New 1911 Just Got The Hiccups

[dahermit]

I clean it after every range trip and don't see any excess gunk anywhere.

One of the things that should be cleaned from time to time is the extractor tunnel. Because you did not know how to remove the extractor, that shows that you have not been cleaning it. The extractor has a bend in it and is in a sense, a spring. If shooting debris pack in there, it can cause extractor problems. Before sending the gun back to Colt, and waiting for who knows how long, clean the extractor tunnel (Q-tip),and shoot some more to test.

Just one more question out of curiosity, have you always loaded the chamber by racking the slide with a loaded magazine, or have you ever dropped a round in the chamber and let the slide close on the round? Just trying to get as much input as possible.

In all I am not convinced that it is your extractor. Under normal operation, the extractor does not snap over the rim of the round or have the opportunity of getting in front of it. If everything is working as it should, the rim of the round should come up into the notch on the extractor from underneath. Logically, even if the extractor were faulty, it is hard to envision the round getting in front of the extractor. Usually, if the round gets too far forward and is in front of the extractor, it is because the mechanics (strength of the mag spring, "dimple", on the follower) that are supposed to hold the rounds to the rear of the magazine has been defeated. Such a malfunction as you describe, especially on the last round, point to those possibilities. In any event, it will drive me nuts until you post what actually caused your problem...welcome to the wonderful (but often frustrating), world of 1911's.

 

[WVsig]

One of the things that should be cleaned from time to time is the extractor tunnel. Because you did not know how to remove the extractor, that shows that you have not been cleaning it. The extractor has a bend in it and is in a sense, a spring. If shooting debris pack in there, it can cause extractor problems. Before sending the gun back to Colt, and waiting for who knows how long, clean the extractor tunnel (Q-tip),and shoot some more to test.

250 rounds is not enough IHMO to foul the extractor tunnel. Yes the OP should learn to remove it but at this point in the life of the pistol a cleaning would not normally be necessary. I have not shot Freedom mutions ball but unless it was 5x dirtier than saw WWB there should not be enough debris to cause this failure. This does not mean it should not be inspected and cleaned.

With the new pic I am still sticking with a extractor issue as the cause of the problem. Clock, damage geometry, poor tension or debris.

Just one more question out of curiosity, have you always loaded the chamber by racking the slide with a loaded magazine, or have you ever dropped a round in the chamber and let the slide close on the round? Just trying to get as much input as possible.

I do not recommend this. It is a good way to damaging the hooks of the extractor. Every now and then is ok or in a emergency but not as standard practice again IMHO.

 

[dahermit]

250 rounds is not enough IHMO to foul the extractor tunnel. Yes the OP should learn to remove it but at this point in the life of the pistol a cleaning would not normally be necessary.

I agree...it should not be enough, but at this point, he should not be leaving any stone unturned. Strange things happen...there could be debris in the tunnel from the factory. By cleaning the tunnel, it eliminates one possibility not matter how unlikely. I do know for sure however, it isn't a dead squirrel in there.

 

[Crazy88Fingers]

I know dropping a round into the chamber is no good, and always load the gun via magazine. I'll try cleaning out the extractor tunnel before I give Colt a call, though I'm not very optimistic it will work.

*Edit : How is the extractor getting behind the casing in the first place? The extractor works fine when it's where it should be. So are the mags releasing that last round too soon?

 

[DAVID NANCARROW]

If the weapon ran well for 250 rounds and is now showing malfunctions, Id suspect dirt or fouling somewhere. Especially on a new, tight pistol. 22 RF bore brushes work very well, screwed into a GI type cleaning handle to clean the extractor tunnel.

If you have the Series 80 firing pin lock system, its slightly more involved in disassembling but not tough to overcome. I remove the slide from the frame, and while gently pushing down on the firing pin safety plunger, take a small punch and press in on the firing pin. Release pressure on the plunger and it will hold the firing pin forward so you can remove the firing pin stop. Then, put one hand over the back of the slide so the fp doesn't go flying behind the couch and depress the plunger. The firing pin will come out of its tunnel. Then remove the extractor from its tunnel.

Clean the firing pin, tunnel, extractor and extractor tunnel. Reassemble.

