Blackwater OPS
New member
No guns in my house when I was a kid.
Talk about your deprived childhood.
Talk about your deprived childhood.
Minors with firearms
- Thread starter Maser
- Start date
chemist308
New member
Yes to the first question, I had a 22, a 410 and at one point a 16 guage and 308 in my room. But for the second question...NO! No way I'd let a kid keep guns in his room. I'm not being a hypocrite, I just think back and see there was too much risk in that sort of thing. Fact is a 15 year old kid often lacks the ability to control his emotions and temper that his 30 - 40 year old dad has. Risks for irresponsible firearm usage are simply too great.
Chemist308--
FWIW, I think you're just being a responsible dad. Things have changed quite a bit since I first started shooting (in 1957). I hope your child comes around and understands that firearms are fun to shoot, but need to treated with great respect.
Best regards,
Skeeter
FWIW, I think you're just being a responsible dad. Things have changed quite a bit since I first started shooting (in 1957). I hope your child comes around and understands that firearms are fun to shoot, but need to treated with great respect.
Best regards,
Skeeter
KimberTLE.45
New member
My father let me get my first gun at the age of 12. Remington 870 Super-Mag 12 Guage. I have been shooting ever since. Ever since I was 15, the gun safe with all of our guns and ammo has been in my room. I've always known the combonation.
maturity over age
Both My Son and Daughter have access to my guns, they are 14, and 15.
Both are exceptional shots and have the maturity to handle them in my absence, to assess the situation and handle it. I'm not talking about "home defense measures". Thats what the dogs are for. I'm referring to dropping a coyote in a pasture where there are no horses.(the horses can sure enough take care of a coyote thats buggin' them). I have faith in the maturity level of MY own, but can't vouch for thier friends, so to ease any and all peer pressure from a visitor of thiers, lets just say they know where they are only if and when they need them, it ain't show and tell, but "plinkin" is a family event only.
Both My Son and Daughter have access to my guns, they are 14, and 15.
Both are exceptional shots and have the maturity to handle them in my absence, to assess the situation and handle it. I'm not talking about "home defense measures". Thats what the dogs are for. I'm referring to dropping a coyote in a pasture where there are no horses.(the horses can sure enough take care of a coyote thats buggin' them). I have faith in the maturity level of MY own, but can't vouch for thier friends, so to ease any and all peer pressure from a visitor of thiers, lets just say they know where they are only if and when they need them, it ain't show and tell, but "plinkin" is a family event only.
My father gave me my first gun when I was 13. Ithaca model 37 12g. Given to him by his father and will be given to my son. I never asked to keep it in my room. I knew all guns were kept in the safe. I never questioned him and there was never a problem. I dont think that there are any reasons why my son should have a gun in his room. When he is old enough he will know where they are and how to get them if he needs to.
armedandsafe
New member
I got my Red Ryder when I was 5. I had to stick the stock behind my knee to cock it. I got the Winchester singleshot .22 the Christmas I was 8 and my 03A3 came in the summer I was 9. The firearms were stored upstairs in the folks closet, but I could get them down any time I wanted. All the ammo and the reloading bench used one end of my bedroom.
I wasn't allowed to take a firearm out of the house, unescorted until I was 12. If I wanted to shoot the .22, I had to buy my own ammo, which was not a big hardship, as I owned my first business by then. If I wanted to shoot the -06, I had to use GI or load my own.
When I was in high school in Oregon (55-58) the principal had a rifle rack in his office. If you didn't want to leave your gun in your truck/car, or were without transportation, you just walked into the office, gun in hand and the secretary would let you into the principal's office. If he was busy just then, she would take the guns and stand them in the corner until she could move them into his office. I've seen a number of rifles, shotguns and pistols leaning in the corner, on her desk, even lying across the counter. Often a kid would just plunk his shotgun into his locker until after school. Try that today.
Pops
I wasn't allowed to take a firearm out of the house, unescorted until I was 12. If I wanted to shoot the .22, I had to buy my own ammo, which was not a big hardship, as I owned my first business by then. If I wanted to shoot the -06, I had to use GI or load my own.
When I was in high school in Oregon (55-58) the principal had a rifle rack in his office. If you didn't want to leave your gun in your truck/car, or were without transportation, you just walked into the office, gun in hand and the secretary would let you into the principal's office. If he was busy just then, she would take the guns and stand them in the corner until she could move them into his office. I've seen a number of rifles, shotguns and pistols leaning in the corner, on her desk, even lying across the counter. Often a kid would just plunk his shotgun into his locker until after school. Try that today.
