Inconsistent Nitro Conversion.

B.L.E.

New member
I experimented with smokeless powder in the Ruger Old Army many years ago using Hercules Bullseye powder. Yes it was that long ago before it was Alliant Bullseye. I still have half a can of it.
It just does not work with #11 caps and nipples. Endless failures to fire and when it does ignite, you get squibs, very low velocity loads that go "poof". The only way I could make it work was to put a small igniter charge of 4Fg, about the amount used to prime a flintlock, in the chamber with the smokeless powder, then is shot quite well. That igniter charge basically did the primer's job in a modern cartridge, to jump the chamber pressure up into the region where smokeless powder burns fast.
That's why smokeless conversions need sealed primer ignition such as 209 shotgun primers.
By the way, I have heard that the 16 inch guns on battle ships are loaded with a 5 kg bag of black powder between the main smokeless charge, about 600 pounds, and the primer. This is called the igniter charge.

One thing about smokeless powder is that low pressure loads tend to be dirty, leaving a lot of unburned powder in the bore. If you want lighter loads, you have to go to faster burning smokeless powder formulations to get good results, both in clean burning and consistent velocities.
I looked up cowboy action loads for the Colt .45 and the recommended powders were Bullseye, American Select, and Unique. Ditto for the .45 Scholfield except the recommended loads were lower due to the cases smaller capacity.
Chamber capacity has a big effect on pressure. A deep seated ball will really jump the pressure due to less airspace for the powder gasses to expand into.
 

Certus

New member
Thanks once again to all those who have provided such constructive advice and helpful explanations.

I bought this gun after the UK breech loading pistol ban in 1995 in case I couldn't get on with the extra effort required when shooting the black powder alternative. As it turned out, I much prefer black powder which is why the Ruger hasn't seen too much use.

This was one of the earlier conversions when it was first realised that shotgun primers were essential for reliable ignition. The original converter suggested 2.7 grns of Bullseye which was the popular target load for shooting .38 spl with a 148 grn WC bullet. All the later conversions recommend a slower burning powder with 4.5 grns of Herco being the most widely recommended load.

I can't remember any problems when I used the Bullseye load, so I may give that a try and see what happens.

The S&W 686 38 spl target load would also have had quite a lot of space between the the charge and the base of the bullet, so I'm sure the Ruger will cope just as well.

I will certainly be shooting more black rather than smokeless powder revolver in the future, but it would be nice to have an alternative for those days when the extra effort involved with black powder becomes an issue.

Regards
Brian
 

Certus

New member
Problem Solved.

Hi,

Problem solved with the use of 2.9 grns of Bullseye instead of the previous 4.5 grns of Herco.

Interestingly, the point of impact was the same as with the Herco load, but without the inconsistent performance and no evidence of unburnt powder.

Regards
Brian
 

Jim Watson

New member
Good show.
I have long said that any pistol or revolver cartridge that has been loaded with smokeless powder has been loaded with Bullseye. Now it looks like that applies to percussion revolvers loaded with smokeless.
 

chrisbaker42

New member
Slightly off topic but I’m hoping that someone has run one of these over a chrono as I would like to know how the power of these compares to the black powder originals.
 

DorsetBlue

New member
Hi Brian,

I am hoping you might read this, even though it it a bit of a necroposting.

I saw on airgunbbs (tried to register there but have failed to receive the authentication emails) that you were having issues with bullseye being too fine. I have just bought one of these conversions and seeing your bullseye loads, I was going to try some similar speed shotgun powders like Red Dot, Green Dot and Maxam CSB 5. I was also going to try the Lee Ruger Conicals, as my BP Ruger Old Army loves them.
 
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