Grease on slide rails is no good

[Master Blaster]

I recently talked to two local police armorours and they both seemed to agreee that using grease on any part of the gun unless completly sealed (what part is that) is no good.
The reasons: 1. Grease collects dirt and grit, good oil flows the dirt and grit away while grease holds it.
2. grease can slow down the movement of some parts causing jams.
3. grease collects dust and lint on a carry gun faster than a good oil.

I have started to use syntec by castrol to lube my guns, and I use it sparingly.

What do other folks think about the grease vs oil question??

 

[Bongos]

I've never used grease; just oil. My guns are lubed with snake oil. I have a Beretta 92 fs and this particular gun needs the most oil.

 

[Coinneach]

I've used Remoil, Mobil1, CLP (military), and most recently Slick50 One PTFE grease.

At my last range outing, I put 100 rounds through an SKS, 50 through an Enfield, 100 through a Taurus Ti, and 200 through a Marlin .22 semi. All were lubed with Slick50. None jammed.

Temp was in the upper 90s, at a dusty outdoor range. Ammo was cheap, dirty milsurp in the SKS and Enfield, and we know what .22 is like.

So much for the theory that grease is bad.

 

[Rosco Benson]

It depends on the intended environment in which the pistol will be used and what that use will be. It also depends on which "grease" is selected.

I have always lubed my slide rails with Aero-grade Lubriplate white grease. It doesn't thicken up in cold weather and it doesn't run or burn off in extended firing.

Clearly, a motorcycle cop, whose pistol is constantly exposed to the elements, road grit, and so forth AND who is not going the fire the pistol very much (if at all) between cleanings has different needs.

Rosco

 

[alamo]

I'm no expert on this but I have read some comments from those who are knowledgeable about these things. I read that grease is recommended for slide rails and hammer/slide interface. A good grease like Slick 50 PTFE grease should ENHANCE reliability not degrade it. Oil gets thrown off fairly quickly by the slide action whereas grease will stay on much longer. Obviously, only a thin film of grease is needed as gobs of it probably would hurt reliabilty.
I can't comment on grease vs. oil attracting dirt & dust. I wouldn't think there would be much difference.

 

[Mike Irwin]

I use grease all the time, and renew it regularly.

While a good oil will flow dirt and grit away, it will also hold dirt and grit in any residual that is left behind, so that isn't really a valid point, I feel.

I also just love the theory that grease will trap dirt and lint before oil. Sorry, not the case at all. Both will trap dirt and lint. That's the nature of a viscous substance.

Also, oil flows away. If the gun isn't lubed regularly, you've got a dry gun, which is as bad, if not worse, as a gun with grit in the grease.

Grease will, if used in large enough quantities, slow down the action. That's why you use it sparingly, and use a grease that has stable viscosity in a wide range of temperatures.

Frankly, the armorer's points aren't valid IF the officers are cleaning their guns as regularly as they should. But something tells me that most officers don't clean and relubricate as often as they should.

A good friend of mine us US Park Police. He cleans and lubricates his P7M13 weekly to ensure that it will operate if he needs it. There are others on his squad who don't touch their guns between their trips to the range every 6 months. How much oil do you think will be left behind after 6 months? Not much, if any.

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Beware the man with the S&W .357 Mag.
Chances are he knows how to use it.

[This message has been edited by Mike Irwin (edited July 11, 2000).]

 

[beemerb]

I was told you had to allways use grease on a stainless steel pistol.Had a AMT hardballer longslide and used white litheum on the slide rails.No galling and no problems.I use it now on my FN-FAL's and in side of S&W wheelguns.I disagree with that armorer totaly.
Bob

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Age and deceit will overcome youth and speed.
I'm old and deceitful.

 

[Noban]

MB - I use RIG +P grease on all of my automatics, including my M1A, M1 and AR. The product was designed for stainless steel autos, but is also recommended for all autos. It's a great lube - stays put, real slick, and provides corrosion protection.

My theory on lubrications is that oils should be used in closed environments (trigger, springs, etc.) and grease should be used in the open (rails). This same methodology is applied in all mechanical applications, such as automobile engines and other friction surfaces.

