SilentHitz
New member
That is the sad truth here.
Castle Doctrine Used on Drunk Fla. Man
- Thread starter hillbillyshooter
- Start date
You cant find anything because of the way the report was written. Who knows for sure what the young man's TRUE intentions were. You dont and neither did the homeowner. For all we know, that kid could have real mischief on his mind. Hopefully the truth will be uncovered in court.
But I will say this, when his key didnt fit the lock on the door to that house, the kid should have stop for a moment and realized...even in his drunken "haze"...that he was at the wrong address. But no...he decided to break in.
It would be easy if lawful occupants of dwellings were mind readers, LEO, shrinks, counselors, lawyers and more... But most are not.
Having consumed max quantities of alcohol, I have been near legally dead on more than one occasion and never ended up inside any home I wasn't invited in or belonged in...
Brent
Having consumed max quantities of alcohol, I have been near legally dead on more than one occasion and never ended up inside any home I wasn't invited in or belonged in...
Brent
Dust Monkey
New member
Owner of the home: "Stop! I have a gun!"
Unknown person(s) breaking in to house: [bang] gun shot rings out. "thanks for letting us know who to shoot first".
You sound like it is my duty to give a potential bad guy a warning. It's not. It's my duty to protect me and mine. Being drunk is not an excuse nor should it be any factor in this. Personal responsibility folks. It's a shame. But the fault is with the drunk idiot. Not the person defending his home and family.
Unknown person(s) breaking in to house: [bang] gun shot rings out. "thanks for letting us know who to shoot first".
You sound like it is my duty to give a potential bad guy a warning. It's not. It's my duty to protect me and mine. Being drunk is not an excuse nor should it be any factor in this. Personal responsibility folks. It's a shame. But the fault is with the drunk idiot. Not the person defending his home and family.
Please explain how anyone in the homeowners position would come to this conclusion in the few seconds it would take to gain entry into the home?
Please point out what leads you to believe he did not?
Please explain how, in the few seconds it takes someone to breech a door, that one is to : Know how many people are trying to gain entry into your home, What their intentions are, their frame of mind, what weapons they may have, and whether a baseball bat will be more effective than a firearm.
And what lead you to this conclusion? do you know this mans physical ability?
or should every "Real Man" just be able to kick someones a$$ as a matter of course?
Truly a sad commentary on our future, and I believe it is not as common with the general student body, as those who are usually predisposed to believe they can kick everyones a$$.
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Brian Pfleuger
Moderator Emeritus
Legally, it depends where you are. In some places, it is your duty. You or I may disagree with the morality of that legality but we either follow it or live with the consequences.
As for "Stop, I have a gun!", I agree that "gun" may not be the place to start. Stop Right There! Who are you, what do you want!" or something similar would be better, IMO. I can not personally for see many, if any, scenarios that I would START with bullets downrange.
stephen426
New member
The Castle Doctrine is not that big a deal in Florida anymore since there is no longer a duty to retreat, even outside the home. Legitimate self defense is legitimate self defense. THE REQUIREMENTS FOR DEADLY FORCE HAVE NOT CHANGED however, and there must still be a threat of death or serious bodily injury if deadly force is not used to prevent it.
With that said... If someone breaks into my house and I am home, they will most likely be staring down the barrel of my shotgun. I will yell that I have a gun and that I will shoot them if they make any moves that suggest they have a weapon. While we can argue the whole "action is faster than reaction" thing and "possibilities of multiple perps" thing, I do not believe in taking a life unless my life is in danger. Tresspassing and drunkedness should not result in an automatic death sentence. We have all been young and stupid (to varying degrees) at some point at our lives. I'm oretty sure we can ascertain what a drunk person looks and acts like and what a home invader looks like. Besides, having a gun pointed at you can be pretty sobering. As long as you can truely justify (to the authorities AND YOURSELF) that your life was in danger and that you had no other option but to take another person's life, then thats fine. Absent that, (regardless of the legal outcome), its murder in my book.
With that said... If someone breaks into my house and I am home, they will most likely be staring down the barrel of my shotgun. I will yell that I have a gun and that I will shoot them if they make any moves that suggest they have a weapon. While we can argue the whole "action is faster than reaction" thing and "possibilities of multiple perps" thing, I do not believe in taking a life unless my life is in danger. Tresspassing and drunkedness should not result in an automatic death sentence. We have all been young and stupid (to varying degrees) at some point at our lives. I'm oretty sure we can ascertain what a drunk person looks and acts like and what a home invader looks like. Besides, having a gun pointed at you can be pretty sobering. As long as you can truely justify (to the authorities AND YOURSELF) that your life was in danger and that you had no other option but to take another person's life, then thats fine. Absent that, (regardless of the legal outcome), its murder in my book.
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Double Naught Spy
New member
Yes, and sometimes when folks do this in their own homes with intruders, then end up dead. Then we have a story about a homeowner was killed in a home invasion.
Being inside the home as an intruder for many of us is a default in the decision process. By the time that happens, multiple laws have been broken and one or more barriers breached. That is a lot of safety margin being crossed. I don't know about you, but I consider an intruder in my house VERY DANGEROUS and hence is a threat to my life and the lives of my family members. To consider otherwise would be naive.
perfectly worded
But, assuming it was my legal "duty", i still wouldnt do it.
it was his legal "duty" not to break into my home
i have no idea of his intentions, and i will not wait to find them out.
The police can do that later with their investigation, it's what they get paid for.
should i have them sign an intent of bodily harm before i defend myself?
should i wait and see if it turns into a "quick draw" match?
should i give a person who breaks into my home any benefit of the doubt at the cost of my own safety?
as far as i'm concerned, the universal answer is "no" to these questions and intruders would be dealt with accordingly
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Hard to say... Was the drunk really confused? Or just brazen because of the drinks?
