Got a rifle confiscated tonight...

[Bigfatts]

So I'm sitting on my butt in front of the tv watching Survivorman when the doorbell rings. I open the door and see a well dressed man with a badge around his neck and a file folder under his arm.

"Are you Matthew?"
"Yes sir."
"I'm so-and-so with Hillsborough County Sheriff's Office, I need to ask you a couple questions. Did you buy a rifle on the 14th of August."
"Probably, which one?" (I buy too many to keep track of dates in my head.)

So he tells me what gun it is (a Savage Anschutz Mark 10 .22, and I say yes I bought it. He then goes on to explain that it was reported stolen before I bought it and the report just made it's way to them. Here I started thinkin' something was fishy. But he had both a copy of my sales receipt from the pawn shop I bought it from and a copy of the pawn ticket from the person who pawned it. I can say that the papers were authentic because I do quite alot of business with this particular shop and recognized the letterhead, and I don't think anyone could forge my signature without breaking their wrist.

So long story short, he had to take the rifle and send it out for ballistic fingerprinting. A judge now gets to decide whether or not I get to keep it or whether I get reimbursed. He said there is no reason I should not get it back being that I bought it legally and all. It brings a tear to my eye to think of my poor Anschutz sitting all alone in that cold evidence room.

Overall it was as pleasant an experience as it could be given the situation. The detective was very polite and treated me respectfully. Now it's a waiting game...

 

[JohnKSa]

That's rough. I'm surprised they told you you'd get it back, maybe that's a good sign.

 

[PPGMD]

I don't know about how it works in other areas of the country, gun dealers are required to wait around two weeks to sell a gun that gets sold to them, but at least here in Sarasota they only come around and pickup the forms once every two weeks, then there is processing, so it's very likely that the gun will sell before the Sheriff's office processes the paperwork.

 

[Doyle]

What if it was stolen? I'm sure the original owner has primary claim doesn't he?

 

[Bigfatts]

What if it was stolen? I'm sure the original owner has primary claim doesn't he?

That's what I thought. I guess that's why it has to go before a judge. The dealer told me the day he got it in the shop that he had it and knew I would be interested. I had to wait 30 days before buying it, that's the law, anything sold to a pawn shop has to be held for 30 days prior to being put up for sale.

I'm surprised they told you you'd get it back, maybe that's a good sign.

That's what I'm hoping. If not, at least I get reimbursed for what I paid for it. Of course that doesn't include all the time I put into getting the stock refinished and finding the parts needed to get the trigger working right(had to get them thru Anschuetz Germany).

SIGH...

 

[Wildalaska]

What right do they have to take your gun? JBTs!!!...and you let them? You are lucky they haven't put ya in a camp! Molon Labe! From my cold dead fingers! You are nothing but a sheeple! If they would have come to my place I would have never even opened the door, unless they can show a warrant from all the people of the county they have no authority over you. They violated the 4th amendment. Id rather be judged by 12 then carried by sex. Hang the traitors! Lets vote from the rooftops! lets goooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo*fat bellied old guy in Hello Kitty Midriff t-shirt cut just above navel (which is used to store a spare chilled Bud), camo marble bag thong bathing suit, flip flops and Swiis alpenflage camo helmet charges out door with Filipino AR-15 style 22 rifle to the hysterical laughter of SWAT team who are too busy pissing themselves with glee to even consider arresting the poor schnook*

Huh....o sorry was daydreaming a bit, hope you get your rifle back

WildprimingtimeAlaska TM

 

[RevolverLover]

Wild, that was just scary

 

[Al Norris]

Yeah... The description Ken gave of himself was... Ummm... Can't use those words on this forum... OK. Scary will have to do!

Bigfats, I'm sorry to hear of your misfortune. Hope the original owner appreciates what ya did to his rifle.

 

[357 Python]

Considering that badges can be stolen, bought through the mail, on-line, or at yardsales or swap meets how do you know he really was with the sheriff's office? Did he show you a photo ID and did you call the sheriff's office to verify the ID? Sounds like you may have been scammed. Call the sheriff's office and verify if he actually works there and what his status is. They normally need a seizure warrant to take property unless that property is turned over or there is some other exigent circumstance. Normally they have the warrant when they show up in case. Good luck with it.

 

[WSM MAGNUM]

He said there is no reason I should not get it back being that I bought it legally and all. It brings a tear to my eye to think of my poor Anschutz sitting all alone in that cold evidence room.

How do think the original owner feels about his poor Anschutz getting stolen from him and is now sitting in the evidence room. I think the gun should go back to him and you should be reimbursed what you paid.

 

[Powderman]

He said that there was a chance you would get it back, did he?

Call the police. Call the department he represented, and do it right now. Verify that this guy works there, and that he is a police officer.

Here is the reason:

When guns are stolen, AND the owner has a serial number to turn in, they are entered into NCIC. They never fall off the record until they are found or recovered.

When the gun is recovered, the original owner is notified. After clearance through the department, the gun is returned to the original owner.

Period. Full stop.

Unless the department is one that destroys all firearms, the original owner will get their gun back, and you might be out of some money.

