Ship captains and crew...
- Thread starter hogdogs
- Start date
US Navy resorts to violence to free Capt. Philips
I don't know, maybe they should have gotten the plan approved by the UN first, to make sure none of the pirates got hurt. Shootn' them in the head like that and all--they didn't have a chance.
And of course, the crew of the Maerst Alabama fighting back and RESISTING, and the Capt jumping off the life boat--TWICE. Kripes, the insurance company isn't gonna like that.
And there're the right wing wackos who actually advocate cleaning out the whole nest of pirates instead of responding to one incident after another with ransom money.
And there's the US Navy which resorted to violence instead of letting the pirates and their captive reach shore so peaceful negotiations could have taken place for months, with Capt. Philips joining the other 250 multi-national ship crew members being held hostage.
Instead, they used US Navy SEALS
who, I'm sure, left one alive on purpose so he could be interrogated for valuable information, as long as he isn't deprived of sleep, or frightened in any way, of course.
And worse yet, some (those conservatives, no doubt) are advocating that ship crews actually be armed (WITH GUNS!) so they can defend themselves. Is violence really the answer, my friends?
I'd better shut up, before I really get warmed up.
I don't know, maybe they should have gotten the plan approved by the UN first, to make sure none of the pirates got hurt. Shootn' them in the head like that and all--they didn't have a chance.
And of course, the crew of the Maerst Alabama fighting back and RESISTING, and the Capt jumping off the life boat--TWICE. Kripes, the insurance company isn't gonna like that.
And there're the right wing wackos who actually advocate cleaning out the whole nest of pirates instead of responding to one incident after another with ransom money.
And there's the US Navy which resorted to violence instead of letting the pirates and their captive reach shore so peaceful negotiations could have taken place for months, with Capt. Philips joining the other 250 multi-national ship crew members being held hostage.
Instead, they used US Navy SEALS
who, I'm sure, left one alive on purpose so he could be interrogated for valuable information, as long as he isn't deprived of sleep, or frightened in any way, of course.And worse yet, some (those conservatives, no doubt) are advocating that ship crews actually be armed (WITH GUNS!) so they can defend themselves. Is violence really the answer, my friends?
I'd better shut up, before I really get warmed up.
Last edited:
Wildalaska
Moderator
You saw it here first.
WAs Prediction: This pirate, who is 16 years old, will be a cause celebre to the Left at or before his first court appearance. He will eventually seek and obtain asylum and sign a book contract. Sean Penn will adopt him and Susan Sarandon will marry him.
I now return you to your thread
WildcallmejeannedixonAlaska tm
my source:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/7996087.stm
"After the pirates had been shot, troops sailed to the lifeboat and released Capt Phillips, who was tied up inside it.
"US forces apparently took advantage of the fact that one of the pirates was negotiating on a US Navy vessel when the incident happened.
"The surviving pirate is now in US military custody and "being cooperative" according to the navy."
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/7996087.stm
"After the pirates had been shot, troops sailed to the lifeboat and released Capt Phillips, who was tied up inside it.
"US forces apparently took advantage of the fact that one of the pirates was negotiating on a US Navy vessel when the incident happened.
"The surviving pirate is now in US military custody and "being cooperative" according to the navy."
armsmaster270
New member
Quote Wildalaska:
You saw it here first.
WAs Prediction: This pirate, who is 16 years old, will be a cause celebre to the Left at or before his first court appearance. He will eventually seek and obtain asylum and sign a book contract. Sean Penn will adopt him and Susan Sarandon will marry him.
I now return you to your thread
This one I gotta agree with you.
You saw it here first.
WAs Prediction: This pirate, who is 16 years old, will be a cause celebre to the Left at or before his first court appearance. He will eventually seek and obtain asylum and sign a book contract. Sean Penn will adopt him and Susan Sarandon will marry him.
I now return you to your thread
This one I gotta agree with you.
skydiver3346
New member
Freed hostage: What happens now?
The captain of the USS Bainbridge should be awarded a medal for making a fast decision to end this nightmare for the American hostage captain. By approving the "taking out" of the pirates in question, this eliminated ongoing negotiations that would have either ended in paying ransom or worse (killing the hostage as things were getting hot there at the end). Of course, it really ended the only way it should have ended. The pirates lost!
Also, I just saw where Somali warlords are ticked off about us "executing" their fellow brother pirates... They now say, (if we try and rescue hostages anymore) they will kill any hostages in the future because of what America has done. Seems to me that this is all the more reason to now train and supply "defensive weapons" to the merchant seamen on these ships
The captain of the USS Bainbridge should be awarded a medal for making a fast decision to end this nightmare for the American hostage captain. By approving the "taking out" of the pirates in question, this eliminated ongoing negotiations that would have either ended in paying ransom or worse (killing the hostage as things were getting hot there at the end). Of course, it really ended the only way it should have ended. The pirates lost!