I don't know about you but a drunk that is beating on your door and then breaks the glass to get in. I feel that would be a threat to my safety.
I lived next to a rental that was used for parties. And I have seen drunks beat each other pretty bad and they where family or friends.. How many people have been beaten to death by drunks over the years?
Just for kicks. Google "drunk man beats to death"
Now give that a think.
I don't know about you but a drunk that is beating on your door and then breaks the glass to get in. I feel that would be a threat to my safety.
I lived next to a rental that was used for parties. And I have seen drunks beat each other pretty bad and they where family or friends.. How many people have been beaten to death by drunks over the years?
Just for kicks. Google "drunk man beats to death"
Now give that a think.
stephen426
New member
I'm hoping there are a lot of other factors involved before you simply shoot someone for being in your home. One thing is the layout of your house. If you are rudely waken up from your beauty sleep from your alarm going off and find a guy standing in your bedroom, I can certainly under wanting to shoot first and ask questions later. If you hear a major ruckus outside and see someone trying to get in, I (personally) do not feel obliged to shoot first. I would yell that I am armed and will shoot if they continue to try to break in. For those of the "Tactic-Cool" mindset, I would do this from some sort of cover to prevent them from knowing my exact location.
Regardless, I know what I would do and you know what you would do. I'll make sure I don't break into your house and I hope you extend me the same courtesy.
Regardless, I know what I would do and you know what you would do. I'll make sure I don't break into your house and I hope you extend me the same courtesy.
Chuckusaret
Moderator
I live in south east Florida where there are some people that have no reguard for anyone else or their property, cars, houses whatever. I live in a town of 9600 people, we have over 125 cars stolen each year on the average, 60 to a 100 house breakins, 100 commercial breakends, not to mention the 1500 or so shop lifters caught each year. Of all the crimes committed only three crimes were committed by a town resident last year, and they were domestic problems, the reminder of the BG's caught were from other towns.
Come on my property, I call the police, treaten me with bodily harm and I shoot, break into my house I shoot, simple. I am glad I live in a state where it is not a crime to protect yourself from scumbags.
Come on my property, I call the police, treaten me with bodily harm and I shoot, break into my house I shoot, simple. I am glad I live in a state where it is not a crime to protect yourself from scumbags.
Really? Where might that be? In some states, there is a duty to RETREAT until you can retreat no further. But where in this country is it your duty to tell anyone that you are armed in your own home? What if the homeowner doesn't speak English, or has a speech impediment, or can not shout...or even speak? What then?
Part of why drunks drive drunk is they are drunk.If they were sober,they would be smart enough to not drive drunk.Gee,officer,I know I wan't supposed to drive drunk,but ,give me a break,I was drunk?
We had a guy here run from the law,jump out and try to swim across a semi-frozen lake.He died.Drunk people do real stooopid things that sometimes get them killed,yawn,so long as they dont kill anyone else.
Regardless of how someone comes to break the glass on someones back door,it can get them killed.The folks inside did nothing wrong.
And,no one can prove the intruders motives were innocent.
We had a guy here run from the law,jump out and try to swim across a semi-frozen lake.He died.Drunk people do real stooopid things that sometimes get them killed,yawn,so long as they dont kill anyone else.
Regardless of how someone comes to break the glass on someones back door,it can get them killed.The folks inside did nothing wrong.
And,no one can prove the intruders motives were innocent.
These topics always go the same way. Those that will shoot first and claim the Castle defense and those that would first assess the situation and shoot only if necessary.
Of course those that would wait ALWAYS end up dead and those that shoot first always end up with a dead intruder and no need to ever explain why they shot.
Frankly, I don't care what you do in YOUR house, claim the Castle Defense or assess the situation before using deadly force. Give me the same courtesy and don't look at every question as a personal attack on your manhood. Sometimesit is just an attempt to understand. Personally I would be happy if I never had to point a gun at another human being, let alone shoot them, and on top of that kill them. Will I do that if I have to? Damn straight if I actually feel my life or my loved one's lives are in danger.
Of course those that would wait ALWAYS end up dead and those that shoot first always end up with a dead intruder and no need to ever explain why they shot.
Frankly, I don't care what you do in YOUR house, claim the Castle Defense or assess the situation before using deadly force. Give me the same courtesy and don't look at every question as a personal attack on your manhood. Sometimesit is just an attempt to understand. Personally I would be happy if I never had to point a gun at another human being, let alone shoot them, and on top of that kill them. Will I do that if I have to? Damn straight if I actually feel my life or my loved one's lives are in danger.
overkill556x45
New member
Yep. That's how it works at my house.
Alcohol is no excuse for bad behavior. How does anyone know the drunk was "just confused" anyway? Maybe he was indeed there to steal some booze or prescription drugs. Maybe worse.
Either way he broke and entered. Maybe it could have been resolved peaceably. Or maybe he would have stolen a kitchen knife and made a lampshade out of the old man in a fit of drunken rage. Either way, alcohol is no excuse--and certainly not grounds for assumption of innocence.
Dust Monkey
New member
Nope. No other factors. The fact that you broke into my home and are standing there is all the "factor" I need to protect my family.
I am not blood thirsty, I do not ever want to have to take a life. But lets be real here. I am not going to wait and see inside my house. I will not retreat, sorry, not an option. Once you enter my house, in a manner that makes me fear for my family and myself, I shoot. Its that simple. No factors needed, no what if's, no give the benefit of the doubt.
Being drunk and stupid hurts sometimes.