Sig 220 or HK USP .45

[meat]

I'm torn between a Sig 220 and an HK USP .45. Which one should I get? I know what you'll already say Ala Dan.
I want votes to be based on overall service life, reliability, durability, gunsmithing/ maintenance ease, and most importantly, personal experience. I know that they are both so close in all of these criteria, but I'm just looking for some additional input/comments. Thanks in advance.

 

[VVG]

I have never handled the HK, but I am extremely well pleased with the P220 two-tone I bought last year. Flawless reliability, excellent accuracy, good availability of holsters, grips and other accesories.

 

[pogo2]

They are both good guns, but I would give a slight edge to the H&K USP because it is:

- More durable in construction
- Higher in magazine capacity
- More resistant to rust and corrosion
- Lighter weight due to polymer frame vs. aluminum

 

[cslinger]

SIG 220

Why settle for something inferior, get the 220.

The HK is a great gun, I am an avowed SIG guy though.

 

[agtman]

Get the Sig 220.


Your wallet will thank you.

And a better pistol, in my opinion. I had one with night sites. Extremely accurate, and the cost of several extra mags won't rip the wallet out of your a$$.

I saw a fullsize .45 USP today. $835.

Seemed large, but I also like the big Smith guns, so size really isn't an issue (for me). I'm finicky about how a pistol's grip feels so I handled it, and the USP fit my hand very nicely. That euro nouveau mag-release isn't for me, but YMMV. I also looked around for that big colorful HK ninja-swat poster but, apparently, for $835 they don't give you one. Also, the pimple-faced counterguy was uncertain as to whether the USPs actually come with an official factory Certification that they're the first choice of anti-terrorist operatives. I did, however, like the USP's cocked & locked option. Trigger pull was also nice.

All said, for the $$$ involved, you can't lose with the Sig.

 

[oops]

I've discussed both guns in my "Fondling vs. shooting" thread. Both are fine and durable weapons. Do you prefer D/A 1st shot, S/A follow up shots or do you prefer all S/A shots by carrying cocked and locked. It comes down to which ever one you feel more comfortable carrying and which one you shoot better. For me it's the H&K cocked and locked (but it still can be carried and used the same as the Sig; D/A, S/A)

 

[IanS]

Even they're both designated as full size pistols the P220 is lighter and slimmer while the USP is larger, holds more bullets, and I think a little less muzzle flip. I'd give the edge to the P220 in accuracy and reliability but just slightly. I prefer the DA/SA trigger on the P220 but the USP var.1 does allow one to carry cocked and locked for those who are willing to train. If CCW isn't a huge priority with you I'd say its pretty much a toss up since they're both top choices in full size modern autos (along with the Glock 21 and CZ 97).

Anyways, I voted for the P220 since its more comfortable for carry.

 

[Shake]

agtman ,

I think we've had this conversation before. . .

If you really want to pay as much as possible for an H&K (or any firearm for that matter) you'll have retailers standing in line to do business with you. Nobody needs to pay the kind of price you mentioned for a H&K USP .45.

A quick look at my local shops prices show the SIG 220 and the H&K USP .45 full size going for identical prices of $699. You can choose where you shop and who you buy from.

And really, if you think H&K is the only manufacturer who pimps the whole "special forces" angle and benefits from it, try visiting SIG's web site. . . " What makes the SIG pistols the weapons of choice for elite units around the world", "In use by the U.S. Navy SEALS, Federal agents, and numerous law enforcement agencies including the Ohio State Highway Patrol, Texas Department of Public Safety and the Michigan State Police to name a few", etc., etc.

Now I'm the last guy that will dispute the fact that SIGs are fine pieces of machinery, but reality is reality. USPs are in the same general price range as SIGs. Unless you want to get bent.

Shake

 

[Shake]

Ian11 ,

No offense intended, but the SIG 220 is NOT lighter and slimmer than the full size H&K USP .45.

H&K SIG
Length 7.8 in. 7.8 in.
Height 5.5 in. 5.6 in.
Width 1.2 in. 1.4 in.
Weight 27.7 oz. 27.8 oz.

It appears the opposite is true (the above numbers came from both manufacturers web sites, check them out if you care to).

Overall these two guns are very comparable, although the USP does what the 220 does in the same size package, but adds several rounds of capacity FWIW.

It honestly comes down to personal preference. One can't go wrong by choosing either.

I don't think one should decide which firearm to get based on the results of an internet poll. Given quality manufacturers and firearms tailored to the task, personal preference should win out everytime.

Shake

 

[Kermit]

We've all been down this road before My vote, by the way, is w/ the USP 45 Try a search on this topic, you'll probably get alot of info!

 

[Ala Dan]

The world class Sig-Sauer P220 , with its proven track record = PRICELESS!

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

 

[Redlg155]

Both are great weapons. It all boils down to individual features. I do like the extra benefit of the manual safety in the HK and the ability to carry cocked n locked if I so desire.

