How to handle street harassment?

[Bogie]

Excuse me...

Don't compare me with that girly boy.

Seriously, I don't think that the situation called for escalation. MOST situations don't.

Do not fall into "hammer syndrome," where when you give a kid a hammer, all of a sudden everything looks like a nail. Just cuz you have a gun/knife/spray device doesn't mean you necessarily need to use it.

 

[bastiat]

I think you handled it well. That was shown in the result.

However, if he was more of a pest, and I was in your shoes, I probably would have said something like "I'm sorry, but you're making me uncomfortable. You know, like the kind of discomfort you would feel if I kicked you in the giblets. I don't want either of us to be uncomfortable. I think it's best if we're not next to each other."

Then I'd walk away.

If he came at me again and was hostile, I'd gouge him in the eyes. Because he'd be expecting a kick to the giblets.

 

[Quartus]

field expedient vasectomy

I like your attitude, Navy!


Seriously, WyldOne, you did just fine.

I suggest taking a handgun course (two day special) from someone like John Farnum. (And read his "Quips and Quotes - lots of good stuff there.) Even if you don't carry, you'll learn some valuable lessons about handling yourself. It's about attitude and awareness.

Two things, though. First, a bus stop bench is a trap. It doesn't protect your back, but it DOES limit your options. Consider staying on your feet if you are in a suspect area. Or try to sit on the very end where you have at least one more option.

Second, a weapon, be it fist, big dog, mace, knife, or gun, is not for threatening people.

"If you don't... I will...."

Never do that. Use the weapon if you are about to be attacked, but never give warning. If you do, you have

1. Possibly escalated a situation unnecessarily.
   
2. Lost the element of surprise.
   
3. Possibly set yourself up for legal problems.
   [/list=1]
   
   
   Oh, and never ask questions where commands are proper.
   
   "You aren't going to come any closer, are you?"
   
   DON'T DO THAT - it's an invitation. It's prey behaviour. You COMMAND!
   
   "STOP! DO NOT COME ANY CLOSER!"
   
   A commanding voice - not a plea nor a shout nor an hysterical scream.
   
   Project power with your voice. If that doesn't work, use a .45!
   
   
   Ya done good!

 

[yankytrash]

Wyld,

You musta lived in the city awhile. You handled it perfectly. You knew it was coming, you were around people, you had an "out" (glaring at the friend you wisely noticed didn't like the way things were going), you did a perfect job of not getting things escalated.

Get you a short sharp fixed blade knife and some spray, and pointy boots, until Boston starts handing out CCW permits a little more timely.

I also like the suggestion of sunglasses and headphones.

 

[MeekAndMild]

WyldOne, I think you did what was right at the time.

Since I am probably double your weight, have a y chromosome and was raised on some mean streets I can't entirely say I know how you feel. Obviously you can't stuff his head into his nether regions like I could.

But since a medical condition took my ability to yell for help I have bought a police whistle which I keep on a keychain. My wife used to carry a device called a screamer, which is a little box which emits a 120 decibel scream when the lanyard is pulled. Both could draw attention if needed or could just irritate a thug.

I do have one opinion though: don't ever draw on somebody unless you are honestly afraid for your life and can't get away. Never draw unless you shoot as soon as you can. Once the gun is drawn, presuming the life is in danger, then the assailant should be neutralized. No threat, no brandishing and no tears.

 

[LoneStranger]

WyldOne;

Not having been there, I can only reinforce what was said about being seated on the bench. It is not something that you wish to do.

Sounds like your awareness of the problems arrival was good. At that time you should have moved to a standing position and manuvered to keep bench and people between you and problem. That gives you some reaction/running room.

Sorry, But I don't have any magic words of wisdom. Work to stay safe and aware, cause you did good.

 

[adept]

wyld,

first, you done good. you got yourself out of a sticky situation, numerous times while riding the T, i've had the same encounters. some not as peaceful.

what i would suggest is that you place yourself a little away from the bench and remain standing. better yet is if there is a wall, put your back against it. what i have found is that from a position against a wall, you can actually push off of it necessary...to take the offender off balance enough to put some space between you and him. once you have distance in a command tone state "back off" or some similar sentiment.

also, never give up the element of surprise...if you feel threatened enough to pull out mace...USE IT.

also, i'm not fond of the "bluff" because you never know when someone's going to call it.

i do agree with carrying some sort of weapon, if you have not gotten your LTC-A <alp> then get a blade, either fixed or locking AND learn how to use it.

