Have we, as a nation, forgotten??
http://attacked911.tripod.com/
http://attacked911.tripod.com/
Have we, as a nation, forgotten??
- Thread starter glove
- Start date
- Status
Well, actually, we're not really responding to it.
Otherwise bin Laden would be dead instead of laughing at us, and that entire region of hills between Afghanistan and Pakistan would be scorched earth.
al-Qaeda is now as strong or stronger than they were before that. Look at the news, the intelligence estimates. They now put out videotapes with bluescreened backdrops a la CNN.
Otherwise bin Laden would be dead instead of laughing at us, and that entire region of hills between Afghanistan and Pakistan would be scorched earth.
al-Qaeda is now as strong or stronger than they were before that. Look at the news, the intelligence estimates. They now put out videotapes with bluescreened backdrops a la CNN.
Why would you trust a MSM report on that, but not on anything else?
As for turning Pakistan into a scorched earth, there are no "hills between them. You're either in Pakistan or Afghanistan, there is no unclaimed territory there.
It's a small thing, but bombing another sovereign country indiscriminately has been known to cause diplomatic troubles. Are you telling us that the British could bomb American soil in the search for the architects of the subway bombings? If they thought they were here? I'm sure that the Canadians and Mexicans would appreciate that, as well.
Blue-screen backdrops come out of a computer program. Commercially available. They could have bought them from any number of sources. That hardly signifies strength.
Trust? I was watching the video myself. I do video editing, and I can recognize a bluescreen production with a good knockout matte and someone who knows what they're doing with the editor, probably a decent system using Final Cut or Premiere. There were none of the lines around the person that appear with old bluescreen tech or people who don't really know what they're doing.
The rendered backgrounds can be had anywhere. Putting someone in front of them and making it look right takes a skilled video editor who knows how to use current software on a decent machine. It doesn't "come out of a computer program" like magic, any more than a 777 can fly itself across the Atlantic without a pilot.
A little knowledge, y'know?
The rendered backgrounds can be had anywhere. Putting someone in front of them and making it look right takes a skilled video editor who knows how to use current software on a decent machine. It doesn't "come out of a computer program" like magic, any more than a 777 can fly itself across the Atlantic without a pilot.
A little knowledge, y'know?
Last edited:
JuanCarlos
New member
Was there some kind of terrorist attack or something on 9/11? I had completely forgotten about that! 
Nobody has "forgotten." People just disagree on how we should have responded, and how we should continue to respond from here. Just because they don't believe we should carpet-bomb Pakistan, or occupy Iraq for the next two decades, or whatever you happen to think we should do doesn't mean they've "forgotten."
Though I suppose perhaps it wasn't your intent to use the insulting insinuation that anybody had "forgotten" 9/11 to bully people into coming over to your point of view. If so, could you explain what you meant by posting this video and provide the evidence that leads you to believe that people have "forgotten?"
Nobody has "forgotten." People just disagree on how we should have responded, and how we should continue to respond from here. Just because they don't believe we should carpet-bomb Pakistan, or occupy Iraq for the next two decades, or whatever you happen to think we should do doesn't mean they've "forgotten."
Though I suppose perhaps it wasn't your intent to use the insulting insinuation that anybody had "forgotten" 9/11 to bully people into coming over to your point of view. If so, could you explain what you meant by posting this video and provide the evidence that leads you to believe that people have "forgotten?"
No. We just don't want to live in fear anymore.
This terrorism hysteria is and always was ridiculous. The chances that you will be killed in a terrorist attack are very small. It's more likely that you will get crushed by a vending machine or accidentally shoot yourself.
Fear makes people very easy to control, which is why certain government officials constantly warn us about terrorism. If we, as a nation had been thinking clearly, instead of panicking, do you think anyone would have believed that Osama Bin Laden had an advanced hollowed out mountain fortress running on green power?
The post-9/11 world isn't any different from the pre-9/11 world, I wish people would stop trying to make it seem like it is. We have been attacked before and we will be attacked again, there's no reason to be constantly paranoid about it.
JuanCarlos
New member
Alert level magenta, baby. Seriously, in over five years we've never been at alert level Blue, for "General Risk of Terrorist Attack." Tell me that this isn't just a tool of the government to try and keep people at least a little scared.
