So Winchester 94 is back and made in Japan
- Thread starter bigkrackers
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oneounceload
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Yet so many here on this forum have no problem buying Chinese replicas of US guns that have serious quality issues.
Winchester, as mentioned, is now part of a global company, and we live in a global consumer society. If you truly want to "protect" US jobs, stop buying Chinese stuff from wally world.
Back on topic - Browning has/had most of its products made in Japan and Belgium/Portugal for a long time. Mossberg, among others, imports guns from other countries. Most others are importing at least parts if not full assemblies - and this occurs around the world.
Someone mentioned the US auto industry - THERE'S a can of worms for its own forum, let alone thread.
If it is made by Miroku, or even Nikko, it will be well-made. Some may think it is overpriced - not if someone is willing to buy it. In that case you may just be underfunded
Too bad Savage wouldn't do this and make a model 99 ,I would think that would sell . I think the Win 94 made any where and was a quality rifle would sell . Sad to think they can't or won't do it in the USA. If they make them and they fail to sell and get discontinued ,you will be able to get them from CDNN at half price ,Win Win .
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I appreciate your question - it might surprise one if a rifle that looks that good shoots better than it looks but, at my age, I'm bound to shoot better than I look -
I make up for aging looks by having more experience and, something else - I'm trying to remember.
Had an exceptionally good experience at the range yesterday, though. I was going through my weekly routine (two Colt's Government Models and a Ruger MK II Government Target Model pistol) when a couple of really well mannered young men set up beside me. They were clean cut and very courteous and were sharing a Ruger MK II with the 10" Bull Barrel - and only one magazine.
I loaned them my staple gun to tack up their target and, when they brought it back - saw my two 1911 Colt Government Models - Series 70s. Evidentally they had never seen one up close before - they were so enchanted, I offered them the opportunity to shoot them and gave a short course in how.
Then, they were really enchanted!! They wanted to show their appreciation so they brought their pistol over for me to shoot and furnished the ammo!
With all things we hear and read about the problems with our younger generation of males - if examples like these two young men don't encourage, nothing will.
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Irrelevant.
FN did not want to build a new facility just for 94s, they didn't want to take up space in the South Carolina plant that could be used for products that bring more return, they looked overseas (not just Japan), and went with a facility already making leverguns that had room for limited production.
They knew a Russian or Chinese or Turkish 94 would never sell here, and figured since there's been acceptance of Miroku nostalgia guns for several years already, that was the most cost effective way to "bring back" the 94.
As far as the cost goes, the quality is far better than anything the old US plant turned out for many years, and FN doesn't want to sell in large numbers anyway, since there's only a certain amount of capacity at the Miroku plant.
While you & I view the 94 as a "working man's gun", FN now views it as a nostalgia piece, with a totally different market.
Denis
FN did not want to build a new facility just for 94s, they didn't want to take up space in the South Carolina plant that could be used for products that bring more return, they looked overseas (not just Japan), and went with a facility already making leverguns that had room for limited production.
They knew a Russian or Chinese or Turkish 94 would never sell here, and figured since there's been acceptance of Miroku nostalgia guns for several years already, that was the most cost effective way to "bring back" the 94.
As far as the cost goes, the quality is far better than anything the old US plant turned out for many years, and FN doesn't want to sell in large numbers anyway, since there's only a certain amount of capacity at the Miroku plant.
While you & I view the 94 as a "working man's gun", FN now views it as a nostalgia piece, with a totally different market.
Denis
Miroku makes excellent stuff.
If you actually look at the new 94's you will see why they are charging more, same as the model 70 and others.
The quality is finally GREAT!!!!!!, look at the fit and finish and you'll see its not anywhere close to the crap Winchester was putting out a few years ago.
Is it worth 1000 bucks? That's for the individual buyer to decide.
Like others have said MSRP is usually at least 250 - 300 bucks higher than selling price.
How many people look at an M1A or a Sako or a Weatherby or an average AR15 and think they are overpriced? It's all about what YOU want.
If you want a rough yet durable levergun buy a Marlin.
If you want a super smooth, deep blued, walnut stocked lever action you can look for an old Winchester, or pony up the dough and buy a new one........
If you actually look at the new 94's you will see why they are charging more, same as the model 70 and others.
The quality is finally GREAT!!!!!!, look at the fit and finish and you'll see its not anywhere close to the crap Winchester was putting out a few years ago.
Is it worth 1000 bucks? That's for the individual buyer to decide.
Like others have said MSRP is usually at least 250 - 300 bucks higher than selling price.
How many people look at an M1A or a Sako or a Weatherby or an average AR15 and think they are overpriced?
It's all about what YOU want.If you want a rough yet durable levergun buy a Marlin.
If you want a super smooth, deep blued, walnut stocked lever action you can look for an old Winchester, or pony up the dough and buy a new one........
Puh-leeeeeze, another self-annointed __________ (fill in the blank).
Back to the subject at hand. It really doesn't matter to me who makes it.
I'm a retired, disabled veteran and I just can't afford it on what I make. I
guess it's disheartening to find out you're no longer a demographic.
Probably correct on the statement that the levergun is not the king anymore, but I would disagree with the statement about the boltguns falling by the wayside and being replaced by the AR-15. The AR-15 can be configured to be a great varmint rifle, and it is gaining in popularity in the hunting community. But even the U.S. Military has not totally phased out the bolt action. The m-40 is still used quite extensively. I would go so far as to say that the AR platform will probably never be able to accomodate the number of cartridges ranging from .22 lr up to 458 Win mag and everything in between like the bolt action has. The bolt action is here to stay for the primary hunting rifle and will probably not go by the wayside anytime soon.
