New cartridge that actually IS a winner (IMHO)

[stagpanther]

I got to spend a bit more time with my friend's 6.8 Western rifle; it's one of the few new commercial cartridges to come along that I think really is a winner and has a viable and useful niche. I have a model 70 in 270 WSM--I've read a couple of reviews that said "The 6.8 Western is what the 270 WSM should have been" and I think that's a perfect way to describe it. I thought at first the 270WSM was not under threat--but now I see no real compelling reason for rifle manufacturers to stick with it given the clear superiority of the 6.8 Western.

 

[Polinese]

I've been reading up on that cartridge since I started seeing rifles chambered for them and have been very intrigued by it. I don't have one but am hoping it sticks around because I like what I see on paper.

 

[stagpanther]

I've been reading up on that cartridge since I started seeing rifles chambered for them and have been very intrigued by it. I don't have one but am hoping it sticks around because I like what I see on paper.

What makes the 6.8 Western so special in the .277 class is a formula that has been often repeated in the emergence of other modern cartridges; moving the shoulder back enough to accommodate newer, heavier and higher BC bullets. The .277's pretty much languished in the the narrow pool of 270 win appropriate bullets--but just like the .257'--newer very high BC bullets have recently been developed. I'm counting the days to when someone gets smart and wildcats the western to the .257 bullets--should be awesome. I've shot the western using winchester's off-the-shelf ammo (I think it's a 175 accubond)--very, very impressive to me.

 

[jmr40]

It's a good round on paper, but I just don't see it being successful. There are lots of good cartridges that aren't successful.

I don't know exactly why but cartridges with odd numbering just don't seem to make it. We have lots of successful 22, 24, 26, 28 and 30 caliber rifle cartridges. There is no reason 23, 25, 27, 29, 31, 33 or 35 calibers couldn't do the same things and be just as popular. But they aren't.

There are a couple of exceptions. No one seems interested in 32 caliber rifles. And rifles in 37 and 45 calibers fill a niche. The 270 Win has had the most success of any odd numbered cartridge. But the 280 does everything better and the 7X57 is pretty close.

There are guys who have a love affair with the 25's and 27's. Nothing wrong with them but they are bracketed by 24, 26, and 28 caliber cartridges that do the same things and it's just a lot easier to get there.

 

[Red Devil]

While it is a modern and interesting cartridge, with excellent long range performance in a caliber and bullet weight that lends itself to good velocity, high ballistic coefficients, and manageable recoil?

For a 400 yard hunting rifle, the ole .270 Winchester, with a good 150 gr. bullet, will put game in the freezer just as well.




Red

 

[44 AMP]

I don't know exactly why but cartridges with odd numbering just don't seem to make it. We have lots of successful 22, 24, 26, 28 and 30 caliber rifle cartridges. There is no reason 23, 25, 27, 29, 31, 33 or 35 calibers couldn't do the same things and be just as popular. But they aren't.

What's in a name? A rose, by any other name......

I don't think its all in the name, even or odd numbers. Lots of rounds with popular numbers in their name have failed commercially. Many cartridges names and bullet diameters only have the first number in common, though the first two is the most common American method.

Odd number calibers not popular? some sure, others wildly popular. 7mm Rem Mag, is one.

We don't have a lot of .26 name rounds, there are a couple, but there's a boatload of 6.5mms today....

.303 British (which is actually a .311-.312 bullet) was not hugely popular in the US, but was the go to rifle round everywhere connected with the British Empire.

I think it depends more on where you are, what the round does and doesn't do, and of course advertising hype.

 

[Pumpkin]

Any one heard of the.257 Condor, it was one of the original long bullet fast twist calibers. I have one cartridge in my collection, it was a bad dude.

 

[MarkCO]

While it is a modern and interesting cartridge, with excellent long range performance in a caliber and bullet weight that lends itself to good velocity, high ballistic coefficients, and manageable recoil?

For a 400 yard hunting rifle, the ole .270 Winchester, with a good 150 gr. bullet, will put game in the freezer just as well.




Red

Agree, and it sits along with about 10 others in the same general area. If the PRS guys don't want it, most hunters don't need it, will it survive?

If I did not have a .270Win and a .280AI and a 7mmMag, I might consider it.

