Who Feels Like They Are Well Armed If Needed?

[44 AMP]

How to handle such a situation short of drawing my concealed firearm

You call your waiter.
He calls the manager.
The manager calls the cops.

Probably wouldn't hurt to call the cops on your cell phone, yourself, either...

Remember disparity of force works both ways. A dozen young punks might be able to beat you to death, but you can't shoot them just because they make you worried and uncomfortable.

Of course, that can change in an instant, but if it does you're on different legal ground then.

They are disturbing the peace at a public eatery, its the manager's job to have the staff eject them, and if the staff can't, then its time for the cops to step in.

Be aware, be prepared but remember you may only legally act "in gravest extreme".

 

[vito]

During the incident I described, the restaurant manager was apparently scared into paralysis, and the police had been ordered to stand down. The mayor here, as in so many other locations, was terrified apparently of doing anything to stop the so-called protesters. The protesters were becoming more emboldened by the day as they saw that the authorities were unwilling to confront them, even when looting occurred. Calling 911 would have done absolutely nothing, as would expecting some restaurant manager to interfere with the actions of these thugs under the BLM banner, all supposedly upset about George Floyd, a clear pretext for mayhem. Had I been present I would hope that I would have had the sense of situational awareness to know that I was on my own to either stand up to these thugs or surrender to their demands. There likely would not be any acceptable outcome to this but if I stood up to them, up to and including the use of a firearm, I would at least have retained my self respect.

 

[shurshot]

If it were me, to keep the peace and avoid conflict, I would have just smiled, raised my fist in agreement / support and then gone back to enjoying my meal. Nothing wrong with verbal judo / desculation techniques, especially with a plate of hot food in front you and being vastly outnumbered with ZERO police support.

#1 objective is to avoid conflict and protect yourself and spouse, right? Protesters in the aforementioned example weren't robbing or assaulting customers, just being loud, upset and demanding verbal support? Is that worth conflict? Seriously? Easy choice for me, just smile and agree. After all, what happened to Mr. Floyd WAS horrific & wrong. Show support, they continue down the street and you can finish your meal in peace. No harm done.

Our best weapon is located between our ears.

 

[KyJim]

If it were me, to keep the peace and avoid conflict, I would have just smiled, raised my fist in agreement / support and then gone back to enjoying my meal. Nothing wrong with verbal judo / desculation techniques, especially with a plate of hot food in front you and being vastly outnumbered.

#1 objective is to avoid conflict and protect yourself and spouse, right? Protesters in the aforementioned example weren't robbing or assaulting customers, just being loud, upset and demanding verbal support? Is that worth conflict? Seriously? Easy choice for me, just smile and agree. After all, what happened to Mr. Floyd WAS horrific & wrong.

Our best weapon is located between our ears.

I don't consider myself to be confrontational. Yet, someone compelling me to speak on a political topic, whether I believe as they do or not, crosses the line. I won't do it. I would, however, either leave or engage such people in conversation in an attempt to de-escalate the situation. I would use violence only when left with no choice.

 

[stagpanther]

vI can't imagine a better way to defeat social unrest than a Maine winter.

Except there is no winter here yet. Felt like spring today.

Until I have my own personal ICBM with nukes in my garage--I'll never feel adequately armed.

 

[seanc]

#1 objective is to avoid conflict and protect yourself and spouse, right? Protesters in the aforementioned example weren't robbing or assaulting customers, just being loud, upset and demanding verbal support? Is that worth conflict? Seriously? Easy choice for me, just smile and agree.

Disgusting! And this wasn't an isolated incident. Each of these clearly a case of assault. Not necessarily needing to be responded with lethal force, but shouldn't be ignored. Vito has valid concerns. There were a few cases that were publicized where the restaurant staff/managers resisted the "mostly peaceful" protesters. All that is necessary for evil to succeed is that good men do nothing. Doing something doesn't mean you have to kill everyone in sight, but it definitely does mean not raising your hand in a fascist salute to enjoy your meal. Having a non-lethal means to defend yourself is just as critical to "being prepared" and probably more realistic than having only having lethal force options.

 

[stagpanther]

https://d2eehagpk5cl65.cloudfront.n...en-Shot-2020-08-25-at-5.38.26-PM-1200x675.png

Right about now Kyle Rittenhouse would be opening fire.

 

[ballardw]

I have thought about the type of mob I am most likely to encounter. I can see the county jail, about 100 yards from where I sit typing this. There are 4 mental hospitals within 3 blocks as well. More worried about a jail break than the hospitals but you never know.

