Back Country Bandit - A question of Ethics

FirstFreedom

Moderator
Remove the gun far from him. Tie his hands up; then wrap a piece of clothing or gauze around his wound, perhaps cleaning the wound, too. Untie him, take his gun with me and say, If you move before counting to 500 I'll kill you. Then go on my way. Hopefully he can find his way back to a hospital. If not, tough luck. Ditch his gun someplace where he won't find it if it gets too heavy for me to carry, When I get back to civilization, I'll report what happened to the authorities. Don't want to leave him tied up, because then he'd have no chance of survival. Sure ain't gonna go out of my way to help him back, though either.
 

mrawesome22

New member
First would be to search him for any more weapons and his I.D.

Once I had all his weapons collected and his name I would tell him to stay here while I go get help. (Maybe blast one into his thigh so I'm certain he can't go anywhere;))

I was thinking of tying him to a tree with something but didn't think that was feasable. But I guess if he was gut shot, tying him up tight wouldn't really be a big concern. Maybe rip my sleeves off my long sleeve t-shirt? That might do?

Anyway, gut shot and tied up, he can't go far. Right?

But I'd try to get him help.

Another thought I had was "This guy is going to be pumping with adrenaline and is not going to go down from a gut shot. By the time he fell, he might have 6 or 15 holes in him. I doubt he'll be alive by the time I walk up to him."

I love that Hank Jr. song "I've Got Rights". "I said well haus you better get you some corks, 'cause you're gonna have to plug up a few holes!" LOL
 

Abndoc

New member
1. Deep breath to get heart rate down and get body under control, while visually checking for other BGs. Some sort of cover would be appropriate at this time.

2. Complete search of wounded BG.

3. Dress his wounds as best I can.

4. Kick him a couple of times.

5. Go for help, leaving him there. If he is stupid enough to wander off, he will probably die in the woods. If he stays and is still alive when the cops and medics get there, he will be arrested. If he makes it out of the woods, he will still need medical help, and will be arrested.

Through all of this foremost in my mind is my security and safety. I will go home to Mama and the kids at the end of the day.
 

10 MickeyMouse

New member
He drops his gun as he falls. You carefully collect your wallet and see that his gun was damaged enough to be inoperable. He is still alive and alert, in some pain, but not bleeding profusely that you can see. Now the question.

This is just an all-around bad situation.

You can't finish him off, as he's no longer a threat to you.

If he is not mortally wounded, chances are he is mobile; if you leave to get help, he'll probably be gone by the time help arrives and may have found his own savior and preached his own story about being assaulted. Now it's your word against his, and he's the one sporting a bullet hole.

If he is mortally wounded, chances are he'll die before you get back with help. Worse, with no one else to secure the scene, some other hiker/hunter/backpacker may discover him and upset the scene, leaving no evidence that it was a defensive shooting on your part. Now you're up for murder.

If you leave him to die, chances are he'll be discovered eventually (dead or alive). If it is figured out that you shot him and having made no effort to report the incident, you'll be charged with a crime.

If you try to take him with you, you may be putting yourself at risk; If his wound is not that severe, he could be coherent enough to realize that he will be charged with armed robbery, aggrivated assault, etc. and decide that he can't allow that. He could simply try to escape, or he could try to kill you first so that you can't report the incident at all. Then he can get himself help and make up any story he likes.

If you do take him to a hospital, police station, ranger station, etc. and they are able to save him, he will likely sue you and win. He can claim whatever he wants to suggest that he had done nothing wrong, and with no witness's, it's back to his word against yours and he's the one injured.

It really would be a lose-lose situation. I hope to God I am never faced with making such a decision.
 

Edward429451

Moderator
Hmmm interesting.

All sorts of cliched sayings come to mind. It's a nice thought that I/we would be a big enough person to reholster and render aid but...

In this age of free for all litigation, just because he's down does not render him not a threat anymore.

If he's worth shooting once, he's worth shooting again. (Cooper?)

Keep shooting until he's down off his feet and no longer a threat. (Ayoob)

(may be construed to include litigation at this point?)

So given the exact scenario, yes I think I'd shoot him some more. HE started it, I wasn't up there looking for trouble. I doubt the PTSD would be worse for shooting him multiple times rather than once anyway? Besides, he may have a hidden pistol he's ready to pull.