It's a brilliant strategy. Alternate between reminding people that they could die at any time from terrorism, and accuse those that still aren't scared of "forgetting" 9/11.
The Tourist
Moderator
"but bombing another sovereign country indiscriminately"
It seems Japan learned its lesson.
I do not care about the opinions of my enemies. They hated me from the beginning. Let them learn to be careful around me. I still hear about attitudes I had decades ago, and I have forgotten.
People respect raw determination.
It seems Japan learned its lesson.
I do not care about the opinions of my enemies. They hated me from the beginning. Let them learn to be careful around me. I still hear about attitudes I had decades ago, and I have forgotten.
People respect raw determination.
Diplomacy is not so much about the opinion of your enemies as the opinion of your friends, and more importantly the opinion of the "neutrals".
On an international scale you can never have too many friends nor too few enemies. I'd just as soon not make friends into enemies and when possible I am not above converting enemies into friends.
The Japanese were a pretty bad enemy who have become a pretty good friend.
The Tourist
Moderator
"On an international scale you can never have too many friends"
My Dad was always quick to point out that "little white crosses" were strewn the world over.
We died to get onto Omaha Beach, which if my geography is correct, is where our French 'allies' were already living.
The USA has 'allies' when we can ship them ordnance, die for them, send them welfare or provide tourists.
The moment a Beerhause Bund hits the horizon, our 'allies' disappear like cockroaches in a strong light. I dare say we have no real allies, except for a few brave Canadian snipers.
If you doubt that, tell the UN that the Americans have done their bit and are going home. Further inform them that we expect our "brave UN allies" to continue the good fight against terrorism. You know what you'd get?
*crickets*
My Dad was always quick to point out that "little white crosses" were strewn the world over.
We died to get onto Omaha Beach, which if my geography is correct, is where our French 'allies' were already living.
The USA has 'allies' when we can ship them ordnance, die for them, send them welfare or provide tourists.
The moment a Beerhause Bund hits the horizon, our 'allies' disappear like cockroaches in a strong light. I dare say we have no real allies, except for a few brave Canadian snipers.
If you doubt that, tell the UN that the Americans have done their bit and are going home. Further inform them that we expect our "brave UN allies" to continue the good fight against terrorism. You know what you'd get?
*crickets*
I dare say that after eight years of Dubya we will have a much shorter list of friends than we did at the beginning of that eight years.
I used the term friends because I think it more appropriate, as far as I can tell republicans don't much like friends and only tolerate sycophants.
I used the term friends because I think it more appropriate, as far as I can tell republicans don't much like friends and only tolerate sycophants.
The Tourist
Moderator
"a much shorter list of friends"
If that's the case (and I believe you to be sincere), where are these 'friends' when we have natural disasters?
If a foreign country has an earthquake, we truck supplies in by the plane load.
Why did our 'allies' let Katrina victims go without water and baby supplies for over five days? To be sure, other western countries produce similar goods and services.
Face it, Americans are chumps. We are criticized for 'adventurism' if we respond, and we blamed with 'apathy' if we don't pony up buckets of foreign aid.
Let's suppose a hypothetical scenario where Al Qaeda flew a jumbo jet into The Eiffel Tower. In this scenario the USA sends only its 'sympathy' but not one shred of hard goods.
Now, you tell me what the reaction of the foreign press will be.
If that's the case (and I believe you to be sincere), where are these 'friends' when we have natural disasters?
If a foreign country has an earthquake, we truck supplies in by the plane load.
Why did our 'allies' let Katrina victims go without water and baby supplies for over five days? To be sure, other western countries produce similar goods and services.
Face it, Americans are chumps. We are criticized for 'adventurism' if we respond, and we blamed with 'apathy' if we don't pony up buckets of foreign aid.
Let's suppose a hypothetical scenario where Al Qaeda flew a jumbo jet into The Eiffel Tower. In this scenario the USA sends only its 'sympathy' but not one shred of hard goods.
Now, you tell me what the reaction of the foreign press will be.
