Left hand flintlock?

[wyobohunter]

I'm interested in getting a Kentucky style flintlock rifle for a few reasons. 1: I think it'd be a hoot to shoot 2: nostalgia 3: for long term "just in case" purposes, no primers or caps to worry about; just have a big supply of powder and lead, a few extra flints and a bullet mould... no need to go into why too much I spose. Anyhow, I'm a lefty and don't want the flash pan right under my nose so... Anybody know of a lefty flintlock?

 

[stevelyn]

I think Lyman makes their GPR in a lefty flintlock. I have a caplock. Would have loved a flint, but there's no feasible way to get BP out here on the AKPEN and a flintlock isn't going to light off reliably with Pyrodex or Triple 7.

 

[horseman308]

I tell everybody that looks at flinters this, but you should really consider going the semi-custom route, especially because you need a lefty. Lyman Great Plains Rifle is a really good rifle for factory, but for what you pay for a finished one from the shop, you can buy all the parts for a good do-it-yourself semi-custom level kit. If you aren't very handy/patient with hand tools, you can still get a great one around $900. These will have great locks, better than average barrels, and be something you can pass on to your kids' kids.

Check out these sites for more info on prices, etc.
www.trackofthewolf.com (Track of the Wolf in Minnesota - has EVERYTHING)
www.longrifles-pr.com (Pecatonica River in Illinois)
www.sittingfoxmuzzleloaders.com (Sitting Fox Muzzleloaders in Michigan)
http://www.avsia.com/tvm/ (Tennessee Valley Muzzleloading in Mississippi)

Also, you can bulk order up to 50 lbs (federal limit for private citizen) of black powder from many places, but Graf's and Sons is a really good option.

 

[wyobohunter]

there's no feasible way to get BP out here on the AKPEN and a flintlock isn't going to light off reliably with Pyrodex or Triple 7.

I didn't realize that you have to use actual black powder in the flash pan of a flintlock.

 

[horseman308]

Pyrodex and other synthetic black powders are very unreliable in flintlocks because their ignition point is at a higher temperature than the sparks which a flint usually produce. I don't remember the exact numbers, but I think black powder ignites somewhere around 450-500 degrees and synthetics ignite somewhere around 700 degrees. However, the sparks from a flint-and-frizzen are typically around 600 degrees or so.

Now, once black powder starts to burn it'll get hot enough to ignite pyrodex. So you can use duplex loads - 10-15 grains of black in the bottom of the chamber next to the touchhole and then the rest of it synthetic. But the flashpan pretty much has to have the real black in it to ignite reliably.

 

[B.L.E.]

If you are going to use a duplex load of black powder and pyrodex, you may just as well make the whole charge black powder.
I hardly ever use the substitutes anymore after I learned how terrible real black powder is not. The biggest downside is that you can't buy it at every gunstore.

 

[horseman308]

I agree wholeheartedly with B.L.E. Real black is nothing to be scared of - I really don't understand the issue people have with it. It cleans up with WATER! People use all sorts of different concoctions of solvents that may work more quickly, but warm water (even cold if necessary) will do the job. You just have to clean your rifle sometime within a few hours of shooting it so the natural salts in the powder don't rust your bore.

 

[garryc]

Would have loved a flint, but there's no feasible way to get BP out here on the AKPEN

Make it, It's simple

 

[horseman308]

Pretty sure it'll get you in major trouble. The best way to get black is to order it online. You can order up to 50 lbs from a number of places. Graf's and Sons is the one I would pick, but there are other good ones as well.

The more you can order at once, the better. You have to pay the same $20-25 hazmat fee whether you get 1 lb or 50, so the more you get the less you'll pay per pound. I did the math, and from Graf's, 10 pounds seems to be the magic number. If you get less than that it comes out to about 20$ per pound. At 10 lbs it drops to about $16, and by the time you get up to 50 pounds you're paying somewhere in the neighborhood of $14 per pound.

Honestly, shooting real black powder at casting your own lead roundballs is one of the cheapest ways to shoot there is. For example, my .50 flinter likes a 55 grain charge (by volume) and a .490 round ball. There are 7000 grains in a pound of powder. So I'm getting 127 shots per pound of powder. At 16 per pound (averaging), I'm paying 12.5 cents per shot. Pure lead costs around $1-2 per pound, but you can often get it free if you know where. Even at $1.50 per pound, you can get lots of shots out of that by casting your own. I made about 300 .490 round balls from 8 lbs of lead. There's the patching, which can be made from any pure cotton, wool, denim, or even silk and leather (just make sure it's not at all synthetic). Lube with spit (it's free and unlimited!). Flints cost about $1.50 and you can usually get 40-50 shots from a good one used in a well-tuned lock.

So: $0.12 for powder
$0.04 for roundball
$0.03 for the flint
free spit for lube
old bedsheets or jeans for patching

I can shoot for about $0.19 per shot. Not bad really, once you buy the gun and other gear.

 

[crghss]

I use to shoot hundreds of rounds from my Flintlock. I'm convinced it made me a much better shooter. When you learn to keep your gun sights lined up while a big ball of flame burns as you wait for you gun to discharge, that my friends will radically improve your shooting technique.

 

[Trigger Time]

Amen. Long lock times and frequent failures to fire will test your skill as well as your patience.

 

[wyobohunter]

Pretty sure it'll get you in major trouble. The best way to get black is to order it online. You can order up to 50 lbs from a number of places. Graf's and Sons is the one I would pick, but there are other good ones as well.

