Worst mistake during a training session.

LordTio3

New member
The only one that strikes me immediately was when I was about 12 years old, my friend and I were with my uncle shooting some 22lr target semi-autos at some dirt clods on fence posts. Right in the middle of firing, my friend to the right of me started yelling and doing the "Hot Brass Dance". Apparently, one had landed right in the neck of his shirt and started rolling down inside. Still didn't excuse him swinging his .22 around like crazy while he was getting it out.

Uncle made sure we were done shooting after that.

~LT
 

Daugherty16

New member
Not a training accident, but scared me enough...

I work in NYC, ride the subway downtown. I go down to the platform and the NYPD is staging there, in riot gear as they sometimes do to shake up their routines and discourage terrorism...

So this guy is wearing a 3-point sling with an AR15, but unlike his colleagues whose barrels were all pointed straight down, he is level and sweeping the crowd continuously with his muzzle, hand on the psitol grip. I immediately put a big pillar between us, called one of his colleagues (supervisor, i think) over, and explained the problem in very clear terms. He wasted no time getting over to his colleague and i saw some animated gestures as i watched around the pillar.

His muzzle was pointed down very quickly and he didn't look very happy, i saw as i boarded my train. The really unbelievable thing - all those sheeple standing around there were totally oblivious to what he was doing. Maybe that's what happens when you disarm an entire city.
 

Wilkenstein

New member
Mike, glad to hear you survived that one.

I've taught about a dozen male and female friends firearms basics, usually on request. Either they've never held a gun before and want to, or have but want to know a bit more.

I like to start that training/instruction away from the range. When there are other shooters dumping mags and you're wearing muffs, it's really hard to clearly communicate the basics of handling and safety, harder still to be confident that the messages are getting through, and you're on the clock, the meter is running, so you're both inclined to rush.

I start in a safe, quiet location, away from distractions. Using a rubber training gun, or a firearm that I've cleared & checked, usually with a removed barrel, we start with the basic 4 rules. Then go over basic functionality of the weapon in question. Then a break.

After the break, we review by having the student teach me what they just learned. We correct mistakes and fill in gaps.

This style of learning continues, working through trigger finger position (where their "default" position is off the trigger), loading/unloading/clearing, and finally basic aiming and trigger manipulation. Very little instruction about aiming, trigger control, or any of that. First lesson is about familiarity with the weapon's functionality. Aiming is limited to "see the front sight, put it on the target." Trigger pull details are limited to simply "pull it slow, let the gun wobble."

Then I let it soak in. A day or two is good. We reconvene and again, I have them teach everything I taught them back to me. Train the trainer. I observe their handling procedures, and introduce snap caps into the procedures for clearing, loading, chambering, firing.

At this point, I make an assessment. Are they ready for the live range? Do they have the steps down such that they can safely shoot at the range with minimal direction from me? If so, we head out. I like to go at an off-hour if possible, so the range is quiet. Once at the range, it's another basic review of safety, and my main focus is on the muzzle and their trigger finger. When we start to shoot, it's with an empty gun. Drill through the process several times dry. When the live ammo comes out, it's with 1 round in the gun at a time. Each time, the gun is returned to the bench, mag out and cleared. By this time, I know whether this person is going to get it or not. We've run through the basic steps at least 30 times. I've only had one person (male) who "didn't get it," and I ended the session respectfully, simply stating that I felt that my teaching style and his learning style weren't compatible, he should seek another instructor. The others were ready to start learning trigger control and front sight picture to improve their shooting.

The 1 round at a time thing is huge with me. And I always stand behind the student, never at the side unless the weapon is up and presented to the target. Slow and steady each step of the way, with repetition and train-the-trainer to ingrain the concepts by forcing the student to think through them on their own.

My best student was a 110lb 25-year-old female whom I had been friends with for 6+ years. In 4" heels she was shooting the .22 so well, didn't make a single range error after a good 45min of shooting, I decided to let her pop off a 10mm. At 25 feet she put it dead through the X. Second round was in the X ring. The range officer wasn't too thrilled with me letting her shoot the 10mm until I showed him her results, then he wanted her to come back for ladies' night.

