Obtaining an alien firearms license - WA State
- Thread starter Wren
- Start date
MD_Willington
New member
No, my reps are pretty busy, they deal with a lot of farming issues and fight against the foolishness on the West side of the State... it's also an election year so they are busy with that too.
I know my local rep personally, so we are pretty informal about our emails.
Sometimes it is who you know and not what's on the piece of paper that tells people what you know
I know my local rep personally, so we are pretty informal about our emails.
Sometimes it is who you know and not what's on the piece of paper that tells people what you know
MD_Willington
New member
Just thought of something here, The Cathy McMorris Letter I have has a letter from the FBI stating that if WA did what they did with HB 2955 then that would clear the way for the DOL to get back to issuing the AFL's...
So the crux is this, they spelled it out, WA did what they asked and now the FBI drops the ball, so how can we expose this?
Talking about a potential "egg on face" situation here...
MD
So the crux is this, they spelled it out, WA did what they asked and now the FBI drops the ball, so how can we expose this?
Talking about a potential "egg on face" situation here...
MD
MD_Willington
New member
CALL SAF ASAP Phone: (425) 454-7012
Phone: (425) 454-7012
It boils down to this... All of you guys on here that are legal immigrants or green card holders, need to call SAF and get a hold of Mr Gottlieb or at least talk to some one at the SAF and tell them you story regarding the AFL debacle...
You may, or probably will, end up being called to court as a plaintiff, so be prepared for this.
MD
--> Who'd rather be out enjoying Independence day plinking with friends and family, but instead gets to hammer on a keyboard !
Phone: (425) 454-7012
It boils down to this... All of you guys on here that are legal immigrants or green card holders, need to call SAF and get a hold of Mr Gottlieb or at least talk to some one at the SAF and tell them you story regarding the AFL debacle...
You may, or probably will, end up being called to court as a plaintiff, so be prepared for this.
MD
--> Who'd rather be out enjoying Independence day plinking with friends and family, but instead gets to hammer on a keyboard !
cubanitojr
New member
Second Amendment foundation.
http://www.saf.org/
The idea sounds interesting. I may give then a call this week.
Thanks MD.
http://www.saf.org/
The idea sounds interesting. I may give then a call this week.
Thanks MD.
I see Mr Gottlieb has a fraud conviction for which he was jailed under the work release program - that would get me jailed then deported never mind banned from gun ownership - even if I had a firearms license - there certainly is a big difference between citizens and non-citizens
However, if he can assist legal residents with this issue then that's fine by me !
However, if he can assist legal residents with this issue then that's fine by me !
MD_Willington
New member
Well anyone paying attention, don't apply for an AFL...
Read the attached PDF...
If you apply for a WA State AFL, DOL will send your money back, When they figure out how they will do that, :scrutiny:
Everyone that has applied, fill out the form and get your money back, better yet fill it out and hope some news outlet ppicks up on their incompetence.
In other words
"Stop bugging the DOL, here's your money back when we figure out how to send it to you, shut your yaps."
DOL is trying to write off this issue by giving the funds back...
It is not about getting money back for me... I want this fixed !
Anyway...
My family & I went to the Fourth of July Parade in Johnson, Washington. My reps, Mark Schoesler, Joe Schmick and Cathy McMorris Rogers were all there participating in the parade, I chatted with them briefly.
Some of those who over heard the matter were appalled that someone who has legally been living here in WA for 8 years, 3 of which with a "green card" and who had been background checked by ICE, USCIS, locally, Federally and internationally (they check NLETS which is tied to RCMP records in Canada) had to put up with the licensing after all that.
I told Mark about contacting Alan Gottlieb and he said that was a good move and that Mark was aware of some other cases, one of which was to do with IIRC a Czech man who was a legal resident in OR that was pulled over in WA, and the WSP found a handgun in his car, he was perfectly legal in OR, of course WA State charged him with being in possession of a firearm and not a WA State AFL - He now faces deportation!
In all a good day, they all said they still had work to do on this issue and hang in there.
Read the attached PDF...
If you apply for a WA State AFL, DOL will send your money back, When they figure out how they will do that, :scrutiny:
Everyone that has applied, fill out the form and get your money back, better yet fill it out and hope some news outlet ppicks up on their incompetence.
In other words
"Stop bugging the DOL, here's your money back when we figure out how to send it to you, shut your yaps."
DOL is trying to write off this issue by giving the funds back...
It is not about getting money back for me... I want this fixed !
Anyway...
My family & I went to the Fourth of July Parade in Johnson, Washington. My reps, Mark Schoesler, Joe Schmick and Cathy McMorris Rogers were all there participating in the parade, I chatted with them briefly.
Some of those who over heard the matter were appalled that someone who has legally been living here in WA for 8 years, 3 of which with a "green card" and who had been background checked by ICE, USCIS, locally, Federally and internationally (they check NLETS which is tied to RCMP records in Canada) had to put up with the licensing after all that.
