read another story saying the Seal was trying to calm the lady who became scared when he was showing off his different weapons, by showing her they where unloaded and safe to be around, apparently putting one to his head and pulling trigger to show her it was safe,apparently he didn`t check his weapon
SEAL kills self, thinking gun unloaded
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Glenn E. Meyer
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You can't tell until more is known whether it was intentional. An investigation of his life might do it.
Gun cleaning accidents and single car accidents are ways to go that are not directly seen as suicide and bring less shame, insurance problems, etc.
I recall when I was getting some extra insurance for my daughter when she started college to cover it if I passed on. The agent said that the policy had to be in force for two years to be valid for suicide. I said - Great, let me mark that day on my calendar.
Suicidial folks sometimes want to make a statement or cover up their motives.
We can't tell.
Gun cleaning accidents and single car accidents are ways to go that are not directly seen as suicide and bring less shame, insurance problems, etc.
I recall when I was getting some extra insurance for my daughter when she started college to cover it if I passed on. The agent said that the policy had to be in force for two years to be valid for suicide. I said - Great, let me mark that day on my calendar.
Suicidial folks sometimes want to make a statement or cover up their motives.
We can't tell.
Double Naught Spy
New member
Yes, he left evidence, but not evidence of a suicide. It was evidence of a foolish negligent/accident. The police are saying it was an accident. The Navy says it was an accident. So I don't follow how you think this is a suicide when there is no evidence of it being a suicide.
There is no evidence for a T-1001, so does that make it real as well?
Glenn E. Meyer
New member
DNS - no overt evidence at the scene but like I said, more might come out.
However, it could just be bravado, stupidity.
Probably that but it's just internet baloney until there is a full investigation.
However, it could just be bravado, stupidity.
Probably that but it's just internet baloney until there is a full investigation.
I have done more than a hundred equivocal death investigations where the manner of death (natural, accidental, suicide, or homicide) was unclear. Based on that experience, I would respectfully suggest two things to the opinions being casually tossed out here:
1) the media NEVER gets the facts right
2) it can take several weeks of hard investigation to make the determination between accidental and suicide - and we have all the obvious evidence, plus that we uncover with extensive interviewing and investigation
I do not know whether this young man accidentally killed himself or intentionally took his own life. I'd submit that neither do any of you.
1) the media NEVER gets the facts right
2) it can take several weeks of hard investigation to make the determination between accidental and suicide - and we have all the obvious evidence, plus that we uncover with extensive interviewing and investigation
I do not know whether this young man accidentally killed himself or intentionally took his own life. I'd submit that neither do any of you.
As a lifetime teetotaler, I like to quote the line uttered by the Kim Darby character in the original True Grit. When the John Wayne character offers her his flask she says:
"I have more sense than to put a thief in my mouth to steal my brains."
Alcohol has been known to make trees jump in front of cars, etc.
"I have more sense than to put a thief in my mouth to steal my brains."
Alcohol has been known to make trees jump in front of cars, etc.
betterdays
New member
All guns are loaded.
Besides who are you impressing by putting a gun to your head?
Smh..
Besides who are you impressing by putting a gun to your head?
Smh..
shootniron
New member
...or evidence of an intentional act.
Based on another article someone pointed out, allegedly the girl was freaked out about the guns and he was trying to calm her by demonstrating they were safe. He seems to have improvised, doing something he normally would not, to try to calm her down, and forgot to check the chamber.
It's horrible and tragic, but I can understand how it might happen... possibly intoxicated, with a girl who's wigging out over the presence of guns... so to demonstrate just how safe they are, he does something that is ordinarily very unsafe... if he can put a gun to his head and pull the trigger and nothing happens, then that proves the gun is "safe" and won't hurt anyone during normal handling... and he "thinks" the gun has been cleared, and...
Short term immediate memory for most people is between five and nine items, most commonly cited as seven. 30 seconds of stuff, or a simple distraction, can easily push memory of a clearing drill (or memory of a lack thereof) out of working memory before it's been accurately stored to more persistent memory. If clearing the gun and dry firing it in a safe direction is not the last thing you did, and you're going to violate any more safety rules, clear the gun again. That's not foolproof either, but if that principle becomes habit, chances of a ND or tragedy are dramatically reduced.
Failure to recognize and account for the limitations of working memory can have even more serious consequences.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northwest_Airlines_Flight_255
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delta_1141
Working Memory @wikipedia
Working memory is a very limited and fickle thing.
Double Naught Spy
New member
Yes, Glenn, of course, but until such time when more evidence comes about, there is still no public evidence/information on which to base that this was a suicide. Heck, until which time that more evidence/information comes about, we may learn that it was a murder, but there isn't any evidence/information at this time on which to base it was a murder. We could argue that it might be a lot of things when more evicence comes out, but that isn't the information we have at this time and so it seems a bit silly to be making such arguments.
Glenn E. Meyer
New member
NO, it's not - for this is the Internet, DNS.
While investigators should consider all possibilities, from drunken negligence to homicide to suicide to simple negligence (reports are that he was drinking, but I have read nothing about actual toxicology findings), I would like to point out that, yes, this is the internet... but speculating about suicide could be particularly hurtful to the guy's family.
It's very unlikely that any of them will read such, here... but of all possible speculations, that is the one that would cut the deepest. I'd avoid it, personally, at least unless or until there were evidence to support it. Seems the most respectful thing to do for the family.
YMMV.
It's very unlikely that any of them will read such, here... but of all possible speculations, that is the one that would cut the deepest. I'd avoid it, personally, at least unless or until there were evidence to support it. Seems the most respectful thing to do for the family.
YMMV.
Glenn E. Meyer
New member
I agree. Since we don't know.
Closedfor further info.
Closedfor further info.
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