Is There an Unmet Need in the World of Bullets?
- Thread starter Brian Pfleuger
- Start date
Brian Pfleuger
Moderator Emeritus
Cheap, bulk are not words that go with custom bullets.
I'm not sure the terms VLD and FB can be in one bullet.
Define "reasonable".
I'm not sure the terms VLD and FB can be in one bullet.
Define "reasonable".
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Pathfinder45
New member
B.C. of SilverTips
Comparable. 270 Winchester 130 grain SilverTips are fairly sharp pointed and they don't flatten their tips in the magazine during recoil. 30-30 SilverTips, on the other hand, have flat points. I think ballistic co-efficience is over emphasized these days. Out to 200 yards there is little difference in trajectory between, say, 180 grain round nose vs the same weight spitzer-boat-tail in the ubiquitous 30-'06 of whatever. The original purpose of spitzers bullets is to greatly extend the effective range of machine guns. For normal hunting distances within the range of what 95% of game is actually taken their is no need for super high B.C. bullets other than to maintain customer loyalty from those who believe it matters. Sales often have a lot more to do with perceived need than actual need. Silvertips may be discontinued because they may cost more to produce than the Power-Point and they do essentially the same job. But the belief that the SilverTip is better, especially for bears, moose, elk etc., induces sales of SilverTips. Everyone except for the ignorant knows that Pepsi tastes better than Coke; but when Coke changed their recipe it made a big uproar. What? No SilverTips? That ain't right! Gotta have SilverTips.
Quote: Cheap, bulk are not the words associated with custom bullets..
Who's going to spread the word and test these bullets Brian? You definetly need to gather a large market, simply by saying "I got custom bullets" ain't going to pack no freight trains, however if they are reasonably price everyone will at least try them, and if you send sample packs out and gain some feedback, it's cheaper for us to test than for you to test...... See where I'm going captain.....
Who's going to spread the word and test these bullets Brian? You definetly need to gather a large market, simply by saying "I got custom bullets" ain't going to pack no freight trains, however if they are reasonably price everyone will at least try them, and if you send sample packs out and gain some feedback, it's cheaper for us to test than for you to test...... See where I'm going captain.....
Brian Pfleuger
Moderator Emeritus
Yeah man... Marketing.
But you've got to be able to sell them for a high enough profit to make it worth your while. It doesn't matter how many you can sell if you can't do it for a profit.
It's absolutely impossible for one man with a swage press to sell jacketed bullets at 20 cents and not worth his time at 40 cents.
These aren't plinking bullets. They have to fill a niche that people are willing to pay to have filled. Either in competition shooting or a small market with little/no bullet available.
But you've got to be able to sell them for a high enough profit to make it worth your while. It doesn't matter how many you can sell if you can't do it for a profit.
It's absolutely impossible for one man with a swage press to sell jacketed bullets at 20 cents and not worth his time at 40 cents.
These aren't plinking bullets. They have to fill a niche that people are willing to pay to have filled. Either in competition shooting or a small market with little/no bullet available.
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Is there a commercially available one in 338 Lapua?
Price is going to have an effect on sales volume, its just a fact of life. I had a company based on the premise that as people had told me this, they were "looking for a demonstrably higher-quality product than what was currently being offered". What they forgot to mention was they did, indeed want a higher-quality product, but weren't prepared to pay more for it than for the mediocre current offering!
How much are you thinking per box?
How much are you thinking per box?
Brian Pfleuger
Moderator Emeritus
I can't answer that until I have an idea of what I might make. Like I said though, at 40 cents a bullet it wouldn't be worth your time, virtually guaranteed. The market is not the guy who wants plinking bullets. These would be premium bullets to do a specific job.
Well, federal/speer brought out the "fusion" bullet in almost all of the above calibers, BUT they weren't available as components. Now, they have introduced the same concept called the deep curl bullet. Both are plated bullets, and ARE bonded!
The fusion, as factory loaded ammo, was overlooked because it didn't cost enough! How could it be a premium bullet at that price?
I got some of the deep curl in 30 cal, 165 grain, loaded them in 30-06, for my 03-A3 springfield. I then shot them into the test medium from the-bullet-test-tube. It performed just like an accu-bond, or Hornady interbond.
The reason more specialty bullets are NOT made is the cost of setting up and doing business. FFL type 06 is required, local and state regulations, tax collection, and the big one, insurance! Cost of core lead, and jackets, AND the expensive shipping is another hurdle.
It CAN be done, but you would be turning a hobby into WORK!. If I HAD to quit hammering keys on this puter, go back and make ammo or bullets to fill an order, I'd hate it real quick!
As far as the "silver tip", it never had any silver on/in it. The tip was aluminum. It being harder resisted deformation, and helped initiate expansion when it hit. A protected point bullet.
buck460XVR
New member
In my opinion, There are already a lot of bullets out there we DO NOT need. Hornady's Zombie bullets are a prime example. With the technology we have today, I believe that using today's standard materials we have gotten the maximum potential outta bullets both for hunting and SD......regardless of what ammo companies want us to believe. The search for the magic bullet has been ongoing since the invention of firearms and will continue until their or our total demise. What I see in the near future is a need for inexpensive and safe alternative to lead and gilding metals for the gun enthusiast that likes to shoot a lot.
