Who makes hottest .25acp ammo?

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spacecoast

New member
What, exactly, is different about the .25 a.c.p. round that makes it more suitable for handguns than .32 a.c.p., 9x18, or .380? When was the last time you saw a .32 a.c.p., .380 or 9x18 rifle?
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I was responding to a recommendation for .22LR as possibly a better choice due to better ammo choices... which is humorous in today's world in its own right, .22LR at a reasonable price being rarer than hen's teeth.

Back on topic, of course the bigger cartridges are better for handguns.

... and yes, I do find references to rifles chambered in .32 ACP, .380 ACP and 9x18 Mak.
 
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Walt Sherrill

New member
RE: .25 acp...

spacecoast said:
I was responding to a recommendation for .22LR as possibly a better choice due to better ammo choices... which is humorous in today's world in its own right, .22LR at a reasonable price being rarer than hen's teeth.
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Those hen's teeth can be found on store shelves, nowadays, and you don't have to mortgage your house to buy a brick. (I've been on vacation this week and have noticed signs in gun shop windows saying, "ammo - no limits.")

We agree, at least, on the likely ineffectiveness of the .22 round when used in a short-barreled pistol. Unless that round is shot out of a longer barrel, it doesn't perform particularly well. The same is true of the more-powerful .22 Magnum -- which is not impressive when shot from the shortest barrels. More importantly, most of us who have shot a lot of .22 over the years have probably had FAR MORE ignition failures with .22 than in all other rounds, combined. THAT alone would dissuade me from using it for self defense...

You said you've seen references to .32 acp, .380, and 9x18 rifles -- if so, you've used your reference books or search engines far more effectively than I have. I've only seen .32 acp used in a special class of rifle-like weapons (sub-guns and auto-pistols, which are really a different category of weapon), and I've never encountered a .380 or 9x18 rifle. (A sub-gun in 9x18 wouldn't surprise me, but I've never run into that beast, either.) I did find a reference to a .25 acp rifle, but it was a one-of-a-kind project gun.

I personally can't understand why anyone would want a .25 acp weapon when there are so many other options in terms of weapons and commercially-available ammo in slightly larger calibers. And, some of the smallest .32 and .380 guns are not much larger than the .25 pistols.

I know a .25 acp pistol is better than a pointed stick, but...
 
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Skans

Active member
I personally can't understand why anyone would want a .25 acp weapon when there are so many other options in terms of weapons and commercially-available ammo in slightly larger calibers. And, some of the smallest .32 and .380 guns are not much larger than the .25 pistols.
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I will give you my reason for originally asking this question. I want to buy a Braverman Pen gun. They are quite an impractical, expensive novelty - I realize this, can afford it, and no, it wouldn't be my primary carry gun, a BUG, or anything of the sort. They were made in several calibers, but the ones that come up from time to time are in .25acp and .22lr. I understand all too well about .22lr v. ordinary .25acp debate, that's why I didn't really want to get into that.

But, if .25acp is made in a "hot round", that might make the .25acp Braverman a little more interesting to me. If not, then the convenience and variety of .22lr is appealing. I wouldn't be shooting the little Braverman very much, so it's not worth me setting up to reload a few "hot" .25acp cartridges for it.
 
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Walt Sherrill

New member
...it wouldn't be my primary carry gun, a BUG, or anything of the sort.
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O.K. It's a novelty, and one that you can afford. THAT I understand. Something to talk about.

That said, I don't understand why a "hotter" load would even be of interest with a pen gun. If it won't be your carry gun, or even a BUG, you should just find something that it shoots reasonably well! The gun shown doesn't have sights, and if it did, they'd arguably be difficult to use -- as it's apparently designed for use at almost-contact range.

It seems like very-well-made zip gun.