Pops
Responsibilty
When my son was young, I first I taught him to shoot on my brother's farm with a 10/22. As he got a little older, 12 or 13, I bought him his own 10/22, and I started taking him to the range. I showed him how to clean our guns after we returned home. We put away our unused ammunition in it's proper place and secured our guns into their proper place. I never told him he was to little or young to keep guns in his room. It never came up. I showed him that it was not a good idea to leave firearms around the house, by example. He never asked to keep his Ruger in his bedroom. He was proud to store it next to my long guns. He knew then, and now, that I keep a .380 in my bed room, out of site, and he knows why, to defend our home. But, he had shot it, and other pistols I have, at the range. So it held no fascination for him. I removed his curiosity by teaching him early about firearms. I tried to show him how to be responsible, and respectful, of all guns. At 12 he was shooting my 12 ga. at turkey shoots, and winning, by the time he was 14 he liked to shoot my 44 mag. at the range. He found out, that's the fun of firearms, not looking at them in the corner of his bedroom.
I'm not telling anyone how to raise their children, this was just how I did it when it came to guns.
Billy
When my son was young, I first I taught him to shoot on my brother's farm with a 10/22. As he got a little older, 12 or 13, I bought him his own 10/22, and I started taking him to the range. I showed him how to clean our guns after we returned home. We put away our unused ammunition in it's proper place and secured our guns into their proper place. I never told him he was to little or young to keep guns in his room. It never came up. I showed him that it was not a good idea to leave firearms around the house, by example. He never asked to keep his Ruger in his bedroom. He was proud to store it next to my long guns. He knew then, and now, that I keep a .380 in my bed room, out of site, and he knows why, to defend our home. But, he had shot it, and other pistols I have, at the range. So it held no fascination for him. I removed his curiosity by teaching him early about firearms. I tried to show him how to be responsible, and respectful, of all guns. At 12 he was shooting my 12 ga. at turkey shoots, and winning, by the time he was 14 he liked to shoot my 44 mag. at the range. He found out, that's the fun of firearms, not looking at them in the corner of his bedroom.
I'm not telling anyone how to raise their children, this was just how I did it when it came to guns.
Billy
R.D.Wheeler
New member
I got my first BB gun (Daisy) at 5. My Granddad bought me a .410 when I was 7. I could keep it in my room but had no shells. I carried it hunting every time I went, again no shells. Granddad would carry my ammo and sometimes let me shoot. I was allowed to carry it loaded at about 10 but only with an adult present and within arms reach. By 13, I could go as I pleased. Guns were always around when I was growing up, almost always several behind every door. All were loaded. I learned not to handle them very early. It always seemed to me that kids who were not raised around guns just couldn't keep their hands off of them. My girls 10 and 15 are not in awe of guns like most kids. It's just a gun, it will hurt you if you mistreat it. My guns stay in the gun cabinet or in my bedroom. My girls guns stay in my cabinet. If they want to shoot or clean them, all they have to do is ask. They are still under extremely close adult supervision and do not carry them loaded yet.
RDW
RDW
I'll admit, my situation was different in a lot of ways. We lived in very rural western Nebraska sandhills and I got my first .22 single shot bolt rifle for my sixth birthday and kept it and my ammo in my room. Dad was a shotgun hunter and didn't own a rifle, but he taught me firearm safety and, so far, I've never had any kind of firearm mishap such a a ND - but I am well aware it could happen tomorrow if I'm not careful.
Got a H&R Handy Gun (.410 pistol - 12" barrel single shot - why it was classed with Tommy Guns only the BATFE knows) from a friend of dad's in 1933 and, with the passing of the NFA in 1934, had to register it and listed the reason for owning it was I was a "Gun Collector". I was nearly eight and my collection consisted of the above mentioned guns plus a .410 double barrel and an old Winchester 94 in Winchester 32 Special.
Here's a picture of me in about 1933 or 1934 with my "trophy rabbits" - photographer was my proud dad whose shadow shows beside me.
Would that we could go back to those days when guns were regarded as tools only - not evil demons. Suffice it to say, though we lived a long way from any formal law enforcement - we didn't ever have a crime problem of any kind.
Got a H&R Handy Gun (.410 pistol - 12" barrel single shot - why it was classed with Tommy Guns only the BATFE knows) from a friend of dad's in 1933 and, with the passing of the NFA in 1934, had to register it and listed the reason for owning it was I was a "Gun Collector". I was nearly eight and my collection consisted of the above mentioned guns plus a .410 double barrel and an old Winchester 94 in Winchester 32 Special.
Here's a picture of me in about 1933 or 1934 with my "trophy rabbits" - photographer was my proud dad whose shadow shows beside me.
Would that we could go back to those days when guns were regarded as tools only - not evil demons. Suffice it to say, though we lived a long way from any formal law enforcement - we didn't ever have a crime problem of any kind.
Gosh, this takes me back!
Dad took my older sister and me hunting about as soon as we could walk along and stay quiet and did the same for my baby brother.