Also, I just saw where Somali warlords are ticked off about us "executing" their fellow brother pirates... They now say, (if we try and rescue hostages anymore) they will kill any hostages in the future because of what America has done. Seems to me that this is all the more reason to now train and supply "defensive weapons" to the merchant seamen on these ships
Capnrik, Could you cite the wording of firearms aboard, limitations of said firearms and the like? As a licensed crewman (I don't know what levels of license there are nor what yours is) do you support arming ships and training crewmen to use these arms? I sure am for it!
Brent
Brent
Flapjack23
New member
How about a 12 gauge loaded with flares. Pirates would have very different concerns with 4-5 burning flares on board.
armsmaster270
New member
Why 12 GA when tou can get 26.5mm which has a far longer range and burn time.
There are no restrictions on US flagged vessels carrying firearms. The problem is that when the vessel pulls into port in a nation that prohibits firearms you can run into all sorts of legal problems. Coast Guard Marine Safety Inspectors, the kind of inspectors who go on vessels to inspect paper work and cargo, don't ask if the vessel is carrying weapons. How do I know that? I asked a marine inspector. The other problem that I won't address, is company policy and liability for insurance purposes. That is none of my concern.
If the boarding is a law enforcement boarding, as opposed to regulatory, then the boarding team does ask about the presence of weapons. If there are weapons we secure the weapon until after the boarding is complete. How do I know that? I am a boarding officer in the Coast Guard.
Several people have stated that international law, maritime law, or the "high seas laws" prohibit carrying weapons. Not true.
Just Everyday Business In Some Countries...
There`s really no difference in the 'high sea' hostage for ransom going on now than the hostage for ransom thats been going on in Saudi Arabia oil deserts for years. Saudi kidnappers have been getting paid millions for years for the release of oil rig contracters/crew members from parent companies employing these hostages. Companies going into a remote part of the desert to set up a rig will go to the nearest town and hire mercs. to protect them while oil rig is built. The next job may be across the desert and company goes into nearest town and hire`s merc`s. from that town to protect workers. Funny thing is the same mercs. that were hired for first job are now the kidnappers. This has been going on for so long that the parent oil rig companies figure thier cost of protection into the overall cost of doing each job. Hard for us to comprehend but over there thats just everyday business. Seems as though the attitude`s of these offended pirate`s for the fortunate deaths of three of their comrads are the same. I agree, as someone else has posted, convoys of escorted cargo ships along with simultanious attacks on the pirate base camps are the answer(with attacks on base camps the most important). With over a dozen ships and some 200 hostages from other various countries currently being held by pirates, you would think that with a combined effort of all countries, securing these cargo lane`s would not be a problem. If a country doesn`t want armed ships sailing into their water`s/ports then that country should meet internationally escorted ship and escort cargo ship to their own port. That country assuming all responsibilty and safety of personnel and cargo.
There`s really no difference in the 'high sea' hostage for ransom going on now than the hostage for ransom thats been going on in Saudi Arabia oil deserts for years. Saudi kidnappers have been getting paid millions for years for the release of oil rig contracters/crew members from parent companies employing these hostages. Companies going into a remote part of the desert to set up a rig will go to the nearest town and hire mercs. to protect them while oil rig is built. The next job may be across the desert and company goes into nearest town and hire`s merc`s. from that town to protect workers. Funny thing is the same mercs. that were hired for first job are now the kidnappers. This has been going on for so long that the parent oil rig companies figure thier cost of protection into the overall cost of doing each job. Hard for us to comprehend but over there thats just everyday business. Seems as though the attitude`s of these offended pirate`s for the fortunate deaths of three of their comrads are the same. I agree, as someone else has posted, convoys of escorted cargo ships along with simultanious attacks on the pirate base camps are the answer(with attacks on base camps the most important). With over a dozen ships and some 200 hostages from other various countries currently being held by pirates, you would think that with a combined effort of all countries, securing these cargo lane`s would not be a problem. If a country doesn`t want armed ships sailing into their water`s/ports then that country should meet internationally escorted ship and escort cargo ship to their own port. That country assuming all responsibilty and safety of personnel and cargo.
Brent,
There is no law prohibiting arms on board a US flagged Merchant Marine vessel. There is only company policy.
I was licensed in 1992, 100 Ton Master. I have owned and operated numerous US flagged vessels in international waters while carrying arms and have had no problems.
The Spanish speaking countries, such as Cuba, Mexico, the Dominican Republic, etc., prefer that you have a copy of your weapons manifest in Spanish, as well as English. The Bahamas, Grand Cayman and others don't even require a manifest.
Weapons were always the choice of the owner of the vessel. On my own boat, I chose to carry a CAR-15 and a .45 auto. On the boat I took to Havana, I was supplied with two Winchester 12 gauge pump shotguns, and I supplied a beat up Ruger P85 9mm.
On another boat, the owner supplied a tax paid M16, and a Colt's Python, of all things.
The idea that Merchant Marine crew cannot be trained to handle ship's defense with small arms, is ridiculous. The fact that they are aboard, means that they have demonstrated the ability to learn and to complete tasks while underway.
Repelling boarders is not rocket science.