The 6.8 Western and the 7mm PRC might battle it out, but most serious Elk hunters want 30 caliber or larger. That 6.5 bullets are marginal for Elk and 6.8 are perfect...um that only comes from a place of not much ballistic nor Elk hunting experience. One of the WSM knocks was bolt thrust was pretty high, and the 6.8 Western will likely suffer there as well.

 

[stagpanther]

I have 3x 270 wins and 2x 280 AI's--great cartridges, no doubt. Anyway, if you get a chance to shoot the 6.8 Western try it, it's very impressive in performance even compared to the established classic .277s IMO.

 

[44 AMP]

Within reason, the caliber of the cartridge is one of the least important factors a lot of the time.

A friend of mine thinks a .300 Savage is a pretty good elk round, and where he hunts, he's not wrong.

Met a fellow long ago, older guy, thought the .243 Win was an ideal elk round. Where he hunted (thick timber) and the way he hunted (neck shots only) for him, it was. The rifle was light, recoil was light, and he had taken 6 elk so far, and still had a half a box of cartridges left!

Guys like that are uncommon, but they are out there and do humanely harvest game every year.

 

[stagpanther]

Within reason, the caliber of the cartridge is one of the least important factors a lot of the time.

Yes and no. When a particular cartridge dominates the market; especially a fairly narrow one like .277's--then there tends to be a repressing force on development of new bullets that won't work within the confines of the existing chambers or stabilize in slower twists. It's pretty much evolution when newer bullets force a re-think of the existing cartridges; often spurred on by wildcats.

 

[stagpanther]

All I'm saying is just try shooting it, I think you'll be impressed.

 

[MarkCO]

All I'm saying is just try shooting it, I think you'll be impressed.

I like it, I'm just not in any hurry to get one. Recall, I had a .224V, .350L, 300NM, .450BM, .450Corvette, .340WM, 6x45 (should have kept that one), 270WSM, 300WSM, 300WM, 7mm-08, 25-06 and a few others that are now gone. I've shot it twice, and it's a capable cartridge. It's just not anything I need or want.

A buddy of mine, who hated 6.5CM just got rid of his .260Rem stuff, has a flock of 6.5CMs now. I know that the newer, sharper shouldered cartridges, and the factory offering rifles with faster twists are a bit better than the old school. But in the long range target game, I'm set. And for hunting, the 6.8 Western does absolutely nothing for me.

Now, if my house burned to the ground and all my rifles were destroyed, a 6.8 Western might be that midbore caliber I'd pick up over the others.

 

[Ricklin]

Well, 223 is an odd number, is it not? Is that ameliorated by the fact that 556 is an even number?
It matters not, I think I will pack up my rifle and the 40 rounds I loaded last night and go make holes in paper. Now that I am on paper at 100 I can dial the old .06 in with it's new glass and mounts. Hmm, I have not had it's twin in .270 to the range in a good long while either. I should have a fair amount of .270 Win loaded up, and the overcast day is just right for my chrony. It's always better to shoot than to type about shooting.

 

[buckey]

Dang, I feel old, Real old! I still think a .30-06 is amazing?

 

[Nathan]

I think we are in a time where due to the colapse of brass and ammo making and the invention of high head height design, we will soon see the complete demise of low head height, slow twist rounds for their modern equivalent.

223 will likely stay, 22 creed
6mm creed
25?? Maybe dying as a bullet size
6.5 creed & 6.5 PRC
6.8 western
7 PRC
300 PRC
338 and above…..dying except 375 Ruger and a few “African“ rounds.

Tell me I’m wrong, please!

 

[44 AMP]

Tell me I’m wrong, please!

ok, you're wrong.

 

[ligonierbill]

Does that mean my 33 WCF is dead?

 

[natman]

What makes the 6.8 Western so special in the .277 class is a formula that has been often repeated in the emergence of other modern cartridges; moving the shoulder back enough to accommodate newer, heavier and higher BC bullets.

How does moving the shoulder back better accommodate longer, heavier bullets?

 

[MarkCO]

How does moving the shoulder back better accommodate longer, heavier bullets?

Shortening the body in relation to the bullet placement within the magazine. You keep the same OAL, but allow the base of the bullet to be at, or forward of the neck shoulder junction, which is important for accuracy.