Booker_t's post should be stickied. I think most regular shooters will be presented the opportunity to train someone who is totally or almost totally new to firearms at some point in their life.
 

Retired15T

New member
-I was at Fort Campbell's civilian firing range when a guy up on the benches turned around with his handgun in hand, pulling the trigger repeatedly. He flagged me and the two others I was with while doing so. I yelled at him to stop pulling the F'ing trigger on a firearm pointed at me. Turns out he had had a misfire and was pulling the trigger trying to figure out what was wrong while turning to ask someone to help him!! Two weeks later, I was in a briefing about overweight Soldiers and NCOES schools. The Post CSM got up on stage and imagine my surprise to recognize him from the range.

-We were at the range as an aviation company. After having fired multiple iterations in flight from our M134 mini-guns, we had to clear the range, land and shut down so the big guns could come in. About ten minutes later, three Blackhawks go hot onto the range but the trail aircraft isn't firing anything. That bird come into the hotpad, also the FARP, and starts troubleshooting their systems. Next thing you know, with two Blackhawks on the range firing, this 2.75" FFAR leaves one of the tubes of the Blackhawk on the hotpad and arcs out over the entire range, passing in between the two aircraft on the range firing their M134's manually, and disappears somewhere over the berms. No one was hurt and the rocket detonated somewhere in the woods off of our range. The pilot who did this was an instructor pilot who had mistakenly hit the fire button after being told by his CE that the tube was disconnected. It wasn't fully disconnected.:rolleyes:

-Balad, Iraq. We are getting the snot mortared out of us. An OH-58 is spooling up to go look for the mortar team. As the pilot pulls pitch, he does an AOAS (Altitude Over Air Speed) take off. This is normal for being in real dusty conditions since hovering and then nosing it over will cause the aircraft to be enveloped in blowing sand causing the pilots to lose visual with the ground and horizon. So you pull an armpit full of collective and pop up to 100' and then nose it over. As soon as they nosed over, a 2.75" FFAR Flechette rocket leaves their tube and impacts about 20 meters from the outside wall which has guard towers. No one was hurt and the cause was found to be due to erratic electricity. You get a TON of static electricity built up in the rotors and the aircraft when taking off from a sandy location and evidently, this is what caused the rocket to fire. I later read that a new grounding wire was installed to prevent that from happening again.

-Back in 1996, I was crewing my MH-60K and working with some new SEAL's. Their team leader and his assistant were the only "real world" operators/SEAL's on the aircraft. The other six guys being brand new from BUDS. The mission was just fast rope training, but the students had live rounds as they were going to fast rope into their shooting facility. We had just come to a hover over the target building and the first guy on each side was getting onto their ropes when I hear a discharge. I look to the back, right of my guy getting on the rope to see the guy behind him slowly leaning back with his face bloody mess. The trainee on the rope had reached out to take the rope in his hands when he felt a bad dig into his right side where his Beretta was holstered. He took his hands off the rope and tried to readjust his pistol, firing it into the face of the trainee behind him. The trainee had just turned his head to the right, so the round went through his face from left to right, taking out a lot of teeth and cheek skin in the process. If that dude wouldn't have turned his head and leaned back a little to hear what the SEAL Instructor was saying, he would have caught it between the eyes. The guy on the rope was on his way back to "Fleet" THAT NIGHT! The victim lived and eventually completed his training and served for some time on the teams.

**Personally, I've had one AD. It isn't an "Accident" in my mind, but a momentary loss of common sense. The gap left by the loss of common sense allowed Dumb@$$ to step in for a bit.

