Okay, What The Heck Is Wrong With Kel-Tec?

G

GTlefty

New member
manufacturing

I'm guessing its WAY easier to design a unique product than it is to purchase, tool up, staff and manage a whole new factory.
It is frustrating to read about the cool new guns we can't get. But would we like it if they outsourced the factories to China, or maybe, Brazil?
 
A

Atomix

New member
I agree with GTLefty, but I would be okay with a gun made in Brazil (have been happy with the Taurus guns I've owned). Probably wouldn't by the China version.
 
F

Flopsweat

New member
Well, their marketing genius has not worked on me. I've totally given up on KelTek. I don't even care what they come out with next. There are plenty of other manufacturers out there who can make stuff that will actually show up on a shelf. I had a P3AT that ran flawlessly, didn't cost much, and was a solid design, but I'm not going to spend the next 3 years pining for a KSG that will never come. I'm not a gun spinster. ;)
 
S

shaunpain

New member
From what I have read, at least in the past, batch numbers of their guns were purely a regional thing and when they were around you had to get it then. I bought my PF9 only about a year ago and I hadn't really seen them around at all. My copy was the first I remember even hearing about locally (it was in a sales ad I got in my email) but I had probably forgotten about NIBs that were a little higher than I was willing to pay for what I considered a last ditch pocket piece. I'm just not the type of guy who feels the .380 is sufficient FOR ME. I am still seeing them around the Chicago area as used, however, mostly NIB. I have seen a few of their pistol carbines around, also NIB, so I know they are still around.

Now, of course the rarer pieces I have never seen around, such as their shotgun and probably all of their rifles. I am greatly interested in some of their bigger bore rifles but my only option is gunbroker, and from what I had researched, my choices were slim up there, too. You're not going to get these on the cheap-o anymore.
 
D

dajowi

New member
One thing that I think about is, if they're so hard to find, just how hard are they to fix if something goes wrong?
 
K

Klingon00

New member
"One thing that I think about is, if they're so hard to find, just how hard are they to fix if something goes wrong?"
Click to expand...

When the magazine release button broke on my PF-9, I called them up and they mailed me replacement parts which arrived a couple of days later that I installed myself. Not too difficult and probably faster than mailing them the whole gun for such a simple request. I was also having issues with the magazine followers becoming worn and not properly engaging the slide stop so they sent me a bunch of replacements for those too. I don't know what it would be like to mail them the gun for service though.


Actually, my experience on the broken parts has left a sour taste in my mouth. It's clear that the parts just weren't built to take much use. The metal magazine release beveled off under normal use and would no longer hold the magazine in place when firing the gun. Gun would go bang, then klick and I'd have an empty chamber and full magazine (that wasn't fully seated). Also the followers would jam up against the slide stop (instead of push up on it) causing the magazines to become stuck requiring a bit of force to rip it out of the gun. Also the slide would not lock open on the last round. Also the last round would cut a groove in the follower meaning that the follower no longer pushed up on that round as high as it should and the last round would often fail to feed. Replacement of magazine catch, spring and follower fixed all these problems, for now.

It seems as if Kel-Tec would spend some time on QC and getting the design and materials right on their guns they would have a home run on their hands. Unfortunately, they lack the manufacturing capacity to handle a home run, so maybe its all a way to keep things more in balance? It just feels as if Kel-tec shoots themselves in the foot. There is obviously more demand for their guns than they can meet and that's lost profit. Add to lost sales due to unhappy customers with broken guns and there's more lost profit from repeat sales. Not the best business model if you ask me... they need to beg, plead, borrow money to expand manufacturing and QC operations. This is why they can't compete on the same scale with the big boys more than any other reason.
 
M

maestro pistolero

New member
Nothing is wrong with Kel-Tec. In fact, this may be a very shrewd business move.

The slow release of limited numbers of units has done amazingly well for generating orders and demand.
Click to expand...
But it's demand they can't adequately fill. Demand comes and then, if unfulfilled, it goes. Orders generated but not filled does not spell success.

This has become something of a pattern for Keltec to the point of them looking a little ridiculous. Who in their right mind is going to allow themselves to get excited about their next product announcement?

They obviously have insufficient resources to develop and bring mature products to market in a timely manner. I have a KSG backordered on a pre-sale for 1 year and three months. TGSCOM has received exactly ONE KSG in all that time. I have been number one on their wait list for months.
 
C

corbin_dalles

New member
I've had 2 PF9's that were about as reliable as a stripper girlfriend, that made me second guess purchasing anything else from them. With that said I still want a PMR-30 :D
 
S

Sulaco2

New member
Has KelTec ever caught up with prior orders down the line or do they just drop the orders and move on to the next big thing? Seems as long as they sell all that they make they are happy no matter the number of orders waiting. Seems like it will catch up with them in the future....
 
B

bikerbill

New member
I still don't get the point ... I'd love one of the .22mag semis, but the gunstores around here just laugh, even as ads for the gun pop up in gun mags every month ... why waste ad money if you can't even get close to filling demand? OK, it's a small company, but it may be the only one I've ever heard of that heavily advertises a product, apparently generates a strong demand for it and then is uninterested in expanding to satisfy that demand ... it's their business, of course, but it's bad business, IMHO ...
 
