Am I the only one who is not enamored but the new PCC rage?
- Thread starter Radny97
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Uh, yes i have. Lots. I mostly shoot at an indoor range.
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Now try it without ear protection, in the dark, in a self defense (or offensive) situation.
Which was my point
If you’re simply talking about a range toy...
Buy whatever you like and who cares whatever anyone else thinks.
Now try it without ear protection, in the dark, in a self defense (or offensive) situation.
Which was my point
If you’re simply talking about a range toy...
Buy whatever you like and who cares whatever anyone else thinks.
Yeah i don’t ever intentionally discharge a firearm without ear protection unless I’m hunting. And i don’t rely on rifles in my self defense set up. Those are my choices, and so a PCC doesn’t fit well into my needs or likes. Of course i have no problem with people making different choices for their own situation. So far it’s been confirmed for me that I’m not really missing anything in regards to the popularity of PCCs.
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Double Naught Spy
New member
Yes, a repeated failure to perceive why anybody would like something that doesn't fit your own personal situation. You are trying to understand a community set of values but ONLY through the filter of what you value as important. You haven't been asking why people like PCCs in the context of their own situations, but how could people like them when you don't perceive any use for them because you have compensated for many of the same things in other manners.
It is sort of like saying you don't understand why a person would drive a pickup truck when you have an SUV and a trailer. Other people's opinions and buying decisions weren't ever going to factor in your perspective.
I also have a camp carbine in 9mm. I love shooting it. At my buds ranch there is a pole on the far side of his pond that used to be there for the catfish feeder. Its about 95 yards from his front porch. We like to ring the pole with it. So far the best is 8 out of 10 shots were hits. The pole is 3" in diameter. So not too bad for off hand shooting with a PCC.
I have shot it out to 200 yards. I believe I can keep all my shots on a mans chest at that range. And it hits harder than you would think. My buds son killed his first deer with the camp carbine. He said it was a pass through shot at 40 yards with blood spurting out both sides. The deer ran 45 yards and dropped. It never made it out of sight. So it could serve as a usable survival gun if needed and is not so loud so as to alert everyone for a mile around.
Its one of the shortest rifles I own. Very handy at around 34" length. And the muzzle blast nothing compared to even a 30-30. I haven't shot it in the dark but I wouldn't think there would be a blinding fireball either. So it should be a decent inside the house SD gun.
I would have one of the new Ruger carbines if the prices weren't so crazy right now. Maybe someday in the future I will get one.
I don't see how you can fairly include pistols (braced or unbraced) in the CARBINE category.
Carbines, by ancient definition are rifles with barrels shorter than the standard (infantry) rifle. That does not mean the barrel has to be short, just shorter than the standard rifle length for that model rifle, as there is no set length that makes something a carbine vs. a rifle.
For example, the German rifle 98 (gewehr 98) has a 29.1" barrel. The carbine 98k (Kar98k) has a 23.6" barrel, longer than most Americans would consider a carbine, but it is a carbine none the less, because it is shorter barreled than the standard infantry rifle.
The M16 is designated a rifle, despite having only a 20" barrel which most folks would consider carbine length. The M4 is a carbine because its barrel is shorter than the M16 "infantry rifle".
No matter the barrel length, one thing rifles and carbines have in common is a buttstock. Intended and made to be fired from the shoulder. A braced pistol, no matter how the brace is actually used, does not have a stock. And, of course an unbraced pistol is just a pistol.
Without a stock, I don't see how you can include it in the carbine category.
jetinteriorguy
New member
I have a Just Right Carbine in 9mm that takes Glock mags and have been loving it for 8 years now, it’s just plain fun. I have a load using 147gr bullets at right around 1200fps that should be a pretty effective round out to fifty yds and can easily keep shots in a 3” circle offhand. My wife isn’t a gun person but I figure in a pinch she could very quickly be effective with it and take care of business if necessary. I also have levers and revolvers in both .357 and .41 mag for even more fun.