The more you can order at once, the better. You have to pay the same $20-25 hazmat fee whether you get 1 lb or 50, so the more you get the less you'll pay per pound. I did the math, and from Graf's, 10 pounds seems to be the magic number. If you get less than that it comes out to about 20$ per pound. At 10 lbs it drops to about $16, and by the time you get up to 50 pounds you're paying somewhere in the neighborhood of $14 per pound.

Honestly, shooting real black powder at casting your own lead roundballs is one of the cheapest ways to shoot there is. For example, my .50 flinter likes a 55 grain charge (by volume) and a .490 round ball. There are 7000 grains in a pound of powder. So I'm getting 127 shots per pound of powder. At 16 per pound (averaging), I'm paying 12.5 cents per shot. Pure lead costs around $1-2 per pound, but you can often get it free if you know where. Even at $1.50 per pound, you can get lots of shots out of that by casting your own. I made about 300 .490 round balls from 8 lbs of lead. There's the patching, which can be made from any pure cotton, wool, denim, or even silk and leather (just make sure it's not at all synthetic). Lube with spit (it's free and unlimited!). Flints cost about $1.50 and you can usually get 40-50 shots from a good one used in a well-tuned lock.

So: $0.12 for powder
$0.04 for roundball
$0.03 for the flint
free spit for lube
old bedsheets or jeans for patching

I can shoot for about $0.19 per shot. Not bad really, once you buy the gun and other gear.

You my friend have just convinced me. My next rifle will be a flintlock. I'll also get into casting for this reason... along with a little help and gentle prodding from my good friend Rangefinder. Now, what rifle in what caliber? It'll prolly be a year or so before I'll afford it because this years gun money is all gone (just bought a Ruger SRH and am getting a 1911 for x-mas). Maybe I'll save a little dough + have some fun by buying a kit.

 

[Rangefinder]

Gentle prodding?? Hell, if I pushed the notion any harder, I'd have to check for signs of over-pressure! Now you have ME thinking about flintlocks... See what you started? LOL My wife is gonna kill me...

 

[horseman308]

I got started about 8 or 9 years ago. My dad had a semi-custom flintlock he'd picked up used when I was in high school but he never used it. When I was in college my folks bought a farm to hunt and shoot on. Dad ran into a guy at a church he was preaching for at the time who was selling a caplock Hawken style for cheap.

As it turned out, the guy had NEVER cleaned that rifle after he shot it, so the barrel was totally shot - pitted beyond repair and the sear on the lock broke while I was trying to work up a load. So I grabbed dad's flintlock, got some help from a neighbor who builds them to get it going, and I haven't looked back. That flintlock was in great condition (because it actually got cared for), and given my interest, Dad gave it to me for Christmas the next year.

I gotta tell you, I've been shooting stuff since I was a child and this is by far my favorite thing to shoot. It's made me such a better marksman. And once you learn all the tricks, the misfires are rather infrequent. Good luck picking one out and have fun!

 

[stevelyn]

I didn't realize that you have to use actual black powder in the flash pan of a flintlock.

Yes. Preferebly 4F. If you do decide to use a BP subsitute for the main charge, you have to dump at least 5 grains of black down the barrel for the kicker to light off the sub.

Now, what rifle in what caliber?

Dude, your grid coordinates say you live in AK. You shouldn't be huckin' anything less than a .54 ball if you're going to be hunting with it.

 

[horseman308]

Yeah, if you're hunting in Alaska with flinter, you really want something heavy because patched-round balls and even conicals don't have the greatest ballistics. Don't get me wrong - they've reliably killed everything that walks, but you have to know what you're doing. I'd go with something around a .58 or .62 caliber.

As far as the powder and priming goes, black powder comes in a number of granulations. 1F is the coarsest and used for things like cannons (I think there might be a "cannon" grade that's even coarser, but I don't know). The granulations get finer from there. Most people shoot either 2F or 3F as their main charge. Typically, big bores seem like like coarser powders better, but each one is different. I shoot 3F in my .50. 4F powder is for priming ONLY. As the powder is ground finer, its potency increases, so that each grade is about 15% more powerful per equal measure than the one before it.

So, if you're using 100 grains of 2F (a HUGE charge, but easy numbers), you'll need about 85 grains of 3F for equal power. The other thing is that finer grades seem to burn a little cleaner and produce a little less fouling. Not a big deal for hunting because it'll only be one or two shots. But if you're doing lots of target shooting, fouling will build up and you'll need to swab the barrel more often.

Like I said, I use 55 grains of 3F as my main charge. When I'm hunting I just prime with 3F from my main horn so it's less stuff to mess with if I'm reloading in a hurry, but when target shooting I prime my pan with 4F, mostly because I have a can and need to use it up. Some people feel like it ignites more quickly than 3F and works better in priming. I can't tell a difference, but it might be more noticeable if you use 2F as a main charge.

Since we're on the topic, here's a few pics of my rifle and me shooting it.

My .50 Flintlock Tennessee longrifle

My Dad's .40 York, PA style longrifle I built him for Christmas a few years ago

The two together

A couple pics of shooting it. The flash in the pan might be bigger in the pics than normal because we were trying to get dramatic shots. Also, make sure you wear safety glasses (even though I'm not here )

 

[Scorch]

Cabela's Blue Ridge rifles are very nice, they used to have it in a lefty version, but I don't see it any more. You would have to call them to see if it is available.

 

[robhof]

robhof

If you're going to get 50lb of black. you might consider going in with other flinters. Advertize in the local paper for fellow b/p people, if you can't find a reenactor group(the best place for large purchases).

 

[horseman308]

2nd that. It's always best to buy in bulk, but if you can't swing the whole thing yourself, try and find some people to go in as a group.

 

[eastbank]

i like my tenn poor boy left hand lock. eastbank.