I told Mark about contacting Alan Gottlieb and he said that was a good move and that Mark was aware of some other cases, one of which was to do with IIRC a Czech man who was a legal resident in OR that was pulled over in WA, and the WSP found a handgun in his car, he was perfectly legal in OR, of course WA State charged him with being in possession of a firearm and not a WA State AFL - He now faces deportation!
In all a good day, they all said they still had work to do on this issue and hang in there.
That's a load of bolony - when I went for my Washington driver's license a couple of months back they sent for checks on my green card to see if i was in the country legally. So what that form is saying about 'cannot check you are in the country legally ' is rubbish - its the USCIS (dept of homeland security)that tells them that anyway not the FBI
Md I appreciate your efforts greatly - don't lose heart and give up...
I am writing to the DOL again today and I will keep looking for contacts
This administative thing should be moveable without legislation - after all the law just requires the DOL to make the checks - it doesnt say HOW to do the checks - an administrative change on how the checks are deemed to be satisfied does not need legislation
My wife freaked out when I said I was going live in the newspapers about it as she thinks small towns can be very unforgiving and bad things can happen in America. That was something I had not considered being from tolerant old England where anything goes. So I have tried to withdraw my letter to the editor and i hope it works. Direct letters to public reps and officials are ok though so I will redouble my efforts with those.
I am writing to the DOL again today and I will keep looking for contacts
This administative thing should be moveable without legislation - after all the law just requires the DOL to make the checks - it doesnt say HOW to do the checks - an administrative change on how the checks are deemed to be satisfied does not need legislation
My wife freaked out when I said I was going live in the newspapers about it as she thinks small towns can be very unforgiving and bad things can happen in America. That was something I had not considered being from tolerant old England where anything goes. So I have tried to withdraw my letter to the editor and i hope it works. Direct letters to public reps and officials are ok though so I will redouble my efforts with those.
MD_Willington
New member
Check out acceptable documentation, they can use a foreign passport as ID...
http://www.dol.wa.gov/driverslicense/idproof.html
http://www.dol.wa.gov/driverslicense/idproof.html
yes your right they are much more lax than Florida - there, they sent off to the USCIS to prove right of residence in the US even though I had a green card and a SS card and a Wisconsin driver's license ! It took a month for the USCIS checks to be done before I could get a Florida license. Seems Washington is dead easy on driver's licenses.
MD_Willington
New member
Dead easy on a lot of stuff if you're here ILLEGALLY!
'Sanctuary Cities' Embrace Illegal Immigrants - Seattle, Washington ...
No comment...
'Sanctuary Cities' Embrace Illegal Immigrants - Seattle, Washington ...
No comment...
copy letter to DOL
Dear DOL
Please find attached my form to register my interest in news regarding the ‘Alien Firearms License’. I have no application money to refund.
I understand the problem with the FBI, but the sentence about ‘not being able to determine if the applicant is lawfully present in the United States’ leaves me distinctly puzzled as I have a green card and an immigrant visa in my passport to prove just that. I am also a U.S. tax payer with documents to show that I pay U.S. taxes as a legal permanent resident
In order to get my green card I had to be photographed, measured, weighed, fingerprinted, required to give a blood sample , undergo an extensive medical examination, have inoculations, an interview at the US Embassy in London, produce a UK Police Certificate to show no record, and have extensive FBI checks into me and all my family
In order to satisfy the Washington legislation, surely the DOL can verify if all that is true with Department of Homeland Security (USCIS) ?
I don’t think new legislation is necessary, just a change in verification method by the DOL
Yours faithfully
Dear DOL
Please find attached my form to register my interest in news regarding the ‘Alien Firearms License’. I have no application money to refund.
I understand the problem with the FBI, but the sentence about ‘not being able to determine if the applicant is lawfully present in the United States’ leaves me distinctly puzzled as I have a green card and an immigrant visa in my passport to prove just that. I am also a U.S. tax payer with documents to show that I pay U.S. taxes as a legal permanent resident
In order to get my green card I had to be photographed, measured, weighed, fingerprinted, required to give a blood sample , undergo an extensive medical examination, have inoculations, an interview at the US Embassy in London, produce a UK Police Certificate to show no record, and have extensive FBI checks into me and all my family
In order to satisfy the Washington legislation, surely the DOL can verify if all that is true with Department of Homeland Security (USCIS) ?
I don’t think new legislation is necessary, just a change in verification method by the DOL
Yours faithfully
cubanitojr
New member
Today contacted www.saf.org They told me there is nothing they can do.
:-\
They told me that current legistation is controled by the "Democrats", they have no interest in allowing more people obtaining firearms, again the gun control crowd in action. He also mention a case, that a Chezch legal OR resident with an OR concealed weapon permit got stopped in WA, charged with an Alien illegally having a firearm without a license. He was in WA helping a friend move, and had no idea of WA wonderful laws.
