powder in chunk form and a ball was stuck half way down the barrel. Got it cleaned up and there was no harm done at all.
The only thing I can figure is that the lube contaminated the powder through the felt wad after I compressed the ball and letting it sit all night. This is the way I have loaded many times useing Goex 3 F with no problems at all in my Remingtons even after sitting for several days.
Shot about 10 cylinders today from the 51 just to check it out and there was no problem at all when I loaded with the Pyro "P' ,wad, ball and grease over the ball.