The first BB gun, a little spring-powered one, showed up when my brother was seven, so I would have been 11. Early on, it was my job to "help" him with it. When Dad noticed I was shooting it a lot, I was given a nicer air-rifle that shot pellets or BBs. We'd already had basic safety instruction and knew never to put the BB guns away with a BB ready to go (it was okay to leave the "magazine" loaded, I suspect because Dad knew you can never be sure they are empty; and he was more than firm about muzzle control and finger off the trigger!), but they were considered toys and kept with all the other toys.
Dad's guns were never, ever to be touched without his direct supervision and he stored them unloaded. Where he kept ammunition, I never knew. He was happy to take us to the backyard to shoot his rifle, though (we had a 1950s "bombshelter" in an earth mound that made an excellent backstop, and cornfields for miles behind that. Neighbors on both sides, who never complained -- those were the days!). As a result, none of us ever even thought about messing with Dad's guns when he wasn't around; they weren't that big a deal.
...Only fired the shotgun a couple of times, after a day of "hunting deer" (Dad-speak for tramping around in the woods armed; he wouldn't have terribly minded finding a deer but they weren't really the point. Took me years to realize that). That was a bigger deal but mostly impressed on me that it really wan't a toy!
After baby brother came along, there were always cap guns (I blame those caps for my love of the smell of gunpowder!) and squirt guns around, which were treated as no big deal: they were toys.
I never had a gun of my own growing up and never thought to ask. Even as recently as my youth, it would have been terribly unsuitable for a girl to own any kind of gun. Additionally, I was under the impression they were tremendously expensive and on my parents budget at the time, they were. Nor was Dad into handguns at all. He didn't see the point -- fists were for close up, longarms were for serious threats.
Dad took my older sister and me hunting about as soon as we could walk along and stay quiet and did the same for my baby brother.
The first BB gun, a little spring-powered one, showed up when my brother was seven, so I would have been 11. Early on, it was my job to "help" him with it. When Dad noticed I was shooting it a lot, I was given a nicer air-rifle that shot pellets or BBs. We'd already had basic safety instruction and knew never to put the BB guns away with a BB ready to go (it was okay to leave the "magazine" loaded, I suspect because Dad knew you can never be sure they are empty; and he was more than firm about muzzle control and finger off the trigger!), but they were considered toys and kept with all the other toys.
Dad's guns were never, ever to be touched without his direct supervision and he stored them unloaded. Where he kept ammunition, I never knew. He was happy to take us to the backyard to shoot his rifle, though (we had a 1950s "bombshelter" in an earth mound that made an excellent backstop, and cornfields for miles behind that. Neighbors on both sides, who never complained -- those were the days!). As a result, none of us ever even thought about messing with Dad's guns when he wasn't around; they weren't that big a deal.
...Only fired the shotgun a couple of times, after a day of "hunting deer" (Dad-speak for tramping around in the woods armed; he wouldn't have terribly minded finding a deer but they weren't really the point. Took me years to realize that). That was a bigger deal but mostly impressed on me that it really wan't a toy!
After baby brother came along, there were always cap guns (I blame those caps for my love of the smell of gunpowder!) and squirt guns around, which were treated as no big deal: they were toys.
I never had a gun of my own growing up and never thought to ask. Even as recently as my youth, it would have been terribly unsuitable for a girl to own any kind of gun. Additionally, I was under the impression they were tremendously expensive and on my parents budget at the time, they were. Nor was Dad into handguns at all. He didn't see the point -- fists were for close up, longarms were for serious threats.
aimsqueeze
New member
Ownership and All
Well, here goes some food for thought. I'm 44, got my first air gun around 10 or 11, then a .22, bought my first 12ga. that summer with money from working and a mod. 42 pump .410 from my late grandfather. The rest were one paycheck to the next. We lived a couple hundred yards from the county line and an old farm that had a nice range. We shot over there all the time, all of us policed each other and were careful. Only had a problem once with LE. However, I wouldn't ever give my kids toy guns(three-18,17,12) mostly because of all the junk on TV, I didn't want any confusion. Wife bought them squirt guns when they were 5 and 4. I fussed but let her know that I now had to teach them the diff. between real and fake before I thought they were ready. Had them sit down with me and a Blackhawk and learn all the parts and how to strip and clean. Worked OK with the 5yo, the 4 wandered off after a few minutes. Started them off with light .38's and eye and ear protection (Wife's the one I have the big problem with here) and off we went through life. First Hunter Safety courses at 7 and 6, started a tradition of taking groups of their friends and we had sleepovers, cookouts. Went eight years running. Felt it was a great success.
I keep most all my guns in a safe, though as we hunt or shoot different ones may be out. I rec. locking them up for two reasons, makes it really hard for theives to get them and too many have been stolen, that's our responsibility. Second, you don't always know, though you hope for the best, what a teenager, yours or someone elses, may do. If they are locked up they can't be fired-period!
