We just lost one of our own to a AD/ND

[Technosavant]

This is what I don't get. And even after she came back, he said he "thought" he shot himself? If a .40 pistol goes off... inside your pocket... how can you have any doubt about what happened?

In a word, shock. Without any good description of exactly how this occurred we can only guess, but I would suspect that the bullet managed to hit one of the major blood vessels in the legs. When you lose blood, you don't think quite as clearly, and even then the body's response to a major injury is shock- he might not have felt the true nature of the wound.

 

[Skadoosh]

In a word, shock.

Agreed.

I watched a pickup truck right in front of me leave the highway and roll no less than six times after a front tire blowout. A passenger in the bed of the truck was thrown clear and wound up with a severe compound fracture of her leg and two broken wrists. She also had a broken pelvis. Not only did the passenger did not realise that her thigh bone was protruding from the back of her leg...trying SEVERAL times to stand up and walk toward the truck, but she could not understand why she was unable to retrieve her cell phone from the back pocket of her shorts with her broken wrists.

Shock is a very strange thing.

 

[Don P]

Well all I will add to this is and it may be a smidgen off. At a local private gun range here in FLA there were not 1 but 2 negligent discharges at 2 different competition matches. 1 resulted in death and the other resulted in a 45 through the calf. Go figure

 

[Poodleshooter]

It's been a bad time for NDs lately in central VA. We had a PD officer ND a round through his hand late last week. It's enough to make a fellow want to keep some quickclot with him at all times.

I'll admit to holsterless pocket carrying as well, but it's generally either my SP101 or wifey's S&W 638 airweight bodyguard. I never keep other items in the same pocket, and both revolvers have tremendously heavy triggers (9# and 12# DA pulls respectively) and low profile hammers to avoid negligent cocking.

 

[ttman]

IMO glocks are too thick to even consider just dropping it into my pocket or sticking it down a waist.

 

[Bud Helms]

We just lost one of our own to a AD/ND

Forgive me for the title, but I wanted TFL Members to see this article.

No about member but I guess it is possible. I would like to think that he was a fellow CCWer pro 2nd amendment.

"No about member ..."

Say what?

Then change the damn thread title. I do not appreciate seeing such a post, opening it with the dread that we had lost a member, and then finding out the 'our own' part was sensationalism to get people to open it. ...

I agree with Sarge, although maybe not in the exact language.

Intentionally mistitling a thread in order to get members to open it is a spammer's technique and will get you in trouble on TFL.

***

Chadio, what is this lock to which you refer?

 

[Tom Servo]

Most importantly, if you aren't confident you can carry the gun safely, don't carry it until you learn how to do that from a competent instructor.

OK, guys. Allow me to recount a conversation I have at least twice a week with customers. It might put things into perspective.

Him: "I need a gun. What, with all the gangs and secular humanists and people in political office I don't like, yada yada..."

Me: "OK. What have you shot before?"

Him: "Well, I shot with my buddy once back in 1974. He knew a cop. The gun was a big thing, with a thingamabob hangning off the bottom..."

Me: "OK...um, what's the intended purpose of the gun?"

Him: "CCW. EDC. Concealed. Tactical."

Me: "Well, for a new shooter, I'd recommend something..."

Him: "Hey, lemme see that one!"

Me: "That's a very small gun, with a long trigger pull and marginal sights. It's not the best thing to learn with."

Him: "What's there to learn? You point the thing, you pull the trigger 'till the clip's empty."

Me: "Well, there's more to it than that. We offer classes..."

Him: "Oh hell, no. Look, I know you're here to sell stuff, but I just need a gun. I want it as small and light as possible, so it fits in my pocket."

Me: "OK. We've got a couple of pocket holsters that..."

Him: "I already told you. I don't need a holster. I just need the gun. You're trying to ramp up the sale and rip me off. This is why I hate gun shops!"

Me: "Oh, sweet Jesus."

Him: "What?"

Me: "Nothing. I can assure you that you at least need a..."

Him: "Just give me some shells and let me get on my way. Can you load it up for me?"

Me: "Hell no. At the very least, please promise me you're going to read the manual."

Him: "Whatever. It's my right."

There are many, many more of these people than you want to believe carrying guns around.

 

[Onward Allusion]

It is horrible what happen to this guy.

It's not about whether it was a Glock, Sigma, Kel-Tec, Ruger or any other pistol or revolver that doesn't have a safety. Bottom line is that one should avoid pocket carry with one in the pipe unless one is using a holster that is stiff enough around the trigger to prevent it from being touched/moved/pulled...etc.

 

[chadio]

"I'm sorry; but that doesn't have a damn thing to do with the problem."

Bartholomew Roberts -

I support the right to keep and bear arms. I do it myself. But - I assure you, no one really needs a firearm on your person loaded - one - in - the - chamber

ALL OF THE TIME

Yes, my statement has something to do with the subject here. A guy died in case you missed that.

