Has the Past Eight Years Been Bad for You?

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Sigma 40 Blaster

New member
Interesting question -

For me the answer is No, the past 8 years have not been bad, they have been pretty good. I think it's funny that people attribute success and failure to the US Government, namely the president.

Gas prices are up because we rely on foreign countries who think we are evil.

Grocery prices are higher, namely I attribute that to gas. And increases in minimum wage if I recall correctly.

Home values are down because so many foreclosed homes are empty on the market. This is because greedy developers were building as many cookie cutter homes trying to sell them for 150% of what they were really worth AND unscrupulous lenders were issuing variable loans and to people who really didn't qualify who would default when the interest rate increased their payments by 50%.

Katrina was mishandled horribly. I'm not sure anyone would have done better, it looks like lessons were learned (Gustav) as a result and I doubt anything will be as mis-managed as it was before. Then of course you have Iraq.

Clinton is credited with "saving the economy" when the real reason was this new thing called the world wide web. In fact I believe his NAFTA garbage hurt us way more than it helped us to this point. I don't think Bush has been the best president, or even a decent one but I think it's so easy to scapegoat him that he's getting credit for things he didn't screw up. Overall considering the number of national disasters (Katrina and 911) I think his presidency has been the toughest for at least the last 20 years or so.
 
D

Danzig

New member
Intune,

I am just 13 series. March 2000-September 2000, Bosnia; March 2002 - March 2003, South Korea; October 2003 - March 2004, Iraq; November 2005 - November 2006, Iraq; November 2007 - February of March 2009, Iraq
 
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xd9fan

New member
Love this type of question.....

It like the one that asks
"You say the Govt abuses it citizen....have they done it to YOU personnally"
"no"
"then see the Govt doesn't abuse"

ok



In the last 8 years (Congress and Bush)

The relationship btwn Govt and its citizens has not improved.
Govt has grown faster than My personal income.
The GOP is a shell of its former self.
The last eight years shows no sign that the tax cuts will be made perniment.

As for gun rights, Just one more guy on the SCOTUS saved the 2ndA.
(I have zero faith in Bush and Congress on guns....George, I like my "assault weapon"...whatever the hell that means)

The SOUTHERN border is worse
The price of gas is worse
The concept of Limited Govt is all but dead.
Govt Heathcare is gaining strength in the last 8 years.
Are people talking about the wonders of the free market.......???



So has it been bad for me personally....as an American....yes......I have children and its hard for me to tell them about Individual liberty when neither party/nor school does not give a shi& about it. Yes we live in the great country on earth.......but we ARE going backwards!!!!!!!

Its hard for me to tell them that Govt cant/shouldnt/was not created to do everything.....when all they see is people telling us that Govt is the anwser for everything....their school, my healthcare industry...etc

We (even more in the GOP) are abusing the concepts of freedom and liberty (at least as far as the Founders defined them) What I mean by that is:

The war in Iraq does not make me safer or free......at all
(that my responsibility....not Govt's... my liberty has no relationship/is not defined by other man in other country) Please read the Founders on this.

America is not here on a grant mission, (spending money we dont have and boys I want on our southern border) to spread freedom and "democracy" around the world........I just cant find that mission statement in the Constitution.


the mere fact that I have to post this basic stuff on a gun board is sad in itself.......
 
I

Intune

New member
I am just 13 series. March 2000-September 2000, Bosnia; March 2002 - March 2003, South Korea; October 2003 - March 2004, Iraq; November 2005 - November 2006, Iraq; November 2007 - February of March 2009, Iraq
Click to expand...
Cannon cocker? ;) I'm an old 19E treadhead. They have indeed kept you busy and I feel for you and your family. Stay safe, thank you again for your service and good luck with the future. Hang in there.
 
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homefires

New member
I think the last eight years are the product of the eight year prior to that! Someone sold our economy to the Chines! Now Who would do that? Emmmmmmmm?
 
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TexasFats

New member
I would like to say something to everybody in the military who says that the last eight years has been bad for you. Of course it has! We are involved in combat operations in two theaters--Afganistan and Iraq. While I question the need for us to have gone into Iraq when we did, Afganistan was absolutely necessary.