Well, here goes some food for thought. I'm 44, got my first air gun around 10 or 11, then a .22, bought my first 12ga. that summer with money from working and a mod. 42 pump .410 from my late grandfather. The rest were one paycheck to the next. We lived a couple hundred yards from the county line and an old farm that had a nice range. We shot over there all the time, all of us policed each other and were careful. Only had a problem once with LE. However, I wouldn't ever give my kids toy guns(three-18,17,12) mostly because of all the junk on TV, I didn't want any confusion. Wife bought them squirt guns when they were 5 and 4. I fussed but let her know that I now had to teach them the diff. between real and fake before I thought they were ready. Had them sit down with me and a Blackhawk and learn all the parts and how to strip and clean. Worked OK with the 5yo, the 4 wandered off after a few minutes. Started them off with light .38's and eye and ear protection (Wife's the one I have the big problem with here) and off we went through life. First Hunter Safety courses at 7 and 6, started a tradition of taking groups of their friends and we had sleepovers, cookouts. Went eight years running. Felt it was a great success.
I keep most all my guns in a safe, though as we hunt or shoot different ones may be out. I rec. locking them up for two reasons, makes it really hard for theives to get them and too many have been stolen, that's our responsibility. Second, you don't always know, though you hope for the best, what a teenager, yours or someone elses, may do. If they are locked up they can't be fired-period!
aimsqueeze
New member
Ownership and All #2 goes with above
Now I'll share a heartbreaking story. Last Dec. my middle boy, 16 then, went to spend a Sat. evening with a boy he went to school with but hadn't known long. They met up with my son's friend that he was really close to. This boy was like one of our own, he's been to at least 5 of the H/S courses so he knew better, too. They got someone to get them some beer, first bad mistake. Now my boy's a good kid, I won't make excuses for him when he's wrong. We've raised them loving but hard. They work and farm and cut wood and help me fix cars and equip. Anyway, on the way back to kid one's house they stop by a field out in the country where kid one knew the farmer and rode 4 wheeler's. They decided to see if they could see any deer, so out comes the light from kid 3's truck. No deer. Kid one is holding the light and kid 3 walks to the back of his truck and pulls out a .22 bolt act. My boy asks him what he's gonna do and he says he's gonna shoot the farmer's cows. My boy starts protesting, but he didn't stop him and he didn't leave. After boy 1 takes the gun and fires a few rounds out into the field and boy 3 has shot some they keep after my son to shoot the gun, "we shot, you gotta shoot" Reluctantly he took the gun and fired one or two rounds into the ground in front of them, says "there, happy now, let's go" Now it's questionable as to whether or how many cows were hit then. Where he showed us they were and where the cows were ranges 100 to 125 yds. A .22 doesn't retain a tremendous amount of energy that far out. They go to kid 1's house, he dozes off watching a movie. A couple hours later they wake him up and want him to go out riding around with them. This time boy 3 brings a S/Auto .22 with him. After riding around boy 1 drives back to same field. Son says bad idea, stupid, need to leave etc. They don't and get out of truck and shoot out into the field right much. My boy's in a shere panic and mad as all get out, but peer pressure can be a very persuasive enemy. He leaves early the next morning to meet us at church for 8:30 service. He's got a 38 mile drive to get there, I've got the cell records where I called him twice to make sure he was up and moving. He's 5 minutes late getting to church so he sits with us rather than going up front with all the other teenagers.
He doesn't tell us what happened, scared of what I might do to him and obviously over what happened. Apparently boy 1 and boy 3 make 2 trips back there Sunday morning. Second time was after the owner found the cows and the sheriff was up there. Deputy stops them and asks what they are doing up there and if they know anything about this farmers 4 or 5 cows being shot. Boy 3 stupidly replies" It was 15 or 20 wasn't it?" Go figure! Deputy knows he's got who did it. They come to the HS and question both the next day, take boy 1, who's been sending text messages around about it, into custody and haul him off. Boy 3 goes to my son and says he told the cops it was all boy one, if he wants to keep his name out of it and stay out of trouble he'd better keep his mouth shut. If asked he'd better tell them the same. Second really bad mistake.
When his name kept coming up and boy three finally said he was there but didn't have anything to do with it, they are gonna come get him, big show in the community "We aren't going to have this,etc." Most of the deputies and investigators are friends of mine or my father's. One asked to please let him quietly handle it to find out what happened. He really went out on a limb for us. When he came over I thought it was for some other business we were working on, so try to imagine how you would feel if you were told one of your kids was involved in something like this. Turned out 19 were shot 2 dead outright by the feed gate(didn't find this out till later) one died later that day and several had to be put down to end their suffering. Though I have hunted all my life I won't, nor ever will tolerate a cruel act toward any of God's creatures, my kid's have been raised the same.
