National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA)

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doofus47

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You would be hard pressed to point to a period in US history where the US military was NOT used in the police role.
I"m not counting when states were territories, but, if you are, I concede this point.

And yes, history has many episodes in which the US Military has been used to enforce laws/executive orders that were "less than ideal."

My point was that incarceration seems to be a new full-time facet of the military's job description for which our military really wasn't designed and that they appear to be edging toward the roll of full time policeman.
 

NJgunowner

New member
Even my mother who leans liberal thinks the government is out of control. :rolleyes:

Congress needs to remember that they have their jobs at the SUFFERANCE of the people, not through any intrinsic right.
 

Al Norris

Moderator Emeritus
And as long as the people keep reelecting the same idjuts persons to congress, they can only think they are doing a swell job.

So tell me why they should change what they are doing?
 

BlueTrain

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I don't think the country is out of control, although if I were allowed to vote for some of them, instead of just three, I might have a little more satisfaction, if not more results. But whoever thinks reducing the payroll tax is somehow helping the social security problem needs to rethink his position, if nothing else.
 

NJgunowner

New member
The problem is these reelected congressmen and senators are getting voted in by the same districts over and over. They KNOW who their base in these districts are and what appeals to them. In gun friend areas, gun friendly officials are elected.

Gun rights isn't the number one priority for a lot of voters even if they believe in the 2nd amendment. They'll always vote for the guy who is supporting what is most important to them, just like everyone here will.
 

dogrunner

Moderator
The problem is that "We the People" have permitted our Federal Gov't to grow entirely too large. The issue is simply one of power and that legislation is of a sort that would cause our founders to roll over in their graves..........I, for one, am goddamned sad to say that I once voted for McCain, I am ashamed of that man, obviously he has utterly no concept of what this nation was supposed to be.

As a police retiree and former soldier I recall swearing an oath to "support and defend" the Constitution............. not this goddamned excuse for a Government we now endure.
 

BlueTrain

New member
No offense intended but we the people do not all share the same concept of what this nation is supposed to be. Never did.
 

pnac

New member
No offense intended but we the people do not all share the same concept of what this nation is supposed to be. Never did.

If the Constitution is strictly adhered to, it's hard to stray too far off course.
 

Brian Pfleuger

Moderator Emeritus
BlueTrain said:
No offense intended but we the people do not all share the same concept of what this nation is supposed to be. Never did.

Really shouldn't matter. The COTUS is what it is and says what it says. We only run into problems when we decide we don't like something and would like it reinterpreted.

For instance, slavery should have been illegal from the get-go. Many of the founders wanted the nation formed without slavery but knew/concluded that forming a national government with an outright ban on slavery would be impossible. They figured it would work itself out. I doubt they expected a civil war, but they were right, it did work itself out.

The words they chose, regardless of slavery, were correct from the Declaration of Independence to the implications of the Preamble "All men (human-kind) are created equal, endowed by our creator with certain unalienable rights..." "We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence,[note 1] promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity,...."

The problem is that we allow people to reinterpret and place meaning where there was none and no intent ever existed. The First Amendment, for example:

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

Somehow, we came to a place where a direct and unambiguous prohibition against congress establishing a state religion became a prohibition against a white cross placed by private citizens to memorialize a deceased person or against a principal participating in prayer meetings at school, even against kids wearing t-shirts with crosses on them. (and yes, such nonsense has been used to restrict "non-christian" religions as well, and it's equally unconstitutional)

Even if we accept, "Incorporation", we would have the meaning the STATE governments may not establish a state religion. This still has no applicability to a monument of the 10 commandments in a court house or a principal praying at school.

Original meaning and intent. "Congress".... Shall make no "law"....

What we have today is not a matter of "interpretation", it's a fundamental alteration of intent. It is an attempt to change our nation into something that it is not and was not, into something that the COTUS was designed to prevent.

Changes (amendments) and laws are intended to clarify and reinforce, not alter the meaning of constitutional principles. Today, and I suppose there have always existed some, there are far to many with the intent to ALTER our nation, not preserve it.
 

MTT TL

New member
One thing the senate bill DID do was eliminate bestiality and sodomy as crimes for service members. This was as part of the legalization of homosexuality in the military.

Having sodomy illegal has been a running joke for as long as I can remember. I am not so sure about bestiality. Seems akin to animal abuse to me and should probably still be illegal. I didn't write the law however.

http://thenewamerican.com/culture/f...-would-legalize-sodomy-bestiality-in-military
 

nate45

New member
MTT TL said:
Despite wide spread weird media accounts that is not what was written in the bill. The wording was the same as it has been for the past five years with an exemption for US citizens.

If everything is just the same, then explain what the McCain/Levin amendment is and why it is needed.

MTT TL said:
One thing the senate bill DID do was eliminate bestiality and sodomy as crimes for service members.

This thread is specifically about the McCain/Levin amendment to the NDAA.

I guess I didn't make that clear enough in the OP. I made the false assumption that those interested would read the liked articles.

Talking about sodomy and bestiality provisions is running to far a field and has nothing whatsoever to do with this thread.
 
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