Fouling can get behind the extractor in the tunnel and keep it from moving outward, Its really a spring rather than a part which stays in its shape.

Make sure that your magazines are fairly clean. I don't use much lube at all on them. A slightly oily rag after you have brushed the inside is all that is needed. Make sure your follower is clean too before reassembling.

 

[polyphemus]

So are the mags releasing that last round too soon?

The breech face pushes the round a fraction of an inch depending on the
magazine guide lip configuration.When the magazine releases it the extractor
automatically engages,unless the the slide overrides the round the extractor is
always positioned where it belongs,in the round's extraction groove.
Your issue indicates a possible combination factors,including quality control.
You have written that you tried different magazines,unlikely but possible that
they all have weak springs,so that points straight at the extractor it could be
out of specs or need proper tension.You seem to want to troubleshoot it
yourself so:extra power springs for your factory mags,put the after market ones
on the shelf Colt makes pretty good ones.And if you have a good set of calipers
and a blueprint check the xtractor dimensions and then its tension even if you
buy a knew one the tension will be off.Please don't polish the feed ramp.

 

[AZAK]

One of the very best tools that you will ever purchase:

The Colt .45 automatic: A shop manual
by Jerry Kuhnhausen

Not inexpensive, yet if you have adopted 1911s (maybe not for life but until they at least turn 18, and let's face it how many 1911 folks only have one after a while) worth every greenback.

 

[Crazy88Fingers]

I had an epiphany this morning. This is an expensive damn gun, that I bought new, and has a warranty. So I called Colt and told them what's up. The guy on the line said "Huh, that's weird" (I'm guessing this doesn't happen often) and asked that I send it in so they could take a look at it. I have a free shipping label in my email and plan to ship it tomorrow.

I can do without it for a few weeks and let them scratch their heads. I'll post an update once I get it back. Thanks for all the feedback. I was hoping it would be a quick easy fix to a common problem. But it seemed to be turning into a headache I don't want from a new gun.

 

[grumpa72]

I am glad that Colt is helping out but I would still want to clean this down to nuts and bolts, so to speak. I would also use some high quality mags with no known issues. Then, if problems still persist, I would send it in.

Btw, this is a good video for the disassembly animation. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3A6xDvDNO9g . There is also a similar one for assembly. VERY useful, imo.

 

[polyphemus]

I have a free shipping label in my email and plan to ship it tomorrow.

Common sense.

 

[Crazy88Fingers]

I'd rather let Colt clean it, try new mags, and burn through their own ammo.

 

[Crazy88Fingers]

UPDATE

Well I thought I'd give you folks an update. I got the gun back on Monday and took it out shooting this weekend. Out of one hundred rounds it jammed twice in the same fashion it did before (last round chambered, extractor stuck behind it). On a third occasion the slide locked back with a round still in the magazine, and the last round was bobbling around loose inside the gun. That's new.

On the repair order I can make out the words "extractor" and "polish" plus some other chicken scratch. I suppose the gunsmith used to be a doctor. The feed ramp does look polished, and they definitely tweaked the extractor because the gun is spitting brass like my Mini-14; everyone within three lanes to my right needs to watch their heads.

I suppose I'll be giving them another call on Monday.

 

[745SW]

I’ll chime in even though I’m not a real fan of the 1911 platform. The 1911 is the only pistol that I had a need to play with the extractor. This was done decades ago, no Internet, so I’m going by faint memory but I believe similar info can be found on the web today. Beveled and polished the bottom of the extractor groove area and bent/tensioned the extractor by hand. If needed for better extraction remove some material at the bearing surface toward the extractor groove on the extractor that rides in the channel for the extractor.

I haven’t had the need to play with the extractor of my Colt GC series 70 since I last worked on the extractor decades ago. There was a time when I had several 1911’s, now its only one. If nothing else the 1911 platform is a real learning experience IMO.

Additionally the face of the extractor I polished in the event of having to snap the extractor over the rim of the cartridge. Not a good thing to do with an internal extractor but it happens.