While the inves. was talking to my wife and me our boy comes home. I'd already raised cane over this happening and had some choice comments concerning how I felt the perps ought to be treated when they were caught, he had heard it all. I told him he'd better tell them exactly what happened, how it happened, better not leave anything out and better be right. He didn't, he told the story that boy 3 said tell. He was wrong for this, they held boy one for 3 months in lockup and were going to charge boy 3 as a misd. principal in the second degree as a juvi. My boy was only gonna have to be a witness. Ballistics comes back and shows a second gun was used, boy three had supposedly thrown it in a pond, PD had gun one. It hit the fan, they come to my house and want to see all my stuff. When I had to go to the trouble to get the safe open they remarked they wished everyone would keep them locked up like that, it would solve a bunch of problems for them. Well none of mine could have been used because, so there is a lesson here too. They let boy one out and go after my kid and boy 3. 19 felonies at 16 years old. No evidence matters now, he lied. Boy 1 testifies at their hearing and lies through his teeth repeatedly, though he does tell them our son didn't shoot any of the cows. When they put up the maps and show where they dead cows were found on the back side of the farm and right up at the feeding gate our son got real upset and started shaking his head. I wondered what was up here because I had him take me to the farm and show me where they were Sat. night and it wasn't anywhere near where the cows were.
He goes straight to the investigator(my buddy) and demanded to see the map and where they found the cows and recovered 52 shell casings, 41 in one pile and 11 picked from the surrounding grass. 44 match missing gun, 8 match confiscated gun, one from first 41 batch that deputy picked up, 7 in grass that newspaper reporter picks up. First 41 are only ones they will allow as evidence. ( This is a whole other battle) Our son tells inves. that they never went down access road to back of farm Sat. night and we find out they haven't even searched the other place, even though he has been consistent on this point all along. Now he's in deep trouble.
Boy 1 gets deal- 1 aid and abet charge(still a felony) all others dismissed, pay for one cow $1250.00. Commonwealth's attny. knows boy 1 lied, knew before that what he was gonna say didn't match, changed his story further on stand. Tells our lawyer and inves. he knows this and has huge problem, I've got solid evidence that proves it. He doesn't want it coming out in open court trial because he's elected and he doesn't want the voters to know his witness lied and he let him get away with it. Says only way he'll deal is if Boy 3 pleads guilty on all counts, ours either guilty or no contest and he won't push active jail time or appeal to circuit court where any conviction would be as adult for life. I want the truth out, own lawyer is fighting me on it, strikes the no contest deal. Then we find out boy 1 gets 6 month post disposistional program with 30 day reviews and drug ed program. He admitted to smoking pot that night, ours didn't, says boy 1 was taking pills too. Also show up at alternative school twice under the influence. Apparently he gets a craw up his butt and tells the judge "that's not good enough, you'll have to do better(?)" so she takes away the post-D program and gives him the whole 6 months.
In the mean time another kid who has been friends with boy one many years comes to our kid and says boy one told him that he(1) and boy 3 went back Sunday morning after ours left and went to the feed gate, waited for the cows to walk up, opened the doors and massacred them at point blank range. This is verified by the fact that all the recovered bullets, esp. the head and bone shots were shattered beyond ability to put them back together for testing.
Now our lawyer doesn't want to put this boy on to testify and he tells me I have to be quiet and "not upset the apple cart", commonwealth's attny doesn't want any testimony that shows he let perjured testimony stand and insinuates it will be trouble for us if we push it, as if we don't have enough now. Now our kid's life is screwed up, mostly his own fault for lying. It's hard to watch him with all this hanging over his head while waiting on the sentencing. We don't have any money to hire some big wig lawyer, I've been sick for several years and we are barely hanging on to what we have.
So my point is this, peer pressure can make kids do things that absolutely defy rational explanation, one thing I know for sure though; if those guns had been locked up securely and ammo stored somewhere else, the likelyhood of this happening would have been greatly reduced and my wife and I wouldn"t cry our eyes out nearly every day. If you believe in God and Jesus as His Son and Savior, please lift a prayer for our son and family each day. He should be punished for lying and not putting a stop to this Sat. night, but he shouldn't be punished for what happened when he wasn't there. Thanks a bunch to all of you out there.