 

[DPris]

Big,
Sounds a bit odd.
Unless the original owner's insurance has already paid off on it, he or she would usually have first claim to any recovered stolen firearm.
The rifle would not need to be sent out for ballistic testing merely as a recovered stolen, if it has to be tested I'd think that would mean it's suspected of being involved in a crime. The criminal use would be the factor that'd bring in a judge to determine ultimate disposition.
If merely recovered stolen, it should go back to either the original owner or the insurance company that paid off on it & now owns it once the police are through with it, no judge required (in my part of the country, anyway) to be involved in deciding that. If recovered stolen AND used in a crime, a judge could or would make the determination of whether the rifle goes to the original owner, to the insurance company, or be destroyed once any legal processes involving it run their course.
Unless you have some very different legal theories & processes where you live, a buyer of stolen goods is usually deemed to have no rights of ownership in such property, regardless of whether that buyer knew it was stolen or not. The original owner of the property typically gets it back on recovery, if it's released after the recovering agency determines the property does not need to be held for processing, evidence, or subsequent prosecution.
Legal procedures vary from area to area, but I'd be surprised to see you get the rifle back when the PD finishes testing. It either belongs to the original theft victim, or to an insurance company. Buying it legally normally makes no difference.
Denis

 

[lockedcj7]

Because you bought it at a store dealing in "goods of the kind", you had a reasonable expectation that it was not stolen. You have a reasonable claim to the gun and may actually get it back. The original owner now has a beef to settle with the crook and pawn shop owner but not you. The ballistic test may just be a matter of the dept. wanting to compare it to any open cases and/or keep the bullet and case for comparison later to any potential cases.

YMMV.

 

[grymster2007]

He said there is no reason I should not get it back being that I bought it legally and all.

I don’t get it! Why wouldn’t the rifle be returned to it’s original owner and the buyer be reimbursed by the seller? Let’s say… oh, I don’t know… let’s say WA steals my Lambo and sells it to you. Once the authorities figure the whole thing out, you get to keep the car? Don’t seem right to me.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

The original owner now has a beef to settle with the crook and pawn shop owner but not you.

No, the original owner has nothing to settle with the pawn shop. From the accounting here, the pawn shop did everything correctly with the correct paperwork. The pawn shop is as much of a victim as the original owner.

When the gun is recovered, the original owner is notified. After clearance through the department, the gun is returned to the original owner.

Period. Full stop.

Not exactly at least in Texas. There may be multiple parties involved. The original owner may not longer have title to the gun in the sense that the insurance company may have paid a claim and hence potentially have actual ownership. The gun may end up in magistrates court where claims to ownership are settled.

As a pawnbroker, we went through this process where items were confiscated by the police that had been reported lost or stolen by the owners. The original owners often failed to show for magistrates court or have a representative present and the merchandise would revert back to the pawnshop.

 

[dogtown tom]

I believe most states have laws that "protect" the pawnbroker/pawnshop when they sell an item that later turns out to have been stolen.

Usually, when an item is pawned or sold outright to the shop, the pawnshop may not immediately resell it, but must wait a period (usually 10-14 days) to allow the police depts. pawn shop detail time to check for stolen items. At the end of this grace period the shop is free to sell the item (if it was bought, not pawned for a loan).

Later, if the item turns out to have been stolen, the police will confiscate the item and the pawnshop is out the $$$ and out of luck. If the pawnshop has sold the item and the police track you down, they may confiscate the item, and return it to the rightful owner.

This is where I have a problem with the law. The pawnshop has no requirement to refund the purchase price to the buyer. If the buyer wants his $$$ back he has to file a civil action against the person who pawned the item originally. Good luck finding that guy.

 

[Bigfatts]

Well here's what I know. The guy is an actual detective, he had a court order for the rifle (forgot to mention that before) and works for Hillsborough County Sheriff's Dept. He also had copies of the pawn ticket and my sales receipt from when I bought it. So unless this guy went to absurd links to steal this one old .22 from me and bypass the much nicer ones I have, he is legit.

The owner went out of town and let his daughter house sit. The daughter's scumbag boyfriend made off with all the father's guns and pawned/sold them all. This is the 4th or 5th gun they have recovered. The type of character this boyfriend is and where a couple of the other guns were recovered prompted the ballistic finger printing.

I actually would not mind if the rifle went back to the original owner, as long as I get reimbursed. I know how I would feel if one of mine were stolen. I do hope he appreciates the free stock work.

 

[ShootemDown]

sounds like you gotta press charges against the scumbag boyfriend...

 

[KyJim]

A thief cannot pass good title on stolen goods. The original owner should get the rifle back. Your claim is against the pawnshop. They give an implied warranty of title on the goods they sell. It is a risk of their business. Go ask the pawnshop for your money back.

 

[Mike40-11]

When guns are stolen, AND the owner has a serial number to turn in, they are entered into NCIC. They never fall off the record until they are found or recovered.

No kidding. A buddy of mine had 2 pistols stolen several years ago. Similar situation with a boyfriend...

3 years later he got a call from the local PD "Hey we got your pistol back, you can come pick it up."

Here's the odd part. It was an old cap and ball repro. It was picked up in NYC where it was used to hold up a convenience store. (It was stolen several hundred miles away.)

Cap and ball. Whaddya suppose the odds are that the guy robbing the store even knew how to load it?