One of my uncles was drafted at 18, fought his way up the boot of Italy carrying a BAR, and was wounded by a German 88 at Anzio. Ten years later, the smell of firecracker smoke on the Fourth of July would give him a crashing headache. His older brother fought across Europe with the combat engineers and then was sent to the Pacific. He always thought that the atomic bomb had saved his life. One cousin of mine was wounded while serving as a navy coxwain on a landing craft at Normandy (June 6, 1944). Millions more could tell similar stories. I doubt if any of them would say that their lives were better while they were in the military, but it had to be done. It is unfortunate that we went into Iraq half-cocked. Those assests should have been employed in Afganistan, but, at the end of the day, we could not allow either 9-11 or the danger of further terrorist attacks to go unanswered. Even if Iraq was a mistake, mistakes always happen in war. Read the history of the Dardanelles campaign by the British and Australians during WWI. Read the history of the battle of the Somme. There were similar foul-ups during WWII; although, maybe not on the same horrible scale. Look at the Italian campaign. Think of Monte Casino. While that may seem cold comfort to you, it seems to always be part of war--leaders make mistakes and and soldiers pay the bill in blood and in many other ways.

By the way, if you want to see war at its worst, talk to or read the comments of some survivor of Bataan. Then, count your blessings that you have not yet had to go through that.
 
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B

B Hillen

New member
Last 8 years?

The last eight years have been very good. I am the youngest of seven. I remember air raid siren test drills in my youth, as well as the duck and cover drills beneath our atomic bomb blast proof desks at school. I have my Mom's last family budget that she worked out - I think we spent more on booze and cigars last month.
No 911's since that awful day.
Two litters of puppies.
An artillary luger has come into my possession, I thought I'd never be able to obtain one.
A daughter going to Italy next summer with school.
Work is good, too.
Stay real. I ask my daughter, "would you rather be poor here, in America, rather than in any other country?".
 
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Sixer

New member
The last 8 years have been terrible...

- 2000 - my girlfriend of 5 years broke up with me
- 2001 - I was arrested for a DUI @ 8am
- 2002 - Got in a bar fight the day before my sisters wedding and had to go with a black eye to match my tux.
- 2003 - I actually had to get a JOB after graduating from college, ugh!
- 2004 - The Cheifs sucked, the Royals sucked, the Jayhawks were just ok.
- 2005 - I dont really remember much of 2005, but Im sure something bad happened.
- 2006 - I had a girlfriend that didnt take our brake up too well, it almost resulted in a restraining order (for her).
- 2007 - My rent went up
- 2008 - Im getting pressure from my current girlfriend about MARRIAGE!:eek: (she happens to be a gun hater)

I blame all of this on George W. Bush and his administration. I know that if BHO takes over, he's gonna look out for ME and I wont have to worry about any bad things ever again. Oh boy! I cant wait:)
 
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Buzzcook

New member
Depends on what you mean.

Compared to the price of consumer goods my real income is down. But my income is great enough that I can just cut back on spending.
My investment portfolio has gone from a steady gainer to a roller coaster that has lost about 1/2 its pre-2000 value in real dollars. Still enough to retire on but not enough for a boat to.

Of course it's no fun living in a country that practices illegal aggressive war, torture, and has shredded its constitution.

It might be a better idea to examine the hard data rather than to ask a bunch of guys on a blog.
 
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S832

New member
I think we can all agree America is doing great - a huge deficit, a weak dollar, loss of jobs and importing of labor.

Clearly we are far better off then we were 8 years ago.
 
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toybox99615

New member
Bad for me

Lets see:
my retirement accounts (no withdrawals from them) is now worth 15 to 18% less than they were 8 years ago.

Heating cost from my home for the same number of gallon of heating fuel has gone from $ 2,150 for the year 2,000 to $ 5,600 for the first nine months (75%) of the year 2008.

Groceries and home supplies have gone from $ 6,200 for the year 2000 to $ 8,400 for nine months in 2008 while I was gone for two months and the groceries are actually for the first six months of 2008.

Gasoline has gone from $ 1.45 a gallon to $ 4.54 a gallon.

My retirement income (not from retirement accounts but company type benifits) have increased by 7% over eight years. Expenses have nearly increased by 35%

Property taxes have increased by 12% while my property value has increased by 8 or 9%.