Now I'll share a heartbreaking story. Last Dec. my middle boy, 16 then, went to spend a Sat. evening with a boy he went to school with but hadn't known long. They met up with my son's friend that he was really close to. This boy was like one of our own, he's been to at least 5 of the H/S courses so he knew better, too. They got someone to get them some beer, first bad mistake. Now my boy's a good kid, I won't make excuses for him when he's wrong. We've raised them loving but hard. They work and farm and cut wood and help me fix cars and equip. Anyway, on the way back to kid one's house they stop by a field out in the country where kid one knew the farmer and rode 4 wheeler's. They decided to see if they could see any deer, so out comes the light from kid 3's truck. No deer. Kid one is holding the light and kid 3 walks to the back of his truck and pulls out a .22 bolt act. My boy asks him what he's gonna do and he says he's gonna shoot the farmer's cows. My boy starts protesting, but he didn't stop him and he didn't leave. After boy 1 takes the gun and fires a few rounds out into the field and boy 3 has shot some they keep after my son to shoot the gun, "we shot, you gotta shoot" Reluctantly he took the gun and fired one or two rounds into the ground in front of them, says "there, happy now, let's go" Now it's questionable as to whether or how many cows were hit then. Where he showed us they were and where the cows were ranges 100 to 125 yds. A .22 doesn't retain a tremendous amount of energy that far out. They go to kid 1's house, he dozes off watching a movie. A couple hours later they wake him up and want him to go out riding around with them. This time boy 3 brings a S/Auto .22 with him. After riding around boy 1 drives back to same field. Son says bad idea, stupid, need to leave etc. They don't and get out of truck and shoot out into the field right much. My boy's in a shere panic and mad as all get out, but peer pressure can be a very persuasive enemy. He leaves early the next morning to meet us at church for 8:30 service. He's got a 38 mile drive to get there, I've got the cell records where I called him twice to make sure he was up and moving. He's 5 minutes late getting to church so he sits with us rather than going up front with all the other teenagers.
He doesn't tell us what happened, scared of what I might do to him and obviously over what happened. Apparently boy 1 and boy 3 make 2 trips back there Sunday morning. Second time was after the owner found the cows and the sheriff was up there. Deputy stops them and asks what they are doing up there and if they know anything about this farmers 4 or 5 cows being shot. Boy 3 stupidly replies" It was 15 or 20 wasn't it?" Go figure! Deputy knows he's got who did it. They come to the HS and question both the next day, take boy 1, who's been sending text messages around about it, into custody and haul him off. Boy 3 goes to my son and says he told the cops it was all boy one, if he wants to keep his name out of it and stay out of trouble he'd better keep his mouth shut. If asked he'd better tell them the same. Second really bad mistake.
When his name kept coming up and boy three finally said he was there but didn't have anything to do with it, they are gonna come get him, big show in the community "We aren't going to have this,etc." Most of the deputies and investigators are friends of mine or my father's. One asked to please let him quietly handle it to find out what happened. He really went out on a limb for us. When he came over I thought it was for some other business we were working on, so try to imagine how you would feel if you were told one of your kids was involved in something like this. Turned out 19 were shot 2 dead outright by the feed gate(didn't find this out till later) one died later that day and several had to be put down to end their suffering. Though I have hunted all my life I won't, nor ever will tolerate a cruel act toward any of God's creatures, my kid's have been raised the same.
While the inves. was talking to my wife and me our boy comes home. I'd already raised cane over this happening and had some choice comments concerning how I felt the perps ought to be treated when they were caught, he had heard it all. I told him he'd better tell them exactly what happened, how it happened, better not leave anything out and better be right. He didn't, he told the story that boy 3 said tell. He was wrong for this, they held boy one for 3 months in lockup and were going to charge boy 3 as a misd. principal in the second degree as a juvi. My boy was only gonna have to be a witness. Ballistics comes back and shows a second gun was used, boy three had supposedly thrown it in a pond, PD had gun one. It hit the fan, they come to my house and want to see all my stuff. When I had to go to the trouble to get the safe open they remarked they wished everyone would keep them locked up like that, it would solve a bunch of problems for them. Well none of mine could have been used because, so there is a lesson here too. They let boy one out and go after my kid and boy 3. 19 felonies at 16 years old. No evidence matters now, he lied. Boy 1 testifies at their hearing and lies through his teeth repeatedly, though he does tell them our son didn't shoot any of the cows. When they put up the maps and show where they dead cows were found on the back side of the farm and right up at the feeding gate our son got real upset and started shaking his head. I wondered what was up here because I had him take me to the farm and show me where they were Sat. night and it wasn't anywhere near where the cows were.
He goes straight to the investigator(my buddy) and demanded to see the map and where they found the cows and recovered 52 shell casings, 41 in one pile and 11 picked from the surrounding grass. 44 match missing gun, 8 match confiscated gun, one from first 41 batch that deputy picked up, 7 in grass that newspaper reporter picks up. First 41 are only ones they will allow as evidence. ( This is a whole other battle) Our son tells inves. that they never went down access road to back of farm Sat. night and we find out they haven't even searched the other place, even though he has been consistent on this point all along. Now he's in deep trouble.