 

[seanc]

stagpanther:

Right about now Kyle Rittenhouse would be opening fire.

Not even comparable. The difference is the potential for violence and actual violence that precipitates a response. If you're not familiar with KR's situation, he was assaulted by multiple people, and as a jury of 1, it appeared to me he was legitimately in fear of great bodily harm. There are times you can defend yourself with less than lethal means if threatened. That's more likely to be the case but I bet most of the "prepared" people are only prepared to respond with lethal force. A tactical nuke isn't always appropriate.

 

[brasscollector]

All you'd have to wave at that mob to get them to disperse would be some deodorant. I don't even see a potential weapon displayed. Just a bunch of suburbanites looking for a virtuous victory. The KR situation was quite different than what is happening in that picture.

 

[shurshot]

"Each of these clearly a case of assault."(Seanc)

"Assault"? As pictured?? "Facist salutes"? Uh, no. Intimidation, yes. Disturbing the peace would be a more accurate description / law violation. Disgusting behavior? I agree 100%. A bunch of passionate college kids with ZERO respect or boundaries in the above photo.

But that's still NOT "assault", at least by definition in most States. And NOT a situation for ego and weapons to get mixed into.
I'll repeat... Our best weapon is located between our ears.

 

[Mainah]

All you'd have to wave at that mob to get them to disperse would be some deodorant. I don't even see a potential weapon displayed. Just a bunch of suburbanites looking for a virtuous victory. The KR situation was quite different than what is happening in that picture.

Yeah, some deodorant or a job application.

One threat I see is COVID exposure. It'll be interesting to see what happens when the first case of self-defense based on a lack of social distancing pops up.

 

[Pistoler0]

If riots, looting, and social unrest continue, how many of you feel like you are sufficiently armed to deal with the unrest circumstances?

"Well armed" for what situation exactly? Because it depends.

- For home invasion: YES. Estimate needs 20 rounds max?
- For protests: I don't think it is necessary to arm yourself for protest IF a protest is just that, regardless of whether I agree with their point. If protest degenerates into something else, see next.
- As a business owner, to defend from looting? YES. Same as home invasion.
- For temporary brake down of law and order ala New Orleans - post Katrina? YES, I don't think the requirements would be very different from those for the home invasion. But estimate: maybe 100 rds?
- For total, permanent brake down of law and order: NO
- For defense against tyrannical government, and for civil war? NO, impossible, cannot defend against that unless you join one of the warring sides and you are part of their logistics and tactical side.
- For zombie apocalypse? Yes, because I also have a chainsaw.
- Most important: for practicing my firearms shooting hobby, to enhance marksmanship, participate in competitions, and spend time with my firearms friends shooting at the range? NO, I do not have enough rounds for that, and right now it is my biggest worry.

IMHO the problem with the scenario of the diners being harassed at a restaurant, which Vito mentions in post #60, is that no amount of firepower can solve that situation. First of all, counting on escalation to pepper spray or a firearm to defuse the situation rests on the assumption that none of the assailants is armed, or that if they are, that they are not willing to use their weapons. I think that in that situation, a cellphone with recording ability is/was indeed the best self defense weapon.

 

[Pistoler0]

To be well armed it has to be belt fed, automatic.

Or in the multi-kiloton range.

he he, I liked your post, how true!

But for the multikiloton scenario, you also need a delivery means.

 

[44 AMP]

But for the multikiloton scenario, you also need a delivery means.

Tactical nuclear hand grenade!!

Just be sure the hole you dive into after throwing it is really, really DEEP!

 

[Pistoler0]

Most people on TFL probably don't even live in the heart of any large city, urban area.
Almost every riot and major demonstration has been in major commercial areas. The mass media thrive on such visual addictions for television, but prefer mass murder, aircraft accidents, police self-defense shootings.

Woops...I almost forgot that rekindling vague anxiety is required to help more people be able to ...Finally...sell the huge number of their superfluous guns on Armslist TN (and Many guns I've watched on Gunbroker),
which sit there now, month, after month...

$$$ $$$.

"I make my leaving on the evening news, just give me something, something I can use, people love it when you lose, they love dirty laundry"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YHimia_Fxzs

 

[rickyrick]

Being that the closest law enforcement structure to my home, had its flags pulled down and burned in the street... I will probably just wait in my house and be ready to leave.