Tourist, I don't know where to start. If your rich uncle's kid has a car wreck do you rush to provide material provisions? We are the wealthiest country in the world, to offer us material goods in a crisis is an insult.
However, lots of countries show good will and support in tons of ways all the time. Something as simple as voting with us in the UN is a show of support that can be damaging to some country's prestige and yet they do it.
We also help other countries out from time to time with foreign aid. Alas, as a percentage of our GDP we are near the bottom of the list as far has providing help to those in need is concerned. This should be a source of embrassment but many people constantly complain about how much we spend on helping others.
However, lots of countries show good will and support in tons of ways all the time. Something as simple as voting with us in the UN is a show of support that can be damaging to some country's prestige and yet they do it.
We also help other countries out from time to time with foreign aid. Alas, as a percentage of our GDP we are near the bottom of the list as far has providing help to those in need is concerned. This should be a source of embrassment but many people constantly complain about how much we spend on helping others.
JuanCarlos
New member
The problem with getting food/water/baby supplies to someplace like Katrina wasn't the lack of any of the above...it was physically getting it into the people's hands. A task that the government of, say, Germany is not nearly as well equipped to do as our own.
It's not as if there was some drastic shortage of any of these things in the US as a whole for those three to five days. Especially generally food and water supplies (not sure exactly what the logistics are of procuring large amounts of baby formula). Our emergency response infrastructure just wasn't there to distribute it effectively. There isn't much our allies could have done about that.
Have we forgotten....
Let's jsut go by the words of our President when asked about Bin Laden, who he had said we were after "Dead or Alive" right after 9/11...
"And, again, I don't know where he is. I -- I'll repeat what I said. I truly am not that concerned about him."
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2002/03/20020313-8.html
He was important enough for the "Dead or Alive" soundbite and go to war over but not important enough to finish the job on...
I have a relative who made it out of Tower Two just in time. I have friends and relatives who were NYPD officers and EMS at the scene and recovery efforts. I expected Bush to do what he said. I haven't forgotten but obviously he has.
Let's jsut go by the words of our President when asked about Bin Laden, who he had said we were after "Dead or Alive" right after 9/11...
"And, again, I don't know where he is. I -- I'll repeat what I said. I truly am not that concerned about him."
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2002/03/20020313-8.html
He was important enough for the "Dead or Alive" soundbite and go to war over but not important enough to finish the job on...
I have a relative who made it out of Tower Two just in time. I have friends and relatives who were NYPD officers and EMS at the scene and recovery efforts. I expected Bush to do what he said. I haven't forgotten but obviously he has.
And my point was that technology, and even technicians, are a much better investment than suicide bombers. They are not, per se, an example of advanced strength. I can hire a pilot to fly that jet. Just like I can hire a technician, at union scale, to clean up my video presentation.
The report that I was referring to is the one contained in "the news and the intelligence estimates."
Do I make myself clear now, sir?
There was an Act Of War declared on Japan, it I remember correctly. There has been nothing of the sort declared on Pakistan. I'm all for going in and getting Bin Laden, and diplomacy can take care of it, later. What I'm against is indiscriminate fishing expeditions, looking for him, and killing innocent people.
Once again, if it's OK for us to invade a friendly country, looking for a terrorist, then it would be just as fine for another country to invade us, looking for criminals thought to be living here? I've asked that several times. No response. I'm guessing that it's just too inconvenient?
There is no difference. Terrorism is nothing new. Remember the Oklahoma City bombing?
Yeah, that's what I said.
But now that you mentioned it, how many people die every year in car crashes? Around 40,000. That's like thirteen 9/11 size events every single year. What do we do about that? Is the world different because of it?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TTTgpsAs4_c
If that's the case, just think of how many people die of natural causes in a year. Why worry about anything?
Just don't expect me to allow my hard-earned tax dollars to help you or those who feel like you when trouble comes. So you'll starve to death? So what? Look at how many people die of electrocution in the U.S. You'd just be another drop in the bucket.
Just don't expect me to allow my hard-earned tax dollars to help you or those who feel like you when trouble comes. So you'll starve to death? So what? Look at how many people die of electrocution in the U.S. You'd just be another drop in the bucket.
- Status