Boy 1 gets deal- 1 aid and abet charge(still a felony) all others dismissed, pay for one cow $1250.00. Commonwealth's attny. knows boy 1 lied, knew before that what he was gonna say didn't match, changed his story further on stand. Tells our lawyer and inves. he knows this and has huge problem, I've got solid evidence that proves it. He doesn't want it coming out in open court trial because he's elected and he doesn't want the voters to know his witness lied and he let him get away with it. Says only way he'll deal is if Boy 3 pleads guilty on all counts, ours either guilty or no contest and he won't push active jail time or appeal to circuit court where any conviction would be as adult for life. I want the truth out, own lawyer is fighting me on it, strikes the no contest deal. Then we find out boy 1 gets 6 month post disposistional program with 30 day reviews and drug ed program. He admitted to smoking pot that night, ours didn't, says boy 1 was taking pills too. Also show up at alternative school twice under the influence. Apparently he gets a craw up his butt and tells the judge "that's not good enough, you'll have to do better(?)" so she takes away the post-D program and gives him the whole 6 months.
In the mean time another kid who has been friends with boy one many years comes to our kid and says boy one told him that he(1) and boy 3 went back Sunday morning after ours left and went to the feed gate, waited for the cows to walk up, opened the doors and massacred them at point blank range. This is verified by the fact that all the recovered bullets, esp. the head and bone shots were shattered beyond ability to put them back together for testing.
Now our lawyer doesn't want to put this boy on to testify and he tells me I have to be quiet and "not upset the apple cart", commonwealth's attny doesn't want any testimony that shows he let perjured testimony stand and insinuates it will be trouble for us if we push it, as if we don't have enough now. Now our kid's life is screwed up, mostly his own fault for lying. It's hard to watch him with all this hanging over his head while waiting on the sentencing. We don't have any money to hire some big wig lawyer, I've been sick for several years and we are barely hanging on to what we have.
So my point is this, peer pressure can make kids do things that absolutely defy rational explanation, one thing I know for sure though; if those guns had been locked up securely and ammo stored somewhere else, the likelyhood of this happening would have been greatly reduced and my wife and I wouldn"t cry our eyes out nearly every day. If you believe in God and Jesus as His Son and Savior, please lift a prayer for our son and family each day. He should be punished for lying and not putting a stop to this Sat. night, but he shouldn't be punished for what happened when he wasn't there. Thanks a bunch to all of you out there.
I got my first shotgun when I was 6 years old, a single shot 4-10. A ruger 10-22 followed about a year after that. Dad always let me keep my guns and my ammo in my room on my gun-rack that he purchased for me. My dad was a strict man and taught me from a very early age to respect firearms and he made it known that if I were ever caught playing with a gun that I would loose any rights to them. I think it all boils down to the child, if they show enough respect when your watching and when they think your not.
shokkazulu
New member
I will be 19 in August and ever sence i was about 10 i had a 22 rifle behind my bed post with a loaded mag though not a round in the chamber. Befor that all the guns with the exeption of a shotgun and and a 22 where locked up. Alough i had access to the key i never "played" with real guns my dad tought me the rights and wrongs of what a gun is for. Now a keep a loaded sks .17hmr, a sig p229 and a walther p22 in my room. Oh i for got i had a BB gun in my room sence i was about 5 never shot at anthing a dident intend to shoot at.
The Real Wyatt
New member
I honestly don't remember when I learned to shoot, sometimes I think I was born knowing how. I got my first gun, a .22 single shot with an octagonal barrel, when I was six. I was the youngest of 6 surviving children. My daddy had died several years earlier and both my older brothers were off in the war and I lived on a subsistence farm with my mom and two older sisters. The gentleman who lived on an adjacent farm felt I needed some male influence in my life so he gave me the .22 and drilled safety into me. He gave me the rifle without any ammo, I was to get the ammo on my own. I worked, I scrounged, I begged for over a month till I could come up with the 11 cents it took to buy a box of shells. I remember that day vividly. It was a gorgeous fall day with the air crisp and sparkling as I walked the 2 1/2 miles to the country store. I was an acutely shy little boy and didn't talk much. I reached up and laid my 11 pennies on the counter and pointed to the box of .22 shells. The lady, Mrs. Johnson I think, teased me a bit by touching everything but the .22s and asking me if that was what I wanted. Finally her hand landed on the .22s and I vigorously nodded my head up and down and held out my hand.
I walked back home, got my gun and walked just over the hill to the edge of a pasture. I put a round in it (don't remember if it was bolt action or break open) and laid the barrel over the second rail on the fence and waited, and waited ... then I saw it. A rabbit not more than 20 yards away. He had probably been there all the time and I just now saw him. I drew a bead on that rabbit and squeezed off the round and ... BANG! the rabbit went down. My first shot ever with my very own gun and I'd killed a rabbit. Shot 'im through the head.
I gathered up my rabbit, ran back to the farmhouse and gave it to my oldest sister. She was thirteen and knew how to clean a rabbit, I didn't. We had rabbit for supper that night. I felt like such a man ... I had provided food for my family ... I was the man of the house.