Regarding the call for a somewhat "sharper" .312 calibre bullet, Woodleigh Bullets make a 174 grainer that's got a BC of about .362 but you have to get them in from Australia - which is fine if you live there, but can get expensive otherwise. And it's a premium hunter, not something you can take to a range and shoot in a match unless you have a very fat wallet.
I appreciate that what people are calling for here is for Hornady or Speer, say, to sharpen up their heavyweight a little. Alternatively, if they're going to continue to produce a bluff-nosed bullet with a ballistic coefficient not much higher (if at all) than the sectional density, at least have the decency to bring back the 215 grain weight (again available from Woodleigh, but again not the cheapest).
I appreciate that what people are calling for here is for Hornady or Speer, say, to sharpen up their heavyweight a little. Alternatively, if they're going to continue to produce a bluff-nosed bullet with a ballistic coefficient not much higher (if at all) than the sectional density, at least have the decency to bring back the 215 grain weight (again available from Woodleigh, but again not the cheapest).
schmellba99
New member
Sevens:
Precision Delta pretty much matches this to a T. Minimum orders of 2000, I know folks that order in quantities of 10k from them at a time.
The biggest problem with "bulk" bullets most of the time is that they aren't priced like bulk bullets. It's always a function of cost to the buyer.
Precision Delta pretty much matches this to a T. Minimum orders of 2000, I know folks that order in quantities of 10k from them at a time.
The biggest problem with "bulk" bullets most of the time is that they aren't priced like bulk bullets. It's always a function of cost to the buyer.
Precision Delta--for sure!
However, P-D makes 9, .40 and .45 slugs. I know...as I've bought many thousands of them.
However, they don't make a jacketed .357" slug of any weight. They don't make a jacketed .429" of any weight. Boy, I'd do backflips if they churned out a 100 grain .312" jacketed slug, but they'd only be selling bullets to the fifteen of us that enjoy playing with the "one foot in the grave" .327 Federal Magnum.
Believe me, I'm very well aware of Precision Delta, but when I mentioned in my post that finding bulk jacketed in sizes OTHER than 9, .40 and .45, it was with P-D very clearly in mind.
However, P-D makes 9, .40 and .45 slugs. I know...as I've bought many thousands of them.
However, they don't make a jacketed .357" slug of any weight. They don't make a jacketed .429" of any weight. Boy, I'd do backflips if they churned out a 100 grain .312" jacketed slug, but they'd only be selling bullets to the fifteen of us that enjoy playing with the "one foot in the grave" .327 Federal Magnum.
Believe me, I'm very well aware of Precision Delta, but when I mentioned in my post that finding bulk jacketed in sizes OTHER than 9, .40 and .45, it was with P-D very clearly in mind.
I suppose I could be mistaken, but I thought the Hornady Zombie bullet was nothing, NOTHING more than a V-max with a neon-green colored tip and ridiculously flashy packaging.
As such, that entire concept was both idiotic and absolutely BRILLIANT. I can't even imagine the irrational amount of sales they made with that scheme and I would have loved to see the sales pitch of the guy who hatched the idea when he took it to his bosses at Hornady and said, "ummm, I think we need to do this. I'll bet a few people looked at him like he was a complete idiot.
He's probably got a few "employee of the month" plaques on the wall next to the crapper, though.
Robert Palermo
New member
Corbin who mfgs bullet swaging equipment maintains that there are number of bullets and calibers that there is small niche market for and that many have developed small bullet companies that fufill that need thru custom swaging of bullets that can't be commercially bought. I suggest you go to his web site and do some perusing and that might get your brain cells hummimg. Some of these companies are listed in small ads in the back of Handloader magazine.
I wasn't really looking for just a "sharper" bullet, but a "less blunt" one with specifically a flat base.
Its an Enfield thing, Lee Enfield rifling, particularly worn or old 2-groove, will keyhole boat tails in 15 yards!
Horrible, isn't it?
The original Mk VII bullet was a slightly modified woodeigh type, with the alloy or fiber internal tip. With the original sights you're callibrated for a pointed flat base 174 grainer like this & the round nose softpoint 180's are off by just enough to be a problem.
No 3 is the original Mk VII, but at 40 cents a pop I don't see the idea being workable. The other bullets are (1) & (2) 150 gr SPFB & (4) a 174 Gr FMJ-BT of .311" dia.
Magnum Wheel Man
New member
BRIAN... when you get ready to go, let me know, as a guy who reloads way too many cartridges, I'm sure I could help you out... in everything from the 25 caliber bullets I mentioned, to a cast or swaged lead bullet for my antique 44 Bulldog, that I load using cut off 44 special cases, to some of the older Contender chamberings... I'm sure I would be good for a couple bullet weight / profiles you could make... some bullets I'd be happy with 100, others, if you are making bulk lots, I might give them a try as well
good luck in your new business... so are you giving up on Pizza ???
good luck in your new business... so are you giving up on Pizza ???
schmellba99
New member
polygunbag.com has 158 FMJ .357/.38 projos at $31.50/250. No mention of quantity discount or limits on their website, but you may give them a call and see if they'll do better pricing for a bulk order.
Edit, sorry about that - just saw that they are out of stock right now.