 

[Mike Irwin]

Noban,

Actually, I use grease on closed environments, and think it is a MUCH better solution there, too.

Why?

Because grease stays put. Oil will run away from the parts being lubricated over time. Cars have oil pumps. Most guns (ok, some Japanese and Italian machine guns had oil pumps, but that was for the cartridges... ). Greasing once and forgetting for a couple of months is better than oiling once and having the internals become dryer than a bone over the same period of time.

------------------
Beware the man with the S&W .357 Mag.
Chances are he knows how to use it.

 

[Ledbetter]

If you're going to the range, or aren't going to carry the gun for a while, or don't want to oil the slide rails often, grease is best because it stays where you put it. Like Rosco Benson, I also use Lubriplate brand white grease. I use it on every auto I own from .22 to .45 and have never noticed more gunk with grease than oil.

It's important to stress that you only use a tiny tiny bit to coat the area subject to friction. I put it where I can see wear beginning and allow it to spread out from there onto the rest of the slide rail.

Grease is good.

Ledbetter

 

[m3bullet]

Ah, the art and science of tribology (lubrication). As we all know, there are many lubrication "solutions" for firearms, but which ones are best? Is there a best?

Like everything else, FWIW, the following is just another man's opinion. As a mechanical engineer, I also subscribe to the philosophy: oil for "closed" systems, "grease" for open systems. However, certain situations are not always so black and white. For example, if clearances are tight, as in pistol slide-rail applications, oil may be the better solution, as grease may tend to impede the action, particularly in colder temperatures. My new Beretta M96 action is so tight that oil is the only lubricating solution (I like FP10 - of course, only for its cinnamon smell!).

On the plus side for grease, it can support greater loads while preventing metal to metal contact, e.g. large bearings. I use PlastiLube, which was originally produced for the wide temperature extremes found in aircraft applications. I first used it to lube my SA M1A/M14. Works great, very clean product. It is regarded as the premier lubricant for bolt and op rod systems of the M1A/M14 rifles. I also like to use PlastiLube on the large bearing surfaces of the cylinder yoke assemblies of my S&W revolvers to produce silky smooth reloads. These surfaces are often not machined as smooth as you would like and benefit greatly from the load bearing qualities of grease.

BTW, Audi & BMW each have their own part numbers for PlastiLube, as both use it for lubricating disc brake calipers, another high temperature application. BMW's part number is 81 22 9 407 103. One of these packets will last a long time, so just snip the edge of the packaging to feed small amounts.

To answer my questions above:

"Some are better than others", and
"probably not".

Best of luck with your selections.

 

[JackFlash]

Most guns I see are dripping with oil or sticky coated with grease. Too much lubricant is as bad as none at all because it attracts powder residue (and dirt, lint, grit).

A little bit of Gun Slick on the rails, hammer/slide interface, Couple drops of oil on the pivot points in the action.

A gun is not like an engine that is heating up and running fast under high loads. The loads on moving parts in a gun are not great, and they're not grinding together. A little lube goes a long way.

We had an M-60 in the Army that started to jam because it was dry and dirty. (This was a field exercise, not combat.) We cleaned the parts in water and lube it with what was available -- creamy peanut butter from the C-Rations. Seemed to work fine. The smell was pretty strange. I can't vouch for the wear on the parts.

 

[EQUALIZER]

FWIW, As long as you clean and replace the lube frequently, any high quality grease, oil, or creamy peanut butter will work just fine. Remember, peanut butter is mostly light oil. Choosy mothers choose JIF .

You know your own habbits. If you tend to go a long time between cleaning, shooting, or skip cleanings inbetween, stick with a good grease. If you get hungry at the range pack an extra jar of jam and a loaf of bread to go with your lubricant.

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"But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip; and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." -Jesus Christ (Luke 22:36, see John 3:15-18)
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"Reasonable gun law?............There's No such critter!" --EQ

 

[JNewell]

JIF -- nah, you need the natural stuff <g>.

I have read accounts of Garands being lubricated (in a desparate pinch) with oil rubbed from the face (which is mostly lanolin).