the best way to avoid this sort of situation is to travel in a pack...surround yourself with a number of friends, male...female, doesn't matter...numbers of people can swarm and overcome almost any attacker. <look at ants and bees, etc>

one thing that i have learned growing up around cities and unfriendly sorts is that if you walk about always looking over your shoulder, nervous...chances are someone is going to attempt to give you a reason. walk with confidence, like you belong there and the rest don't.


you have come a long way since you've been here with us and i applaud you for it. if you would like to head to the range some time and fling some bits of lead at paper let me know. always looking for kewl people to shoot with. *grin*

Adept

 

[Brian Gibbons]

If he trys to speak to you ...

try replying in a foreign language. Learn to say "Get lost, I don't understand you" in French or Russian. Barring that, a shot of mace to the face should get the point across in any language. ( If your are not carrying mace, STP Carburator Cleaner works okay too).

 

[skeeter]

When he asked you what was the matter maybe, " I feel so sick now I think I am going to vomit" might convince him to move on.

 

[Hkmp5sd]

Obvisously, I don't know how a female feels in these situations, but this is a case where, based on the description, it didn't reach the level where a weapon could be used. I agree totally with Oleg in that you place, if possible, as much distance as possible between you and the aggressor, just to give you some reaction time.

In addition to carrying a weapon (knife, baton, mace, etc.) you may consider getting one of the little, compressed air horns (like you see/hear at football games). These are good for city dwellers because it will draw a lot of attention to you, it will probably scare the aggressor to death (especially one that is drunk or high), and blow out his ear drums while convincing him you really don't want to be bothered.

 

[stevetuna]

WyldOne - this little Island hick thinks that the city gal did just fine. I must agree with the others who said that perhaps getting away from the bench so that you could scoot if necessary would have been a good idea.

I had a strange situation last night (won't hijack your post, will start a new one) and came home wondering "what if" as well. The good news for both of us is the "coming home" part.

If you ever escape to the Island, stop by and say hello!

 

[Tall Man]

Miss Wyld:

Your response to a quantifiable threat was commendable. I'd venture to say that it would have been just as effective in the absence of the miscreant's apologist friend. Well done.

That being said, I may have an interesting take on the following. I haven't seen it directly addressed yet. You state:

People say things to me on the street a lot, so I guess I'm used to it or something. That's disgusting.

and

Strange males talking to me at night is not okay, they have no reason to say anything to me. If I were to converse with them, they wouldn't get it.

You seem to send the message that an innocuous "Good evening" would activate the repugnancy alarm. And just what wouldn't we men "get"? Is there a lifestyle issue that colors your perception?

Maintaining Condition Yellow in an urban environment like Boston is probably an operational reality. Sometimes, though, a nod and a "Hello" is just that. I know that your fellow offered a lot more than just a greeting that night. Your reaction to him was timely and proportional. It's been my experience, however, that good folks like yourself who otherwise pigeonhole a catergory of individuals (men, in all of our chatty glory) may find it difficult to gain assistance when they truly need it.

Respectfully,
TM

 

[Don Gwinn]

That seems to be a facet of big-city life. Around here, you don't have to know someone to wave and say hello in a friendly voice. But I imagine Wyldone can tell friendly voice and body language from unfriendly.

I think you did everything the way I would have done it with the exception of saying "You don't want to talk to me." I know there are two schools on that, but I try to think in terms of how your tormentor will see it, and I think most will take it as an escalation. I prefer to stay silent. A silent stare is good, and you apparently did it well. Under no circumstances do you warn him that you have pepper spray. As long as you don't use it until you need it, it's not going to matter to anyone that you didn't warn him. Warning him, again, may be taken as a challenge. You want to be perceived as neither challenger nor coward, just someone patiently waiting to see what he will do. You want to seem unafraid to him. You can't really tell if you're dealing with someone looking for a victim or a fight, so either act could get you into trouble. Silence and a confident manner MAY let you avoid either appearance, but if it's misinterpreted, even the stupid ones usually think you're cowed rather than challenging them. That's fine. If you can't have him think you're unafraid and leave you alone, you would rather have him think you're an easy mark until he finds out the hard way.

Finally, as others have said, it's good idea to control your surroundings. Not always practical, but a good idea. If you're standing and he's coming toward your end, you can become interested in a store window nearby. Don't run, don't walk fast, just wander off.

 

[Miss Demeanors]

Hi Denise

As you know, I am a 'city girl' too (Ask Don he'll tell ya how it is here ) and reading your story, I think you basically did ok. While it is a must to be alert, don't get paranoid, been there done that, have a t-shirt. For one, don't stare off into space, be aware of your surroundings. If you see people like you did, DON'T say to them "You do not want to talk to me". It might egg them on. If they start getting near you, get up and move to a position where you will be able to do something should this person come at you. I like to have a little distance and make sure I am not backed into a corner or only have one escape.