Does this make me bad or as bad as him? Doubtful since I was not in a predatory mode and was defensive in intent. Even so...

We all have it coming, kid. (Eastwood-Unforgiven)

It may sound harsh...but its a harsh world. I wouldn't like it, but I didn't start it. :(
 

DonR101395

New member
As tempting as it would be to just leave him there to think about his demise......
I'm thinking patch him up as best I could, secure his hands and feet, then strap in on the cargo rack of the 4 wheeler just like a deer, and take him to town.
If he were large like an elk it might require him to be quartered first:eek::D
 

Glenn E. Meyer

New member
In the original post, it isn't mentioned in the guy has a weapon out.

Thus, I'll play:

1. Challenge to get him stopped.
2. If he continue to approach, shot to stop
3. If he is stopped, go as fast as I can to inform authorities - stress the guy needs help AND I was in fear of my life.
4. No, I'm not giving first aid or staying with him.
5. After calling law, call lawyer
 

blume357

New member
How damaged is his gun?

what type? how much will it cost to fix?
I ask these questions only because I wonder if it's worth taking with you to replace the cost of the two rounds you will have fired during this experience.
 

BillCA

New member
Glenn,

You might want to clean those reading glasses. :D
As you reach an area with some brush nearby, a fellow pops up with a firearm pointed at you, catching you by surprise from about 15 yards.
 

BillCA

New member
Okay, since this thread has played out...

Dust Monkey recognized the scene right away. It's part of the introduction to John Wayne's last movie The Shootist (but you all knew that anyway, right?).

I wanted to see what people's attitudes were today as compared to story-author Glenn Swarthout's depcition of turn of the century western America. He based the story on a composite of several characters (including John Wesley Hardin) and found that cowboys of that era would be inclined to leave the robber to fend for himself.

They were harsh men in harsh times who did not take well to having what little they had taken at gunpoint. It seems we have become "civilized" mostly through a fear of lawyers and cockeyed DA's who have their own agendas.
 

ConfuseUs

New member
It's part of the introduction to John Wayne's last movie The Shootist (but you all knew that anyway, right?).

Nope. Have watched all of maybe two John Wayne movies in my life. Growing up without TV can leave a person somewhat uneducated. :)
 

blume357

New member
Damn Confuseus.... I suggest a trip to the video (sorry CD store)

Don't get me wrong.... I've never really been a John Wayne fan.... most of his movies he was just too good and perfect...but he does more often than not depict what I was brought up to believe in....

Can anybody give a list of the top 10 J.W. movies for Confuseus to watch? I'll try....

Stagecoach (of course)

Red river....

McClintock and the follow up?

Reo bravo and Eldorado?

Sans of Iwo Jima

The quiet man.


And of course....

True Grit
Rooster Cogburn
&
The Shootest

I think that's more than 10 sorry.... I think that True Grit has to be one of the finest Westerns ever made, even with Glen Campbell's aweful acting.... it followed the book about as close as any movie can..

It is a movie that was made to be watched on the big screen and I would suggest if nothing else... watch it on DVD in wide screen alone without interuption but be prepaired to shed a few tears at the end.
 

dralarms

New member
Well since this is a lose lose situation. If the BG was not going to expire I'd secure the area and get help by any means possible. If he was going to die (more than likely since I train to "stop the threat") I would leave the area, ASAP dig a big deep hole and bury the gun as deep and as far away from
the area as possible.

then I would go and replace the firearm I "lost" in the woods and report mine missing. That way if it does turn up they know I lost it.


J/K But I know I had you gong for a min. :D
 

Doug.38PR

Moderator
I would leave the piece of garbage behind for "a long winter belly ache". Go to the nearest phone, ranger, deputy, station, whatever and call the sheriff or county sanitation to come collect it. Would NOT render him aid or approach him

(John Bernard Books had the right idea)


EDIT: I'll add another factor to the equation:
Before you decide what to do after shooting him, he might have a lot of family in that county and they may have a lot of influence on a judge, DA, Jury (some of them may even be on the jury in such an isolated community...as unlikely as that seems). You are an outsider to the community, an unknown. You have just acted in self defense but because of this you might VERY likely go to jail for life.
What do you do? (sound familiar? Did I mention that after taking your wallet, this unusually "gay" individual wanted you to...squeel like a pig?:eek:)
 
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