As pointed out above, oil does tend to migrate out of/away from things like slides and barrels/bushings. A weekly check is a good idea, especially on a pistol. Revolvers seem to be a little more tolerant of neglect.

 

[riddleofsteel]

Cylinder & Slide has perhaps the best essay on semiauto pistol lubrication i have ever read. they send it along with every gun they work on or sell.
i totally disagree with this "armorer". i have used "red" gun grease on the rails and bearing surfaces of my semiautos including locking lugs, barrel and barrel bushing surfaces for several decades. the ONLY thing i use oil for is the trigger group and the recoil spring/guide rod assembly. i have never had a lube or lack of lube related stoppage or premature wear on any surface!! i have, however seen mutiple guns at the range stop or jam due to insufficent lube or dirt/carbon fouling contamination.
grease emulsifies dirt and carbon fouling and prevents it from galling metal to metal conact surfaces. it is heat resistant and will not run out of the end of your slide in 100+ heat or gum up and stop your pistol in -0 weather. if fact i see it as superior to standard oil in evey way in the applications i have mentioned. white automotive lithium grease works well for these purposes but "red" gun grease is available in syringe applicators that is perfect for putting the grease were you want it. just be sure to pull back on the plunger before putting the syringe away so the grease does not continue to come out.

------------------
Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what is for lunch.
Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the outcome of the vote.
Let he that hath no sword sell his garment and buy one. Luke 22-36
They all hold swords, being expert in war: every man hath his sword upon his thigh because of fear in the night. Song of Solomon 3-8
The man that can keep his head and aims carefully when the situation has gone bad and lead is flying usually wins the fight.

 

[WalterGAII]

Neither Syntec nor Mobil 1 will evaporte, break down, or otherwise leave your slide or other parts "dry". I use Mobil 1, 15W50, exclusively, on my Bushy, Glocks, and 1911's. If it'll protect a racing engine at 15,000 rpm, it'll handle anything that a firearm can throw at it. (And besides, it contains detergents, which keep carbon in suspension)

 

[Edmund Rowe]

Some kinds of grease will help gun functioning, or at least won't hurt.

Not all grease is alike. Something like cosmoline obviously isn't something to put on the rails of an autoloading pistol.

Well, I thought it's obvious. Saw a guy at a bowling pin match once who said all 3 of his guns were jamming. A Para-Ordnance, Kimber and a Colt Gold Cup IIRC. I thought something has got to be bad wrong for all 3 to be malfunctioning. I looked at one and cycled the slide and noticed brownish grease slopped all through the rails. I mean a HEAVY grease job here! I should have said "Yeah, these Kimbers, Para-Ordnances, and Gold Cups are really overrated. I'll take them off your hands for $200 each." However, I had way too much pity on the guy and told him to clean all the grease off and use oil. Now, some kinds of grease I'm sure would have worked just fine but with this shooter I figured we'd better go back to square one. I don't think he used cosmoline but it looked pretty bad in there anyway.

Edmund

 

[Siggy]

This is like calgon (ancient chinese secret!!). I use SnapOn air tool oil on all my semi's and have found none that even compare in durability and performance. Check it out!

 

[bk40]

grease is good. Occasionly use STP myself. Just a dab will do yah!

 

[Seronac]

Interesting discussion. Here's the way I see it:

1. Follow the mechanical engineer's (m3bullet) advice. Mechanical engineers know their stuff.
2. Follow the manufacturer's recommendations. They know their stuff better than anybody.
3. High quality synthetic Teflon gun oil if you clean often. LIGHT grease, if you clean less often. More grease if you are storing for a while.

I can tell you from experience (the best teacher?) that too much lube (oil or grease) will cause a malfunction. Lubricate sparingly! Too much lube is worse that none at all, especially if it collects dirt and/or grit! Dirt and/or grit will do in a firearm quicker than no lubrication at all will!

The ONLY time my semi-autos have malfunctioned, the cause has been
(1)inferior ammo,
(2)too much lubricant, or
(3)dirty lubricant.

So, that's my opinion.

On the other hand, the saying goes that opinions are like bum-holes: everyone's got one and they all stink!