$1200 is just too much for a 94! When you see that Marlin is still in competition, and the 336 is actually a better action, that leaves Winchester in a bad place to try to sell $1200 30-30 carbines.
This in addition to the fact that the tang safety is resented by EVERYONE I have ever spoken to, and there is NO REASON for it at all. It's just the corporation trying to "lawyer proof" itself and doing so at the expense of the wishes of the customers.
The new rebounding hammer on the lever guns is outstanding in design and usability. With that feature the redundant tang safety is just a bother and it's soundly hated by everyone I have ever talked to. The rebounding hammer is a great way to build them and I bet if John Browning were here today, he'd approve of it himself. So the 2nd safety is just offensive. It’s tolerated on $500 rifles by some, but I know very few who would pay $1200 for a carbine that has an offensive 2nd safety on it. I may be wrong, but time will tell.
I agree with those that state the quality will be good. I am sure it will. But that’s not the point. The point is that those who want a M-94 want an M-94! Not an overpriced copy with “features” they hate.
If you look at Japanese rifles in that price range, there are others that beat the pants off an M-94 in usability and accuracy. The “new 94” is not close enough to the old per-64s to keep any Winchester man interested, and for $1200 you can get the Browning BLR which beats the 94 in every way. Nostalgia was the selling point for the Winchester 94, and the way the new one is made, nostalgia is ruined.
So….. That makes for a tough market and a hard thing to sell.
If the Japs make a copy of a Harley I am sure they can do a great job. But if they put a “safety feature” like a roll cage on it and then try to sell it for almost 2 times what an American Harley sells for, I doubt they will sell many.
They just are not understanding how the American market works. Most American bikers won't like it. Neither will most American shooters like the "new 94"
This in addition to the fact that the tang safety is resented by EVERYONE I have ever spoken to, and there is NO REASON for it at all. It's just the corporation trying to "lawyer proof" itself and doing so at the expense of the wishes of the customers.
The new rebounding hammer on the lever guns is outstanding in design and usability. With that feature the redundant tang safety is just a bother and it's soundly hated by everyone I have ever talked to. The rebounding hammer is a great way to build them and I bet if John Browning were here today, he'd approve of it himself. So the 2nd safety is just offensive. It’s tolerated on $500 rifles by some, but I know very few who would pay $1200 for a carbine that has an offensive 2nd safety on it. I may be wrong, but time will tell.
I agree with those that state the quality will be good. I am sure it will. But that’s not the point. The point is that those who want a M-94 want an M-94! Not an overpriced copy with “features” they hate.
If you look at Japanese rifles in that price range, there are others that beat the pants off an M-94 in usability and accuracy. The “new 94” is not close enough to the old per-64s to keep any Winchester man interested, and for $1200 you can get the Browning BLR which beats the 94 in every way. Nostalgia was the selling point for the Winchester 94, and the way the new one is made, nostalgia is ruined.
So….. That makes for a tough market and a hard thing to sell.
If the Japs make a copy of a Harley I am sure they can do a great job. But if they put a “safety feature” like a roll cage on it and then try to sell it for almost 2 times what an American Harley sells for, I doubt they will sell many.
They just are not understanding how the American market works. Most American bikers won't like it. Neither will most American shooters like the "new 94"
I'd strongly disagree on the rebounding hammer. Unnecesary, adds additional spring weight to the hammer, which means extra energy has to be applied to the lever in cocking the hammer & cycling the action.
There are reports of unreliable ignition, although I've never encountered it myself.
Of the two, if I had to have one, I'd keep the safety & jettison the rebound system.
Denis
There are reports of unreliable ignition, although I've never encountered it myself.
Of the two, if I had to have one, I'd keep the safety & jettison the rebound system.
Denis
I realized I had forgotten my Browning BL22 - which I paid $115 dollars for in 1968 - same day that dealer friend sold me a new unfired Buffalo bill Commemorative Winchester 94 for $90 - good old days.
Love that BL 22 - short throw and accurate - first Miroku I ever owned but sure am sold on Miroku quality.
I guess I'm not a purist enough - don't pay attention or even notice such things as rebounding hammers or tang safeties - though I do admit, that cross bolt safety was totally unacceptable for me and I never would own one of those.
Love that BL 22 - short throw and accurate - first Miroku I ever owned but sure am sold on Miroku quality.
I guess I'm not a purist enough - don't pay attention or even notice such things as rebounding hammers or tang safeties - though I do admit, that cross bolt safety was totally unacceptable for me and I never would own one of those.
the357plan
New member
Picked up an Winchester 1892 Short a while back for just under $800 (MSRP $1069) from Cabela's. I very pleased with the fit, finish and accuracy. It's far better in all categories than the two US made 94 Trappers that I previously had. In fact, it's too pretty to take out into the woods. So I use a Marlin 1894CSS for bumming around.
bamaranger
New member
not me
For about half that, one could buy a VERY nice USA win 94, and for about a third, any number of very useable ones, preowned of course.
Still can't believe that the M94 is gone from production here.
But I will never buy an imported one.
For about half that, one could buy a VERY nice USA win 94, and for about a third, any number of very useable ones, preowned of course.
Still can't believe that the M94 is gone from production here.
But I will never buy an imported one.
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