T

turkeybuzzard

New member
My son called them and ordered one of there 40 cal pistols through a dealer. They kept his money for over a year (A YEAR). Every time he would email or call they would say your on the list or it wont be long. He finally gave up and told them to just refund his money and they said do you really want to do that? He bought a sig 229 and is very happy with it. I asked him what he wanted with one of those tinker toy kel tecs anyway. Anyway it is not a good company to deal with.
 
O

OFG-1S1K

New member
Kel-Tec Just Getting Up to Speed Shipping KSGs

The manufacture & distribution of RFBs is a major business screwup. Nobody designs a product to short ship, in the meantime angering tens of thousands of potential customers while selected Distributors & Dealers gouge that same customer group. Most of the Dealers are really ****** and have written Kel-Tec off. Can't blame them.....Kel-tec pistols are low-price point, low-margin weapons.

Reading all the news, rumors and stats, it would appear thet Kel-Tec has had problems with it's barrel suppliers; has limited internal expansion capabilities (read people & equipment); has limited planning capabilities; and is an appraent victim of it's own success (read self-inflicted wounds)

It's also apparent that they are just getting up to speed distributing KSGs, even while the gouging past the $880 MSRP continues. Kel-Tec makes "good" guns, but not "great" guns that one pays huge premiums for.

While I'd like to have both a KSG shotgun and a RFB .308, I think I'll just fade away for 2 years and then check back. It's obvious Kel-Tec can't manage it's own business in light of this success. They could get their ass kicked if R&D at competitors pans out and they build & ship competitive bullpups.

I'm hoping Kel-Tec gets its proverbial **** together, but in the meantime I'm not paying $1800 for an RFB or $1000 for a KSG.
 
R

rsparmar

New member
Kel Tec, never seen one in real life...

I agree they are a poorly run company. There is a lot talk about a ghost company as far as i am concerned. Nutnfancy trys to sell their products every video he does, yet I have not seen a single gun of kel tec's for sale in any gun store here in Virginia. Kel Tec guns are all over gunbroker.com and marked up 2-3times their msrp's. The few gun dealers that get them in, immediatlly go to web sites and mark them up to make a huge profit off of them while the kel tec company doesnt get any of that profit. I am not sure I want to buy a gun from a company that is so poorly organized, how reliable can their product be?
 
S

sonick808

New member
well, if this is a marketing plot, then i think it sucks.

I had the money hot to trot for a PMR-30 for months after it's release. After a year or more of teasing and gougers, I said screw it. I won't buy anymore kel-tec because of this "strategy" until I see them flood the market with PMR-30's and the new shotgun.
 
F

FloridaVeteran

New member
PMR-30 - how to buy & how mine shoots

I recently bought a PMR-30 - ordered it through B&H Gun Rack in Merritt Island, FL. They are physically very close to the Kel-Tec plant. I understand that they are a large supplier to police depts, via a now-separate arm of the shop, so maybe they get high priority from many makers. Anyway, mine took 5-6 weeks to receive and I paid straight MSRP for it, no hassles at all.

Mine runs just fine. There are only three things to be concerned with, that I know of. First, if you are buying a re-sale, you want one with the unfluted barrel - that is the post-recall version with the change in barrel twist that cuts out the key-holing. Otherwise, you'll have to send it in for a refurb (that I believe is free).

Second, you have to pay attention to their cautions about ammo. It will reliably run only specific loads - it seems to want the highest-power loads, presumably to shove the slide back hard enough relative to their unique spring system. Federal Game-Shok JHP 50 gr. is an example of what they recommend. I had no problems with the recommended Winchester Super-X FMJ 40 gr. load. Kel-Tec recommends NOT using Armscor 40, Fiocchi 40 or any imported ammo at all.

Third, loading the mags is different than others and you need to follow the instructions pretty carefully - there is a slightly cut-out area in which to shove the base before sliding it back toward the read of the mag, then after every five rounds you smack it on your bench to keep the rounds seated rearward. Easy to get used to, but a definite read-the-instructions procedure.

While the mags technically hold 30 rounds, your fingers are not going to like trying to cram that many in - I find 25 is a good number. I weighed the pistol, loaded with 25-rounds of the Super-X and it came in right at 19 ounces - pretty easy to haul around for a day in the woods, even with an extra mag.

I haven't tried Critical Defense in it yet, but plan to this coming week. Will also try the new short-barrel Gold Dots when I can find some. I don't expect any problems. Anyway, I think it's a pretty cool gun that has just enough recoil and bang to make you think you are shooting something a little bigger. It feels good in my 1911-loving hand and the trigger, though it looks like something from a toy gun, is nice and crisp. I'm happy I bought it.
 
B

Boatme98

New member
I don't know where you are Joe, but a lgs has the KSG on the rack, Just over $800. I know he'll go less than msrp. Kel Tech is a big seller in mid Tenn., and you can get pretty much anything.
A Ruger 1911 now, that's as rare a virgin at the H.S. graduation.:eek:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top