Soft target penetration: 9mm carbine vs .223 carbine

[Bartholomew Roberts]

In answer to the OP's question, much depends on bullet design; but on average 9mm will out penetrate .223 in ballistics gel. As others pointed out, at very high velocities, the bullet breaks up and the individual fragments shed energy rapidly. A heavier, slower moving bullet that stays together penetrates more.

Anyone who doubts this can check out: www.brassfetcher.com to see for themselves.

 

[Delaware_Dan]

I think hairs are starting to be split over words here now.

Agreed.

To clear things up, I am questioning the over penetration of the 2 mentioned rounds after passing through a soft (human) target into a "hard" target (walls in a home). I am not concerned about body armor penetration. Hope this clears things up.

 

[MLeake]

Please bear in mind that bullet construction matters.

55gr 5.56mm isn't a great penetrator (though it does well on most light body armor), but that's why the standard military rounds are heavier, and constructed for penetration.

One of the penetrator rounds will penetrate soft target and then drywall much better than one of the Wal-Mart 55gr rounds.

Same with the 9mm; some bullet types penetrate better than others.

For HD, when overpenetration is a concern, a lightweight frangible or semifrangible 5.56mm should actually be viable.

 

[JohnKSa]

Images from www.firearmstactical.com

124gr FMJ 9mm

55gr FMJ 5.56

62gr FMJ 5.56

Included for comparison and just for fun. This is a 40grn Lead bullet from a .22LR. Note that it penetrates deeper than either of the 5.56 loadings tested.

It's worth pointing out that the two 5.56 loadings are almost certainly fired from an M16 length barrel, not the M4 carbine. The lower velocity from the carbine might contribute to less fragmentation and therefore more penetration, but without specific testing it's hard to say.

I believe it's safe to say that an FMJ 9mm will have more penetration potential after going through an attacker than an FMJ 5.56/223 bullet would have. Of course, few people recommend FMJ 9mm for self/home defense so the point is probably moot.

 

[MCCALL911]

Thanks for posting that, John. I didn't know whether I could do that or not, given the current restraints of that lawsuit. :barf:
Those pics tell the tale IMO.

 

[Delaware_Dan]

I believe it's safe to say that an FMJ 9mm will have more penetration potential after going through an attacker than an FMJ 5.56/223 bullet would have.

Thanks John, clear and to the point. That was exactly what I was looking for. Thanks to everyone else who had a constructive post as well.

-Dan

 

[BGutzman]

I take heat for this all the time but having carried a M16A2 into battle I can say I was totally unimpressed by its ability to be defeated by thin mud walls. I know every guy with an AR doesn't want to believe they bought anything less than a hyperdeadly weapon, unfortunately in my experience it isnt a very good military round.

Why would anyone think a round based on the 22 would be good for battle?

Yes I know every AR is the deadliest thing ever invented, just make mine a 6.8 or larger.

Dont believe me, see a military recruiter near you and go find out if what you think is true....

 

[BGutzman]

And yes of course I must be faking, it couldnt be true. Right???

 

[MLeake]

BGutzman...

... I think you are missing the OP's point.

He wants something that is NOT likely to penetrate walls after hitting (or missing, though he left that possibility out) a BG inside the home.

Not penetrating walls efficiently is a PLUS for his scenario.

It's not great for yours. Then again, that's why there are supposed to be squad marksman, M203, etc.

 

[Delaware_Dan]

Gutzman, thanks for describing your personal experiences, and for your service. It's not everyday you will read first hand accounts and it's appreciated.