Public utilities (water, sewer, garbage) have increased from $ 90 a month to $ 114 a month or an increase of 26%.



These are the reality of changes in fixed expenses for which I have no control. They are the result of increased cost across the board for everything I or the providers of these service have experienced as inflation affecting all of us.

Now I live in a country that has a greater chance of becoming subject to terrorist attacks. Although the fact is the terrorist mind set against America is beyond anyone in America's ability to control. Meanwhile I need a passport and several security checks ( CDL, TWIC and a few more) to insure I'm not a terrorist so I can simply go on with my life the way I did eight years ago.

I have the Patriot Act to contend with; the possability any calls made out of the country will be monitored; a probability the country will revert to the draft of my children, an entire legacy of surviving under the Bush regime.

Personaly I don't think I'm any better off today than I was eight years ago. And I'm certain those who fall into the lower socio-economic level of society are far worse off as the loose larger and large portions of thier incomes to simply get their home heated, the lights on and food on the table.
 
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cxg231

New member
To everyone that says they are not worse off than they were 8 years ago, read the post above mine by toybox99615. That stuff affects all of us. Great post.
 
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Nnobby45

New member
I think we can all agree America is doing great - a huge deficit, a weak dollar, loss of jobs and importing of labor.

Clearly we are far better off then we were 8 years ago.
Click to expand...

The conditions you described are cyclic and happen with 100% certainty every so often, before things rebound and get better--also with 100% certainty. The exception being the increased labor importation caused by not enforcing existing laws.

The state of the Nation, at this point, isn't as dire as the self interested news media would have us believe, though there are certainly problems, and higher prices are one of them.

Toyboxes post tells it like it is. He and I are mirror images where our retirement situations are concerned. I'm going to make it through this and so is he.

So, I guess it's all Bushs' fault. Certainly doesn't seem to be the fault of terrorists, or a do-nothing congress led by the Dem's (just ask them), or the loaning of billions to those who weren't qualified to by a house in the first place, or failure to develop our own resources in the face of rising fuel use by China and India, the failure to protect our own border, etc., etc.

I suspect that as Iran and Russia continue to assert themselves in world matters, we'll look at the latter Bush days as the good times.

On the other hand,eight years of, essentially, no Federal gun control measures passed, and the sunset of the "Assault Weapons" ban against the wishes of the anti-gunners is something to reflect on, also.
Not to mention the lifetime appointments of two conservatives to SCOTUS, along with hundreds of Federal judges to the bench who don't legislate from it.
 
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johnbt

New member
I'm better off than 8 years ago. Work, save, invest. Every year is better than the last. Markets go up and down; get used to it.

The country is better off than we've been at various points during my lifetime. Heck, during the OPEC oil embargo gas buying was restricted and many stations didn't even have any gas.

When I bought my house in 1980 I had good credit and got a mortgage before the rates went up. Mine was for 30 years with one point and it was only 12.75%. Rates soon went up to 18% or so.

I could go on listing low points in the U.S. economy during my lifetime, but doubt that I'd do much convincing because most people only see the immediate effects of what's happening to them.

And the last ten or fifteen years or so were a freakish bubble that shouldn't have been allowed to happen. The auditors and regulators didn't do their jobs. I know I wasn't caught holding much .com stock or real estate when bubbles popped, but a lot of people were.

It's still a good time to buy a little stock, but diversify.

John

P.S. - Can you spot the bubbles in the S&P?

chrtsrv.dll
 
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johnbt

New member
Check the prime rate history chart, these are some of the good days. Not as good as when I was a kid in the '50s, but still good. I've copied a few of the high points below. John

http://mortgage-x.com/general/indexes/prime.asp

October 13, 1978 10.00%

April 2, 1980 20.00%

July 7, 1980 11.50%

December 19, 1980 21.50%

July 8, 1981 20.50%

...then slowly drops to 10% over 4 years...

May 20, 1985 10.00%

...then to 7.5% but oops...

February 24, 1989 11.50%
 
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JWT

New member
Those who think they're doing fine will continue to think so and those who don't won't. All the posting and posturing in the world won't change that.
 
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