This is why you want a steel pistol

[TunnelRat]

Lastly Im not proposing a gun fight while 4 wheeling, what I am saying is falls can happen anytime doing anything and if you fall and your gun breaks during a self defense situation the game may well be over.

Listen, I respect you and your history on this forum. But you're starting to get a bit ridiculous. Me tripping and falling while running after a perp or dropping my gun going down the stairs in my house and the forces experienced while on an ATV at speed and falling off directly onto my gun aren't even in the same ball park. For Pete's sake you're making it out like a polymer pistol would break just from falling out of your hand. If you like steel that's great. If you prefer steel that's great too. But be reasonable.

 

[tahunua001]

^ +1. the force necessary to cause that kind of damage to a handgun is far greater than what gravity can generate. not even the much maligned Hi Point is going to break just from dropping it on the ground and if you are in a self defense situation your gun should be gripped tightly in-hand, not sitting in a holster, and not anywhere else where you do not have positive control of the weapon.

 

[sigcurious]

Erm...that link seems to be about the exact same incident. It lacks any functional external links to a story or pictures of the incident. There is only random forum chatter and an uncited quote which I have pasted below.

`Patriot and friend Buz Mills from Gunsite has shared with us an incident where a Border Patrol agent broke his plastic pistol. Seems he was riding his modern horse – ATV – and during an unintentional dismount – LE jargon for a wreck – he landed on his HK.

 

[Redhawk5.5+P+]

Hmmm, I wonder if this thread last's out the day.

Where would that force have gone if not to the pistol?

I wonder why most if not all new cars use plastic in the bumbers? Not just because they cheaper......

I'm about to go order a new Glock from Bud's, I was just wonder something I was about to ask about a G20sf.

 

[Straightshooter629]

While there seems to be somethign strange about this story, any impact severe enough to "break" a polymer frame would probably render a substanial amount of damage to a metal frame pistol. In any event, I still love my XD!

 

[BurgerBoy]

That's why I carry all metal guns. No plastic guns for me.

I had a new LC9 and after 50 rounds the frame rail was already starting to crack and splinter.

I got rid of it and got an all metal gun and have put hundreds of rounds through it with no problems or failures of any kind with it.

 

[Kevin_d77]

Same article is on guns.com today as well

http://www.guns.com/death-of-hak-p2000-failure-broken-polymer-control-10451.html

Whatever that's worth....

 

[BGutzman]

I am not proposing modern poly doesnt have its place, as I said I actually own some my tunnel friend. Nor am I even saying this is incident is likely.

What I am saying is it makes one think for just a second... see my previous post on this thread. Further I regularly post how much I like Springfield and H&K... I have even heard of a P220 that failed an officer with the little pin deal broke and I love Sigs. It seems like you post anything in here some days and everyone wants definitive scientific proof..

As but one example... http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?p=4630770&highlight=bgutzman+springfield#post4630770

I do not however ever agree that poly breaking for any reason is a good thing even if it saves your hip. I would say exactly the same thing of a steel or titanium or kryptonite gun...

 

[45_auto]

Wow failure is now a good application?

Failure is always a good application. Any well-engineered product will be designed to fail at the most benign point. For example, cars are designed to fail in certain areas (crumple zones) while keeping the passenger department intact. Pressurized systems are designed with burst valves that fail and vent the system when the pressure rises above a danger level. Your car has fuses which fail if the current rises above a given value rather than burning up the car. Boat propellors are designed with shear pins or rubber hubs that shear if the prop hits something to keep from damaging the rest of the outdrive. The hoses at the gas station have breakaway fittings designed to fail closed and not spray gas all over everything if you drive away with the hose still in your car (you'd be surprised how often that happens). Airplane jet engine pylons are designed to fail at the pylon stub so an engine failure won't rip the wing off the plane.

It took a significant amount of energy to break that gun. Something was going to absorb that energy. If it had been a metal framed gun it could just as easily went into breaking his hip or back rather than the gun.

 

[BGutzman]

Sure things are designed to fail safely but in this case I think it has nothing to do with the situation at hand. Whats next the airbag hip pistol?

 

[power5]

He was just trying to get his gun out of his holster.

 

[45_auto]

Whats next the airbag hip pistol?

Depends on how often people fall on them - maybe you've discovered an untapped market! Get back to us once you've finished your research!

 

[BGutzman]

great one 45.... Later all... time for some work

 

[drail]

Obviously just a batch of "bad" polymer. It happens.

 

[KevK.]

Do you guys think that if it had been a non-polymer gun that it might have cracked, chipped, or broke his hip? If he landed hard enough to do that to a poly he might have done series damage with a steel pistol.

Personally, I prefer metal to polymer.

 

[Auto426]

In this case I think the officer may have been lucky to have a polymer framed pistol. If his fall managed to snap the grip off of the gun, then the same fall with a metal framed gun would likely have left the officer with more serious injuries.

Does it mean that steel/aluminum frames are better than polymer? I wouldn't go that far. They each have their strengths and weaknesses and they both work well in their respective firearms.

I wonder why most if not all new cars use plastic in the bumbers? Not just because they cheaper......

If you look behind those modern plastic bumpers and fascias, you will usually find the real bumpers, which are made of metal and are tied into the frame of the car.

 

[Smit]

Only 1 way to resolve this. All of us hop on 4-wheelers and try to replicate the same result. Feel free to let me know how that works out for everyone.

 

[sigcurious]

You supply the test pistols and atvs, I'll get right on it!

 

[9mm]

This is why you need a backup, like a revolver that isn't plastic.

Can that gun still be fired? it looks just like the grip is missing, a magazine still could be inserted somehow? was it just that magazine area that messed up?

 

[NWPilgrim]

There is no way "torque" busted that grip. That would have created tremendous torque on the slide inside the holster. No way an even cheaper plastic holster held the 1" thick slide stationary and the grip snapped.

Looks more like what one might expect would happen when...
"Hey partner, look how tough these pistols are! I'll drive over it with our loaded up F250 on this gravel road and check it out..."

Oops. Better report that POS as broken in the line of duty. Not while doing a stupid stunt with agency equipment.