Red dots on pistols

TunnelRat

New member
There is some bulk, but the weight is practically nothing. Handling the same pistol with and without the optic and I can’t really tell the difference. On a smaller pistol it might be more pronounced though. I don’t think the optic will ever replace point shooting. I have found that being good at point shooting actually helps with finding the dot without using the irons as reference.


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223 shooter

New member
So have any of you tried a dot on your pistol? What optic are you using? How do you like it?

I also have a Gen5 G34 MOS and use a Vortex Venom on it. The G34 really shows its accuracy potential with the red dot.
 

OhioGuy

New member
I'm using three different red dots.

On my CZ P-07 I have a Trijicon RMR Type 2, 6 MOA, auto-dimming. It's built like a tank. I switched the battery at 2 years because I had the sight off the gun and figured, eh, why not. But it was probably still fine. I zeroed it when I bought it. I have not zeroed it since. I think I could drive over that sight with in a Peterbuilt and it would not lose its zero. I've run it through three all-day outdoor shooting classes, it's been dropped in the dirt and gravel (part of the training -- unloaded!) and come home covered in dust. It's immortal.

On my Walther Q5 Match I'm running Vortex Viper 6 MOA sight. Costs half what the Trijicon and is no less accurate. I also have not re-zeroed it since I got it over a year ago. I've swapped it between that gun an a Ruger Mark IV .22 and maybe it's just luck, but the zero doesn't seem to be affected.

On my Walther PPS M2 I have the RMS-c sight that shipped with the gun. That's 3 MOA and auto-dimming, but I find it's never really as bright as I'd like it to be. I don't know whether a 6 MOA version of the same would improve matters or if it's really more about brightness. I haven't lost zero on that either. It's well made and very light, but the plastic window scratches if you look at it wrong. I've thankfully only picked up a single scratch from bouncing brass, but you can see on Walther forums where people's windows are all scratched to hell and back. But still, for CCW purposes it seems to be pretty well executed.

I hope to see and maybe use the new Sig Romeo Zero sight. It has manual brightness levels, but is activated by motion so the battery can last a very long time.

In no case has any sight affected my ability to use or conceal the gun. After my solid experience with the Vortex Viper, I don't think I'd hesitate to use it as a carry optic. I don't think it (or anything?) would survive like the Trijicon would, and I can see why police and militaries use that brand.

But today, if I had to recommend an optic for carry and general training based on my own experience, I would not hesitate to recommend the Vortex Viper (I'm sure the Venom is just as good, the Viper is just a little more compact) for any double stack gun.

For single stack -- I dunno -- unless the new Sig has some serious flaw, I'd probably go with it. It's half the price of the Shield and also has a polymer window -- if it's going to get scratched up anyway, you could buy two Sigs for the same price and probably be better off.

You *can* put a regular red dot onto a single stack pistol, you can find where people have used adapter plates to put an RMR onto a Glock 43 or whatever, but they look kinda goofy...
 

mk70ss

New member
Stephan426.... here you go

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stephen426

New member
Thanks mk70ss. Does it conceal easily? That sight hardly adds anything at all. I was concerned it would affect the overall height, making the gun hard to conceal.
 

mk70ss

New member
Stephan426, When holstered, I can’t tell the gun has a red dot at all. And it adds about the same weight of a grape.
 

stephen426

New member
Crap... I bought the one without the red dot slide cut. I can really see red dots becoming more common on defense guns. I might add a light/laser when it becomes available for my Hellcat. I have the Crimson Trace Laser Guard Pro on my Glock 43. I might be on the lookout for a Hellcat with the red dot cutout if the price is right.
 

Sharkbite

New member
I run three guns with reddots
1. A Glock 19 Milled slide (not a MOS) with an RMR
2. A M&P fullsize with a RMR
3. A Glock 34 MOS with a vortex venom

I found there to be a slight learning curve to always get the dot in the window at speed. Ive been running iron on handguns hard over the years, and thats normal. Once you get the new “muscle memory” in place i dont find any difference in speed up close, and they are faster and more accurate at distance.

I see them becoming more common as time goes on.
 

SGW Gunsmith

Moderator
My steel plate pistol and the Burris Fast Fire III provides me with some very quick sequential target acquisition. Can't complain with this Mark III that has been tuned up to the max:

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The targets behind my shop get a severe workout during the right months:

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GarandTd

New member
I recently purchased a budget dot to try out on a couple of guns. 1st set up is on my Ruger MKIII 22/45. I'm having alot of fun with it and I don't see it getting removed to go on anything else.
 

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stinkeypete

New member
Dot sights are the thing on bullseye pistols and at the marksman level (scoring high 80’s to low 90’s) they definitely buy me points- I do a lot better with .22 and .45, still using the old UltraDots which are still going after 20 years. I think I change the batteries every 5-6 years. Both my bullseye pistols required a trip to the pistolsmith to accommodate mounts. That said, my pistolsmith shot High Masters and he could easily best all of us at Pistol League with iron sights. I think he said it bought him only a point or two until serious matches became hard work and the dots were less fatigue.

My bullseye pistol is a Norinco copy of the TT Olympia and the sight radius is very short. Too short for my skills. The dot makes all the difference.

I’ve shot a few squirrels with my bullseye pistol in the forest where it was bad lighting and the dot was fabulous. Rabbits in the snow and sunshine, the dot was gone- washed out.

One time a pal who shot iron sights said the only reason I was beating him at pistol league was because he was using Iron sights. I turned my dot off and tried shooting just by co-centering the Ultradot tube on the target and ALMOST beat him.. well, he beat me... but after shooting my Norinco he agreed that much of my advantage was having a great trigger. (See Pistolsmith, above). I knew that just natural point and a little guidance from the sight tube alone would do okay from shooting rabbits in the snow when the dot was washed out anyhow.

Of course ultradots are too big for you guys that want to hide your pistols but I have been thinking that since a good pistol will run for more than about a hundred years, manufacturers need something to get us to buy more stuff. Pistolsmiths are now as rare as record players, so ability to mount optics is worth a decent amount to me for my next purchase (unless I find that Single Seven I keep thinking about.)

Price of sturdy dot optics is still, to my mind, too high. I don’t want to pay as much for a little thing with a battery in it as I paid for my boom paddle. Prices on optics will go down.

Once upon a time I had eyes like an Eagle. As I got old I lost that. Finding the right glasses for shooting... well, I don’t compete any more and use a .22 rifle now in the woods. Scope solved my eye problem... but I do think that dot sights will greatly increase how people learn to shoot accurately.

When the variable of sight picture is removed I think people will see the effect that grip, stance, and trigger control have on their shooting. I think they will also see that lots of the popular handguns are simply far less accurate than others.

There are some really poor shooters at the range. I got coaching from a High Master and practiced hard since I was about 14. You can’t shoot a pistol well by a mandate of your manliness. There are also fellas with pistols that are just plain not accurate. You just can’t learn to shoot well without instruction, practice, feedback and an accurate pistol.

The dot sight gives feedback, it’s good in low light and indoors, rubbish in the snow (super bright conditions). It’s good for bad eyes. Most importantly, it’s relatively new to casual shooters and Marketing is going to push to sell them.

For hunting, optical scopes are still the way to go, except they are heavy and clunky to carry. For high recoil, the weight is an advantage. I expect weight is an advantage for race guns, too...

Anyways, I think mounting dots is the next wave of fashion and they make a big difference at the range and hunting for most conditions.
 
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