I used pistol caliber carbines as part of my home defense assortment. Over the years, I tried a few different ones. The best for me was a semiauto Norinco Uzi...My rifle club had plates at various ranges from 25yds to 100yds.
I too, am pretty skilled with a pistol, and have often shot those plates with different handguns. But with the Uzi, it was much quicker. Going plate to plate at any range was fast and effortless. The 32rd mags helped, too.
However, at some point, I set the intention to put a GI M1 Carbine into the role the pistol caliber carbine filled. I just love the little M1 Carbine, and I like the .30 Carbine round. I’m using the Hornady Critical Defense load now, but I’d be happy with any old soft point load.
So I get why people might turn to a PCC. Even myself...the Ruger PCC in .40 is pretty attractive to me...
I too, am pretty skilled with a pistol, and have often shot those plates with different handguns. But with the Uzi, it was much quicker. Going plate to plate at any range was fast and effortless. The 32rd mags helped, too.
However, at some point, I set the intention to put a GI M1 Carbine into the role the pistol caliber carbine filled. I just love the little M1 Carbine, and I like the .30 Carbine round. I’m using the Hornady Critical Defense load now, but I’d be happy with any old soft point load.
So I get why people might turn to a PCC. Even myself...the Ruger PCC in .40 is pretty attractive to me...
Yep it’s a misnomer. There’s whole you tube videos about this misnomer. But it remains true that they are generally categorized as PCCs even though they clearly aren’t carbines.
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buck460XVR
New member
Probably not, but while the moniker "PCC" may be new, I have been enamored with handgun caliber carbines since my first Ruger Model 44 bought in the late 60s. Wish I never would have traded it, but at the time, a new SxS was more of a priority. Since then I have invested in several handgun caliber carbines. A lever in .357 and .44 mag and a 77/44. All are a hoot to shoot at the range, all are accurate within their parameters and all have taken deer. Reloading makes them inexpensive to shoot a lot at the range and their lower recoil than other bottle necked rifle calibers makes so one can shoot them more comfortably in warm weather. They also are popular with my grand-kids because of their smaller size, lighter weight and lessened recoil. My oldest grand-daughter took her first deer this fall with the 77/44. As for SD/HD they make sense because of their compactness, capacity and with the new designs and technology in calibers like 9mm, bullets have exceptional terminal performance.
If you don't like them, then ignore them and don't start posts on them. Others do, and IMHO, all trigger time is good time, so yes. I am sure several have articulated why they like them, even prefer them.
It's not like if your friend has a PCC he is any better or worse than you and your choices. Let's act like Americans while we still can.
It's not like if your friend has a PCC he is any better or worse than you and your choices. Let's act like Americans while we still can.
Double Naught Spy
New member
You got a link?
Interestingly (again), you disallowed from consideration lever action carbines that clearly are carbines.
Onward Allusion
New member
PCC's are range extenders. They allow a 9mm to go 100 yards with more accuracy than as a pistol alone.
Cheaper to shoot than say 5.56.
Increases muzzle energy by 50% (9mm & 40).
For outdoor work, I'd prefer a rifle caliber. Also, if strictly needed as a range extender, I'd opt for a Micro Roni.
Cheaper to shoot than say 5.56.
Increases muzzle energy by 50% (9mm & 40).
For outdoor work, I'd prefer a rifle caliber. Also, if strictly needed as a range extender, I'd opt for a Micro Roni.
ballisticxlr
New member
My PCC was made in 1943. It has a 15 round detachable magazine, operates super reliably and is as much reviled for being underpowered as it is loved for being easy to shoot. M1Carbine baby. As far as I can tell, the PCC concept has been around for precisely as long as the self contained metallic cartridge. As soon as there was one, there was the other. Hell the original levergun, the Volcanic, used what was basically a pistol round. It was underpowered as all hell and terrified those it was pointed at. Is there a fad today? Yeah because people just awakened to the fact that PCC's have become so much more awesome than they once were. Doesn't make them illegitimate or unuseful.