I wouldn't rule out the HK USP Compact either. It really isn't a compact weapon, but rather a scaled down version. It also has a very respectable 8 + 1 capacity. A good choice if concealed carry is an option. Both the P220 and the USP are relatively large weapons.

I personally like the polymer frame weapons. Steel or Alloy frame weapons can get pretty hot or cold depending on the season. That can be rough on the ol hide when carrying IWB.

Good SHooting
RED

 

[SVTNate]

I voted for the USP 45. Why? Because I own one, I love it, and I think it's the best .45 ever!

I haven't shot a P220, but I'd really like to. I've shot some other SIG's, though. I prefer polymer frames, and I really love the mag release lever. I have no doubt that the 220 is a great gun though, and it's first on my list of "gotta try it out" guns.

I also own a Glock 30, which is a great .45 too. Not as great as an HK though!

 

[IanS]

Shake,

No, offense taken. If what I said was patently wrong I'm glad someone came along and corrected said mistake. What I said was based on the impressions I got from owning a P220 and many range sessions with the HK USPf .45. So I'd like to amend my above comment with "Subjectively, the P220 felt slimmer and more compact than the USPf, being the P220 is a single stack auto"

 

[RT13]

service life - equal
reliability- somewhat equal but will give Sig the upperhand
durability - somewhat equal but will give Hk the upperhand
gunsmithing/ maintenance - definitely Sig
personal experience- Sig

These are probably the best out of the box quality .45's in the market today. And either one will be just fine. I was in the same dilemma once. I learned all that I could b/ the P220 and USP45, and went out to the range and test fired both. I fell in love with the P220 more. Now I have a P220 blue and P220ST. It's like choosing between a Mercedes Benz and a BMW. Pretty damn hard! And it all comes down to your own preference and feel for each gun. Accuracy and reliability is about the same with maybe the P220 a bit on top. Size is a bit bigger for the USP and if you have larger hands, the USP may feel better. I have average to medium hands so the P220 fit me like a glove. The P220 is very simple and easy to clean and take down like a Glock. The P220 looks nicer in my opinion while the HK looks more sporty or "mean looking". Recoil is a bit more on the USP. Hk is also a bit more expensive, then there si the frmae decision; it's polymer frame vs aluminum alloy or stainless, etc. It all comes down to you my friend.

 

[caz223]

I have both a sig and a H&K.
Can't go wrong with either.

 

[BloodyThumb]

I have owned both. The HK was nice, but sold the HK after a couple of thousand rounds. I never had any trouble with it, but the 220 just grew on me, (ergonomics, trigger after break in) and I didn't need both.

My 220 is now almost 10 years old. I have NO IDEA how many rounds it has on it...... if I HAD to guess, I would just say pushing 10,000. I have loaned it to students, a couple of good friends, and few fellow competitors. It goes with me many places where I will have to leave it in a backpack, or the truck/jeep, or a gun locker, and not worry about it. It stayed submerged with me in a creek for over an hour once. My best friend let it fall out of a moving Jeep once.

It looks like hell, but won't break. I have replaced all springs once and the recoil spring several times. I replace the night sights when they died. The only other thing I changed was to put a set of Houge grips on it.

The 220 is the ONLY DA .45 I have ever owned and kept. I love my 1911's and they are still my first choice, but would compare them to a sports car. Dink with them from time to time and they always perform, but you have to know them and care for them like a spouse. The 220 is a diesel pick up. Drive it hard, and it may never be fast or pretty, but it will get you where you need to go.

They are both good tools, but personally, I would buy the 220.... and I am one of those 1911 bigots that some people complain about. I have even considered buying another, and putting it in the safe in case this one does die someday, and give it to one of my sons when I am too old to hold it up.

BT

 

[Greg Bell]

Gents,

1. The USP seems larger because of its horrible grip ergonomics.
2. The SIG is DA/SA (or DAO), the USP is damn near anything you need.
3. The USP is more corrosion resistent (if you are the kind of clod who leaves your gun in the mud or cleans it in the washing machine).
You could get the 220ST but it is too heavy for serious consideration.
4. The SIG is more accurate.
5. The SIG is more reliable.
6. The USP has a flashlight rail for GIJOE types.(yeah, yeah, the ST has one too).
7. The SIG will have a better trigger.
8. The USP has a lifetime warranty.
9. USP has more capacity.
10. Both guns are great, pick the one that fits your hand best.

GHB

 

[Shake]

The USP seems larger because of its horrible grip ergonomics.

Grip ergonomics are subjective. I agree that the USP may SEEM larger, but saying that it has horrible ergonomics is a matter of personal preference.

The USP series fit my hand like a glove. . . I guess I have horrible hands??



Shake

 

[Greg Bell]

Shake,

OK, let me qualify my statement by stating that my opinions are just that, mine. If there was any confusion, or just a general misimpression, that my words were those of God on high let me disabuse you of that notion.

GHB