As for mace, no you can't just mace someone whether they are high, drunk, or even saying something to you. You CAN have your hand on it (where it is unseen) and have it ready to go, but never just mace someone unless you are getting attacked. I carry mace with me but I also carry knives. I am very comfortable with knives and trust myself more with them than with mace. Mace is just kind of a back up for me.

I see gang bangers all the time at my grocery store and 8 times out of 10 they will start saying something or try to walk closer to me. I have my right hand on my knife, which is in my pocket (they can not see it), and it would take approx two seconds to have it flung out and ready However, I would recommend if you carry a knife to practice opening it over and over and over again, do NOT carry it until you are comfortable with it. You don't want the BG snagging it from you. As you already know, this form of self defense was extremely useful when someone tried to steal my Christmas bags So, IMO, I prefer knives over mace (of course I'd prefer my .380 but thats city life for ya).

Always have something with you at all times and something that is very easily accessable. If something should happen, you won't have time to fumble around in your purse trying to get it out, opening it etc etc. Be one step ahead at all times.

Just keep your head up and stay alert. Remember BG's normally pick the weak and non-attentive victim.

Good luck, stay safe, and try to enjoy life a little bit

 

[spacemanspiff]

i'm most comfortable with a sheathed knife. dont have to open it, just draw it out.

 

[Baba Louie]

W.O.,
Isn't it great, getting all of the good advice from these fine folk?

Next few times you go out, look at other people as prey. Just as a situational awareness exercise.

He was drunk you say? Might be an easy victim, might be belligerant and combative. A stick in the hand that protrudes 1" or so from a closed fist. Owww! Run. Same with OC spray or (God forbid) steel or lead.

Be aware, flash a smile now and then; a look of amusement at others. Keep your hands where they need to be, be watching theirs.

Enjoy your evenings out in the city.

Who is it that said, "Smile at everyone, but have a plan to kill them?" OK maybe not kill, but have a plan, or two, or three. Maybe, "Speak softly, but carry a big stick" is more appropro here. Do you know what a high heel can do to a ribcage or shin?

You're lethal Wyld One, admit it; you wouldn't want to make you angry now would you? Why should others?

Adios Qweeksdraw

You gotta fight, for the right, to PAAARRRTTTYY

 

[MR.G]

Sounds like you handeled it well, since you walked away ok. Anytime someone like that bothers me, when I am sitting somewhere minding my own business, I pull out my knife and nonchalantly start cleaning my finger nails. If they are still too whacked out to take the hint, and try an assault, I will see to it that they get the point.

 

[Bogie]

Guys, remember that, despite what the rollers say, we're primates. Advanced primates, but primates nonetheless...

When you look a primate in the eyes, it tends to start a dominance thing, and with some folks, generally the less intelligent members of our species, it also starts an aggression thing. Don't look at 'em unless you really mean it, and are prepared to back it up.

Personally, I prefer avoidance. I don't "submit." I just ignore and move on, until I can't move on any more. At which point (never been there yet), I figure I'll have to do some thing nasty.

Back when I was practicing alcohol-related crowd control (bar bouncer type stuff) I noticed one sure way to break up a situation: "Oh bleep - here come the cops!"

 

[Blackhawk]

WyldOne,

Don't talk to him. Talk into your cell phone in a loud voice saying "I'm at the bus stop a the corner of First and Last, and there's a drugged out or drunk man here harassing me and the rest of us ... Yeah ... Right, First and Last ... There are 2 of them but only one is causing the problem ... White, maybe 25, 5-10, medium build, scruffy brown hair, scraggly beard, jeans, sloppy plaid shirt ... Huh? ... LESS THAN A MINUTE! THAT'S GREAT! .... "

You might even want to call 911 first, but it's better theatre if you're not bothered by stupid questions like "What's your name? yadda, yadda."

Plan B (for Better)

Don't say anything, and don't look at him. The other people he was harassing were probably giving him the "you vermin" look, which prompted him to ask what was the matter with them. Sometimes it's better to watch with your ears than directly with your eyes. Use your peripheral vision. You can see an amazing amount of what's going on 45 degrees from your line of sight.

================

All in all, you handled it fine, but he was just a space cadet apparently without any malevolent intent.

Rule: Shun! No looking, no talking, no social contact whatsoever. Be prepared to act defensively if threatened. With what? You're in Boston. Is it legal to defend yourself there?

 

[spacemanspiff]

or you could have said that you just found out you were HIV positive. then start coughing.

(no offense to any who are HIV positive.)