.38 Wadcutters

[dgludwig]

The only real point is/was that I'm trying to make is that the centers from the hollow-based wadcutter bullets that Mr. Waters was testing separated from the core upon shooting them and posed a threat to the well-being of a revolver by potentially lodging same in the barrel. Mr. Waters advised that, though the bullets being shot were no longer being made, the potential problem posed is something that shooters and bullet makers might should be made alerted to. I'm only reporting his findings.
To those who might disagree with him or his opinions, or believe that he was misleading his readers for some nefarious reasons, I would suggest taking it up with him-except that, sadly, he is no longer with us. Personally, I think he was a very knowledgeable and honorable writer and an honest man whom I greatly respected. If he said it happened, I believe it did. To those who want to nitpick at his findings forty years later, well, have at it.

 

[Nathan]

Doesn't cost me any more to cast a hollow base wadcutter than any other bullet, as in much cheaper than store bought bullets.

Don

Apparently it costs Matt’s bullets something because the hollow base bullets command a $3.50 per 100 premium.

 

[Jim Watson]

I have always heard that hollowbase/hollowpoint bullets were harder to cast, so if you want to make money at it, you have to charge more.

 

[David R]

Bullet caster for many years. A HP or HB are much slower to cast. There is a plug that goes into the mold before casting and removed before dumping the bullet. Much more time. Forget a 6 cavity.

I prefer swaged HBWC because soft lead is all that is needed for 700 fps. I think I stated above, I tried many times to get my 4 cavity H&G #50 Button Nose Wadcutter to shoot as well as a swaged. I can't do it.

I have an OLD H&G # 50 TEN cavity mold. Never used it, its beat and would kill my forearms.

I still shoot solid wadcutters at regular and High velocity. But for Bullseye, can't beat the swaged. Hornady and Speer are available to me.

Enjoy
David

 

[stinkeypete]

I recall loading some double ended wadcutters in to 357 magnum cases for my Blackhawk Vaqueros.

Not knowing any better, seeing as seating the bullets deep in the case was shaving lead, and being of the opinion that any primer will light off bullseye powder the same no matter the case volume, i was crimping on one of the lube bands, such that the bullet was exposed and cartrige length was about the same as a semi-wad cutter assembly.

The fellas at the 25 yard range saw what I was loading and laughed at my ineptitude at not stuffing the wadcutters all the way down the pipe. Then I showed them my targets.

“You shot that from a rest?” They asked.
“No, that’s one handed.” I used to be pretty handy like that.
Silence. Silence. “Well... you can’t argue with that.” They grouped real tight after finding the right load. I had the right load.

Long story short, so long as it isn’t dangerous one never really knows in this game until you try it yourself.

 

[DavidAGO]

Not knowing any better, seeing as seating the bullets deep in the case was shaving lead, and being of the opinion that any primer will light off bullseye powder the same no matter the case volume, i was crimping on one of the lube bands, such that the bullet was exposed and cartrige length was about the same as a semi-wad cutter assembly.

I did the same, casting a Lee 148 gr wadcutter. tumble lubed and would seat them and crimp into the groove. Works great. Looks a bit funny. I have a friend who shoots a model 52, he wanted to try some of mine and of course they did not cycle.

David

 

[reddog81]

Apparently it costs Matt’s bullets something because the hollow base bullets command a $3.50 per 100 premium.

The bullets have the same material costs, however the hollow point and hollow base bullets take extra time and are more finicky. When doing the hollow base it probably requires someone to watch the machine and make sure its running smoothly and dropping the bullets.

 

[David R]

I spent most of the winter trying to beat this target shot at 50 feet with a HBWC loaded ahead of 2.7 grains Bullseye.

Could not do it.

David

 

[USSR]

He was shooting loads using 148 grain hollow-based wadcutters seated over 2.4 grains of Bullseye powder with a light crimp

Imagine my surprise when the always reliable Oehler Model 31 chronotach registered velocities averaging 1,024 feet per second!

dgludwig,

Simply not possible for a 2.4gr load of Bullseye behind a 148gr HBWC to go at over 1,000fps. Heck, it would have trouble making 700fps, since typical load weights for that bullet are 2.7 - 2.8gr of Bullseye. If Mr. Waters was still here, I would tell him that his "always reliable Oehler Model 31 chronotach" was not reliable on that day. While "the bullets being shot were no longer being made" and Mr. Waters is no longer with us, it will have to remain a mystery. However, I would not let this strange occurrence stop me from shooting HBWC's at their intended velocity. Just MHO.

Don

 

[Bill DeShivs]

Read what I wrote again-
The center of the bullets was blowing out. This is what was reading out on the chrono.
The bullets were traveling at minimal velocity. They were found on the floor of the shooting lane.

 

[David R]

I understood it the first time.

David


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[USSR]

The center of the bullets was blowing out

Okay, so I measured a Speer HBWC. OAL is about 0.670", and the hollowbase tapers down into about 0.370" of that. That leaves a solid chunk of lead of a dimension of .358" x .300". Sorry, but I ain't buying that a substandard load of Bullseye is blowing thru that.

Don

 

[dgludwig]

Sorry, but I ain't buying that a substandard load of Bullseye is blowing thru that.

A well-respected and acknowledged expert and author regarding ammunition and reloading for over fifty years vs doubting internet wannabes-guess whose opinions and experiences I'm buying and whose I ain't.

 

[USSR]

Well, all I can say is "experts" have been wrong. Believe what you want, but something is fishy here.

Don

 

[Jim Watson]

Read the cite. It was not a Speer or other name brand hollowpoint, it was an already extinct off brand. Who knows the hollow dimensions or the quality of lead.

 

[ThomasT]

I did the same, casting a Lee 148 gr wadcutter. tumble lubed and would seat them and crimp into the groove. Works great. Looks a bit funny. I have a friend who shoots a model 52, he wanted to try some of mine and of course they did not cycle.

I load the same bullet the same way. About a 1/4" sticking out of the case mouth. They will cycle through my Marlin lever action that way. In a couple of my revolvers with tighter throats you have to push them in place but they shoot good groups.

 

[USSR]

Read the cite. It was not a Speer or other name brand hollowpoint, it was an already extinct off brand. Who knows the hollow dimensions or the quality of lead.

All well and good, Jim. But the poster seems to be lumping all HBWC's together with:
"After reading this account all those many years ago, I have used only solid base wadcutter bullets when reloading for Bullseye competition, whether warranted or not".
Definitely not warranted and HBWC's used correctly are perfectly safe.

Don

 

[Jim Watson]

True.
But ol' Ken leaned to solids in ..38 Special, too.
(The quote on blown through HBWC is from shooting an Indian police contract overrun Ruger Service Six .38/200 = .38 S&W.).

 

[rodfac]

USSR, I've been casting WC's for the past week and can send you some if you like, for your experiments. It's the Lyman mold #35891. (Bevel Base, 3 lube grooves, and a crimping groove, with about 0.010" plus button above the crimp groove. It weighs ~145 gr from my alloy.

Currently I'm using an ACWW alloy with ~2% tin added for mold fill out. I can size/lube (50-50 or LLA) them as necessary, and have a bunch already to go at 0.359". I do have H&I dies for my Lyman 450 in 0.356", 0.357", 0.358", 0.359" & 0.360". Let me know, Don, if you're interested. Rod

 

[USSR]

Rod,

Thanks for your generous offer, however, I've got that mould myself. The testing I want to do involves HBWC's, and the ones I still need are: Hornady, Zero, and Precision Delta. Thanks again.

Don