 

[therealdeal]

sorry for mishap

You know what, I thought I had explained myself and to add further, if I did something wrong I figured something would've already happened. do what you want to do or you feel you should do. I was clear as to why I made that title, I FEEL we lost one of our own. I personally feel he was a CCWer pro 2nd amendment. It had nothing to do with TFL. I see nothing wrong with having a title that would draw people to the discussion. In other words and to clarify again: "We lost one of our own to AD/ND" wasn't about TFL, it was about fellow gun owners and CCWers. If I made a mistake on the title, it wasn't intentional and I apologize about that. Also, I'm not trying to vent to you Bud. I guess I just didn't agree with Sarge. TFL is a community but a smaller community of CCW who legally carry. Of course, it is possible this man wasn't CCW, but I tend to think he was and just succumbed to tragedy. Even if he wasn't, he should be legal in his vehicle in VA if he can own/buy firearms. Lastly, hasn't time passed where I an't change the title myself? all the best

 

[chadio]

In before the lock - often, controversial topics such as this are shut down by forum administrators. Locked threads cannot be replied to.

AND - give the guy some dignity, lose the moron and idiot terms... he was just a guy trying to protect what was important to him.... his family and himself...... In his method fo doing so, it just so happens that he made a mistake.

 

[Technosavant]

I support the right to keep and bear arms. I do it myself. But - I assure you, no one really needs a firearm on your person loaded - one - in - the - chamber

ALL OF THE TIME

A couple questions:

1) If you NEED a gun where you're going, why go? If I actually thought I'd need a gun in the course of my day, I'd change my schedule or call the cops. At the very least I'd have a rifle on my person. Handguns are for the unforeseen emergencies.

2) If you're unsafe when you carry a gun unnecessarily (in your viewpoint), then what magic force is protecting you from harm when you think it is needed? Unsafe is unsafe, period. Responsible is responsible whether you went out for a quart of milk at the corner store or you went into some more nefarious neighborhood. I think it's more likely that one who carries rarely is more likely to be unsafe due to lack of familiarity and the reduced perceived use leading to junky gear (if you wear a gun every day, you've probably invested in a good belt or holster than if you just toss it in a pocket to go).

Safety is not only a choice but also a habit. We must CHOOSE we will carry safely, and then we must ingrain that choice by turning safe actions into habits.

 

[ripnbst]

Pocket Carry does not equal no holster. There are pocket carry holsters.

 

[therealdeal]

see my first post

title changed//it might have to wait for approval(was gonna do something different but opted on something similar-plse feel free to do as needed)

 

[chadio]

technosavant-

1) If you NEED a gun where you're going, why go?

Sometimes I have to visit a bad part of town to fill out documents for legal isssues or child care administrative documentation.

1) ....Handguns are for the unforeseen emergencies.

Handguns aren't the only way to protect yourself... avoidance, pepper spray, self-defensive fighting techniques and knives are also considered self - defense.

2) If you're unsafe when you carry a gun unnecessarily (in your viewpoint), then what magic force is protecting you from harm when you think it is needed?

Common sense. It is a magic force to those who have it. "I need a gun all the time everywhere" is pure paranoia.

 

[chadio]

BTW - I never said that carrying a gun safely and legally is going to offer an unsafe situation.

 

[therealdeal]

I would like to say Tom's post had me crackin up+i developed a good picture of that conversation

 

[Tom Servo]

he was just a guy trying to protect what was important to him

Well, he was going about it the wrong way, and he could have caused serious harm to someone he didn't intend to.

"I need a gun all the time everywhere" is pure paranoia.

Until you're the victim of an attempted carjacking in the well-lit parking lot of an upscale establishment in a nice part of town on a busy evening. Then it's not so paranoid.

I would like to say Tom's post had me crackin up

Sadly, that was not the intent. I really do have that conversation. That same guy is the one who buys a gun for his wife, who doesn't want to carry one in the first place, won't practice, and won't maintain the weapon. Guess who's going to show her how to use it? Him.

The Lori Klein situation didn't occur in a vacuum. The late middle-age country club crowd frightens me much more than the Call of Duty mall ninja folks.

 

[Technosavant]

I never said that carrying a gun safely and legally is going to offer an unsafe situation.

That's exactly what you implied. In regards to a man who carried a firearm to the grocery store, your statement had the strong implication that had he left it at home in favor of some non-firearm based defensive method, he'd still be alive. While correct in this exact instance, that statement also implied we'd all be safer if we only carried guns occasionally... such as when YOU think we "NEED" them (in blatant disregard of known incidents where otherwise safe places became murder scenes). Feel free to call it paranoia all you want, the vast majority of us here consider it prudence. I am not aware of any assailant who makes appointments or waits for a person to enter a bad neighborhood before striking. Your emotional thinking doesn't hold together when held to the light of logical reason and events we see in reality.

What killed this man was not carrying a gun to the grocery store. What killed him was his own unsafe practice, and those practices are not restricted to times when you think firearm carry is unnecessary. In fact, I would submit that one who only carries occasionally is MORE likely to be unsafe than someone who does so with regularity.

Whenever you carry, do so safely. Know your gun, know the advantages and disadvantages of your specific carry method and associated gear. Don't shortcut, you'll wish you hadn't. There's several folks out there with scars on their legs from substandard (or no) carry rigs, and I have a strong suspicion that a quality belt and holster would have cost far less than their medical co-pays.

 

[chadio]

...Well, he was going about it the wrong way, and he could have caused serious harm to someone he didn't intend to....

No argument here.