I walked back home, got my gun and walked just over the hill to the edge of a pasture. I put a round in it (don't remember if it was bolt action or break open) and laid the barrel over the second rail on the fence and waited, and waited ... then I saw it. A rabbit not more than 20 yards away. He had probably been there all the time and I just now saw him. I drew a bead on that rabbit and squeezed off the round and ... BANG! the rabbit went down. My first shot ever with my very own gun and I'd killed a rabbit. Shot 'im through the head.
I gathered up my rabbit, ran back to the farmhouse and gave it to my oldest sister. She was thirteen and knew how to clean a rabbit, I didn't. We had rabbit for supper that night. I felt like such a man ... I had provided food for my family ... I was the man of the house.
guntotin_fool
New member
We lived on the edge of town in Mass. and mom had big garden in back of the back yard,( the yard was the grass part, beyond was the working parts.) As long as i can remember there was a rifle standing there. loaded or at least tube loaded. when i was 9 or so I was to keep the rabbits out of the yard and would spend afternoons reading in the porch with the .22 tilted up in the corner. We moved before i started 8th grade to a suburb of chicago and was shocked at how few kids knew anything about guns. I was upset that dad had left the church we were in to go to Ill because 8th grade was big year, you could bring your .22 or shotgun to school and leave in the teachers coat room so you could hunt on the way home. (4th grade was big too, as that was the year you started scouting and were allowed to carry your boyscout knife to school)
after the summer of my 9th grade year, my parents bought some land in Wisc for a summer place, and we had friends there who had a HUGE garden which was over run with pocket gophers and rabbits and crows. She was whining about the darn animals eating all her tomatos and I just blurted out, I can shoot them for you, and she just starred at me like I was from Mars. My dad assured her I was quite competent with a .22 and i was hired. On the first day I think I shot two boxes of PP winchesters and had a five gallon bucket fill with pocket gophers and about 7 bunnys skinned out. spent many a day after that keeping her garden safe from bunnies and such and spending as much time as possible around her daughter too, even taught her too shoot later that summer.
My kids were never kept from the guns, by age 6 or 7, my daughter was wanting to shoot when we went to granpas. My son had more fun on the tractors till he was a little bit older, then about 8 or so he wanted to go exploring and shooting as much as possible, when he went by himself he could take the bb gun, at age 11 he was carrying the .22 and when grandpa got a new farm that had some wild hogs and other critters on it, at age 12 or 13 he was carrying the 44 trapper. this summer he is spending the summer either golfing, working out, or working on the brother in laws farm and he has taken to carrying my 45 SW when ever he is on the farm, They are just far enough out that feral dogs are a real problem, as people take the dogs on one way drives all the time. The brother in law has been raising more cattle and horses this year and they have had some problems with Dogs running around. They have had far less than they had the years past when they raised more hogs, but he has been doing better raising super premium beefs than hogs so he follows the money.
right now, both kids have a firearm in their bedrooms, both stashed in hides, but the rest of the house guns are in a storeroom ONLY because some of the other kids who show up are not vetted by me on the firearms.
Son has his license and so does daughter, both have gone hunting in the last year without me, Son has also gone with two boys, both from hunting families and both whom I have watched them hunt a lot with us and trust as much as one can.
after the summer of my 9th grade year, my parents bought some land in Wisc for a summer place, and we had friends there who had a HUGE garden which was over run with pocket gophers and rabbits and crows. She was whining about the darn animals eating all her tomatos and I just blurted out, I can shoot them for you, and she just starred at me like I was from Mars. My dad assured her I was quite competent with a .22 and i was hired. On the first day I think I shot two boxes of PP winchesters and had a five gallon bucket fill with pocket gophers and about 7 bunnys skinned out. spent many a day after that keeping her garden safe from bunnies and such and spending as much time as possible around her daughter too, even taught her too shoot later that summer.
My kids were never kept from the guns, by age 6 or 7, my daughter was wanting to shoot when we went to granpas. My son had more fun on the tractors till he was a little bit older, then about 8 or so he wanted to go exploring and shooting as much as possible, when he went by himself he could take the bb gun, at age 11 he was carrying the .22 and when grandpa got a new farm that had some wild hogs and other critters on it, at age 12 or 13 he was carrying the 44 trapper. this summer he is spending the summer either golfing, working out, or working on the brother in laws farm and he has taken to carrying my 45 SW when ever he is on the farm, They are just far enough out that feral dogs are a real problem, as people take the dogs on one way drives all the time. The brother in law has been raising more cattle and horses this year and they have had some problems with Dogs running around. They have had far less than they had the years past when they raised more hogs, but he has been doing better raising super premium beefs than hogs so he follows the money.
right now, both kids have a firearm in their bedrooms, both stashed in hides, but the rest of the house guns are in a storeroom ONLY because some of the other kids who show up are not vetted by me on the firearms.
Son has his license and so does daughter, both have gone hunting in the last year without me, Son has also gone with two boys, both from hunting families and both whom I have watched them hunt a lot with us and trust as much as one can.