PS. Republican states have no issues with legal aliens owning guns.
:-\
They told me that current legistation is controled by the "Democrats", they have no interest in allowing more people obtaining firearms, again the gun control crowd in action. He also mention a case, that a Chezch legal OR resident with an OR concealed weapon permit got stopped in WA, charged with an Alien illegally having a firearm without a license. He was in WA helping a friend move, and had no idea of WA wonderful laws.
PS. Republican states have no issues with legal aliens owning guns.
MD_Willington
New member
I can concur, my local Reps are Republican and from what I've seen, farming people... I think "common sense" is a bit more prevalent in rural settings..
Any way, check out what is going on at THR in this thread:
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=373714
waverace has been doing some digging into the issue.
PS SAF never called me back either...
Membership has its privileges
FYI, the NRA is not very helpful on this either.
Any way, check out what is going on at THR in this thread:
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=373714
waverace has been doing some digging into the issue.
PS SAF never called me back either...
Membership has its privileges
FYI, the NRA is not very helpful on this either.
cubanitojr
New member
Legal action
I have heard sometimes Attorneys would take a civil case for free when it has strong merit and there is a substancial profitability. It looks like the case is defined in 3 fronts:
1. 14 amendment.
2. DOJ complaint.
3. Color of law.
I am not an Attorney, but common sense tells me AFL is purely unconstitutional.
I can not find any info. on the Oregon Chezch citizen. Do you have it?
How about contacting ACLU?
================================
I also found this very interesting idea:
My roommate is a citizen, he wants to buy a firearm, I am a permanent resident we both live in the same house. If he buys a firearm for himself, then he would be exposing a permanent resident alien to firearm possession charges (I would not allow that) since I can not obtain an AFL and can not prevent my roommate from buying a firearm, the state of WA is jeopardizing my legal status and effectively preventing my roommate (a citizen from obtaining a firearm). I think the state of WA is "liable" here for this particular broken law.
Any thoughts here?
I have heard sometimes Attorneys would take a civil case for free when it has strong merit and there is a substancial profitability. It looks like the case is defined in 3 fronts:
1. 14 amendment.
2. DOJ complaint.
3. Color of law.
I am not an Attorney, but common sense tells me AFL is purely unconstitutional.
I can not find any info. on the Oregon Chezch citizen. Do you have it?
How about contacting ACLU?
================================
I also found this very interesting idea:
My roommate is a citizen, he wants to buy a firearm, I am a permanent resident we both live in the same house. If he buys a firearm for himself, then he would be exposing a permanent resident alien to firearm possession charges (I would not allow that) since I can not obtain an AFL and can not prevent my roommate from buying a firearm, the state of WA is jeopardizing my legal status and effectively preventing my roommate (a citizen from obtaining a firearm). I think the state of WA is "liable" here for this particular broken law.
Any thoughts here?
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Alien Firearms License sham in reality a blockade to Canadian hunters
I am a Canadian citizen & hold a valid Utah CFP, Pennsylvania LTCF, New Hampshire Pistol/Revolver License & a Maine Non-Resident Permit to Carry Concealed Firearms. The CCW issuing agencies of those states didn't have any problem getting information from the FBI in order to grant me a permit.
The inability to obtain background information from the FBI for purposes of vetting alien permit applicants seems to be limited solely to Washington State unless of course you believe that the above four states (NH, PA, UT, ME) broke the federal law in order to grant me their concealed carry permits. Believe me I don't have that much "pull".
In 99% of the cases any aliens that would conceivably use a firearm in the State of Washington wouldn't be Russians, Chinese or Japanese........they'd be Canadians.
Let's call this shabby contrivance of Washington State's exactly what it is and that is a fabricated drawbridge to bar Canadians from hunting in Washington State.
What an absolutely spineless & shameful example of "political weasel words" the above quote is.
Why didn't Washington State just have the guts to say straight up & upfront "We don't want Canadians hunting here".
I am a Canadian citizen & hold a valid Utah CFP, Pennsylvania LTCF, New Hampshire Pistol/Revolver License & a Maine Non-Resident Permit to Carry Concealed Firearms. The CCW issuing agencies of those states didn't have any problem getting information from the FBI in order to grant me a permit.
The inability to obtain background information from the FBI for purposes of vetting alien permit applicants seems to be limited solely to Washington State unless of course you believe that the above four states (NH, PA, UT, ME) broke the federal law in order to grant me their concealed carry permits. Believe me I don't have that much "pull".
In 99% of the cases any aliens that would conceivably use a firearm in the State of Washington wouldn't be Russians, Chinese or Japanese........they'd be Canadians.
Let's call this shabby contrivance of Washington State's exactly what it is and that is a fabricated drawbridge to bar Canadians from hunting in Washington State.
What an absolutely spineless & shameful example of "political weasel words" the above quote is.
Why didn't Washington State just have the guts to say straight up & upfront "We don't want Canadians hunting here".
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