 

[polyphemus]

Thank you for the update,it certainly sounds like they didn't repair it.
By your account I'm guessing multiple causes for the issues and definitely a
return trip to the factory,it's new and should work as represented.
Hang in there.

 

[Crazy88Fingers]

Yep, I paid extra for a Colt hoping I wouldn't have to deal with this. So it's going to keep going back until it works right.

 

[Wreck-n-Crew]

On the repair order I can make out the words "extractor" and "polish" plus some other chicken scratch. I suppose the gunsmith used to be a doctor. The feed ramp does look polished, and they definitely tweaked the extractor because the gun is spitting brass like my Mini-14; everyone within three lanes to my right needs to watch their heads.

I suppose I'll be giving them another call on Monday.

Definitely would.
I thought it was more likely a magazine issue to begin with. If the extractor was fixed/tuned and the ramp polished, the magazine seems more likely than ever.

Magazines are more easy to malfunction and cause feeding issues than the feed ramp. Also evidence presented so far suggests that the extractor is working properly now, even if not prior to shipping.

Good luck and keep us informed!

 

[DaleA]

The feed ramp does look polished, and they definitely tweaked the extractor

Well, here's hoping they get it to a tech that can really fix the problem and then you'll have it fixed and these other 'improvements' too and STILL have the Colt warantee.

Good grief...if anybody knows how to fix a 1911 you'd think it SHOULD be Colt.

Thanks for updating us about the problem.

 

[tank1949]

Crazy,


Maybe someone already spoke about this, but I have never seen a 1911 or clone shoot 100% reliable except hardball. I spent a fortune on a cheap ass LLyma getting it throated and polished. It still wouldn't shoot 185 HPs 100% with full mag (13 rds). If I had 6 or so then mostly ok. Went back to 230 hardball and totally reliable. Then I wore out extractor and incompetent gunsmith ended up charging me 75 bucks for nothing!!!!!!!! It didn't work. It did what your appeas to be doing base don photo. In fairness he SAID that he had to make one, since Llama was out of business. I finally got time a tore gun apart and noticed that gun smith hadn't removed enough metal near where hook grabs brass. The extractor was binding on frame. I filed down a few thousands of part nearest barrel so that extractor spring could fully grip brass and problem went away. No jams on 230 grain hardball. The 1911s like ROUND bullets. Check to be sure extractor grips and controlls brass. If it doesn't, cartridge has a tendency to bounce around as it goes to battery. Good luck!

 

[Powderman]

1. Remove and clean the extractor and the extractor tunnel. Lube with a good oil, and re-install.

2. CHECK YOUR GRIP ON THE PISTOL. This is one of the single most common (and easily fixed) problems with the 1911 platform.

Too many people have their grip too far down on the frame. This is especially true if you have bigger hands and/or you have experienced hammer bite--where the hammer pinches the web of your hand during its cycle of operation. Since you mentioned that you have a original configuration 1911--with the spur hammer--I suspect that this might be the case.

An indication that your grip is changing is to watch where your ejected cases land. If they are going all over the landscape, your grip is changing upon firing. I have shown people numerous times how shifting your grip on the 1911--or on most other semiautomatics--can induce a stoppage, most frequently a stovepipe and/or a failure to chamber.

How to grip a 1911 with a spur hammer:

Make sure that the pistol is clear first. Grasp the pistol by the front, holding it by the barrel and/or dust cover. Now, seat the pistol into the web of your hand at about a 30 degree angle, and rotate it downward. Close your hand.

The proper grip of the 1911 pistol should actually press the tang of the grip safety into the top of the web of your hand. Your hand must be firmly under that tang to give the handgun a solid platform to recoil against. Now, test fire your pistol. Your grip should be firm and tight, but not overly so.

Apply the basics, and concentrate on that front sight. Try this out, and post your results, if you would.

 

[Crazy88Fingers]

It may very well be the mags. But again, I'm not quite sure and would rather let Colt burn through their ammo figuring it out.

I am using 230 ball ammo. If it was ammo related I don't think it would have the problem on just the last round.

And I've seen malfunctions caused by a poor grip. The gun isn't stovepiping or failing to feed, and I've got my hand as high as it can go against that grip safety. Haven't been bit... yet.