Penguns:

http://pengun.com/theguns.htm
 
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Skans

Active member
The gun shown doesn't have sights, and if it did, they'd arguably be difficult to use -- as it's apparently designed for use at almost-contact range.
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Because if I get one, I want the model which is the most effective at very short distances. Why? I guess for the same reason I want one in the first place - it just floats my boat; and I would like to test it out for short range effectiveness. Ahhh, what the heck, let's admit it - it's for the "fun factor":D

FWIW, they made one in .380 as well, so there should be no danger in firing off a hot .25acp in this little stick-gun.
 
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skoro

New member
Despite the internet legends...

... of 25acp bullets ricocheting off eggshells and then being lodged in wet Pampers, I got myself a Beretta 950 Jetfire a few months ago. What a neat little poodle shooter. I like this tiny little pistol a whole lot, but doubt I'll ever carry it.

Look, everyone knows the 25acp is an anemic round. But it's still a lead projectile moving at high speed and it can be deadly. Don't kid yourselves.
 
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Walt Sherrill

New member
Well... as I said: "A sub-gun in 9x18 wouldn't surprise me, but I've never run into that beast..."

I guess I've now run into it, and I'm not surprised.

Thanks for the link. I actually think that gun makes sense -- particularly for police use in an urban environment, inside buildings, etc.
 
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JERRYS.

New member
in a .25acp id stick with 50gr. FMJ to ensure adequate penetration. if you could find a 50gr. FMJ that actually moves at 850 fps from a mini gun like a Beretta 950BS youd have something really to consider.
 
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Clark

New member
CAUTION: The following post includes loading data beyond or not covered by currently published maximums for this cartridge. USE AT YOUR OWN RISK. Neither the writer, The Firing Line, nor the staff of TFL assume any liability for any damage or injury resulting from use of this information.

When I hand load the 25acp hot, the recoil hurts worse than 44 mag 240 gr at 1250 fps.

I have only worked up loads in (3) 25acp pistols:
1) Colt 1908
2) Beretta 950
3) Vesta [old Spanish import]

I had already overloaded more than two dozen other cartridges before I overloaded the 25acp, so I already had a procedure and knew what to look for to end the work up.

That does not mean other people know what they are doing. This is like climbing mountains, handling poisonous snakes, or racing motorcycles. Over loading guns to see what happens should be left to those who can manage the risks.

Maximum published load:
1.3 gr Bullseye 50 gr FMJ
penetrates 250 pages of the phone book.

Working up from the published load:
a) 2.75 gr Bullseye 50 gr FMJ
Vesta piercers primer from poor firing pin fit, other pistols ok
b) 3.2 gr Bullseye 50 gr FMJ
case is full, no more powder will fit.
penetrates 770 pages of the phone book, still has wimpy recoil

Making up new load:
a) 4.0 gr Power Pistol 50 gr FMJ
This is the most recoil most people can take. It hurts.
b) 6.0 gr Power Pistol 50 gr FMJ
primer falls out. Failure to extract.
 
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Auto5

New member
I wouldn't recommend a "hot" .25 in the Braverman pen gun. I made that mistake a few years ago with a .25 MagSafe round. The higher pressure round locked it up so tight I couldn't get it unscrewed. The smith finally had to put in a padded vise to get the fired case out.
 
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Archie

New member
Haven't tried them all...

But, results of chronograph testing - average of five shots - from Beretta 418 pistol, 6.35mm:

MagTech (50 grain FMJ): 834 fps

Olin (50 grain FMJ): 766 fps

Aguila (50 grain FMJ): 758 fps

I'm planning on testing some Fiocchi ammunition in the near future, but I'm self-funding and that commodity isn't on top of the expenditures list. Yet.
 
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Armed_Chicagoan

New member
When your .25 pocket pistol is empty you can throw it at your attacker, it will hit with about 45 ft-lbs of energy if you have a decent arm. ;)
 
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michael t

New member
MagSafe: 22gr @ 1750 fps (from a Beretta model 21)
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That's same a glaser type junk no penetration 22gr bullet Even the glaser is 35 grain and has shown to be useless except on water jugs .


Show me the proof of even 8" of penetration and those Vol.

Another magic bullet Guess I go do some deer hunting with some. :rolleyes:
 
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