My AD cost me a new kitchen sink. I was standing in the kitchen, checking and clearing my weapons. Three of them were still clear from the range, but my CCW had one in the pipe. I dropped the mag, pulled the slide back, the ejector had broken and I didn't know it, and then I rotated the slide release and let the slide start moving forward. When it got to the mid position, I had to pull the trigger to finish releasing the slide. This is on an XD 45ACP. Since I didn't check the chamber for clear, and the lack of a round popping out didn't grab my attention, when I pulled the trigger to let the slide go, BAM! Kitchen remodeling by Springfield. I hated that damned sink and faucet anyway, but it sure didn't deserve to be shot! The .45 round, a PDX1 Bonded JHP, made a hole in one side of the sink about the size of the round, but when it went through and exited the other side of the sink, it took out a chunk about 3" in diameter. I had numb hands, ringing ears, bad powder burns to my stomach and a much worse headache.

While at the range, the ejector had broken off on the last round. I had packed everything up, put my SD magazine into the weapon, released the slide, put it on safe and into my IWB holster. When I was in the kitchen, I had a hard time pulling the slide back. Thinking it was due to my headache, which leaves my left side weaker and "buzzing", I had pulled the weapon into my stomach while putting more force on the slide, but still pointed in a safe direction just out of habit. When it went off, I got bad powder burns. I also got laughed at by my wife when she came home from work. She said she was very glad I didn't hurt myself, but she was even more glad that finally, she had an excuse to get rid of that sink. So the new sink and faucet ran a tad over $500. A costly bit of stupidity, but the lesson learned has stuck with me! I thank God no one else was around and no one, specifically ME, was hurt!

So now, whenever my wife wants to replace something in the house, she says, "Hey Tom, you want to do some Springfield remodeling? I think the couch is in need of replacement!" :D

I'm a firm believer that no matter how long you've been around weapons, no matter how much training you've had, and I've had a LOT after 21 years active duty, you will, at some point, have an AD. The only way to ensure that you minimize the damage and mitigate the risk of injuring yourself or another is to always keep your weapon pointed in a safe direction.
 

ice9_us

New member
what i have had happen

I know kids are kids… and I am very ashamed to admit.. but….
I Took my son to the range.. he is young "9" and impulsive/keep in mind… The range went cold.. he was reloading a clip, and KNEW BETTER!!!! When he was done reloading, the range was clear but not hot thank God!!, he started blasting…
I wanted to whack him a good one, but was very angry….. I yelled stop… smacked him lightly in the head to make sure I had his attention.. when he stopped.. I laid into him verbally and told him to get in to the jeep.. Took guns away for a very long while, and had him crawl over safety during that time.. I have him recite them (safety rules) every time he touches a gun… If I had romped his butt at that time.. I am sure I would have over done it I was so mad.. to this day I am ashamed.. not at him, but at myself for thinking he would have control over his impulse.. I was yapping to someone standing next to us when it happened, and only sort of watched him reload.. never again… While no one was at risk.. I still feel like crap.. and for good reason…

2nd. time resulted in embarrassment for my navy friend, but rules are rules…..
Based on less 1 above.. I never shoot when I have new (or fairly new) shooter anymore. Oh yea!! Because they say they know about guns, you can only take that lightly unless they prove to really understand as much as they would have you think....

Based on above issue: I don’t speak to people around me when i have new shooters to make sure i pay attention, and explain why so as not to appear rude…

My buddy was shooting, and once done, started to turn with the gun and would have muzzle swept us … I was next to him and grabbed his hand forcing the pistol to stay down range. He looked at me puzzled and as funny as can be my son yells.. OOOOHHHHH!!! Always keep the barrel pointed in a safe direction down range…. Those are my 2 my son did redeem himself…. And I really hope those issues are the last…
 

therealdeal

New member
worst mistake I ever made@range and I pulled thru+was able to keep it to myself was towards the beginning of my 4yrs military in 05:

100+degrees and on m16range. I didn't realize my canteen was empty until I was on the range because I forgot to fill canteen(I filled 99% of time but was in a rush that mrng or whatever). I became dehydrated and felt like I might faint. I bummed water from my buddy SGT Hall&another person without explaining the seriousness. nowadays, I have@least 5 water bottles in each of our two personal vehicles(just one of the lessons the army taught me and/or one of the habits the army formed). :)
 
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