G19 or Sig 228 - dilemma

[meat]

I'm stuck deciding between a Sig 228 and a Glock 19. I've shot both and like both. I also own these guns "bigger" brothers, the Glock 17 and the Sig 220, so I am familiar w/ both designs and shoot them equally well. However, the Glock 19 Phase 3 malfunctions concern me because this gun will primarily used for personal protection, so reliabilty and durability are paramount. Rust and frame thickness are the main concerns I have w/ the Sig 228, since I plan on using a holster (around the house - I live in MD ). Any advice or suggestions????

 

[edamon2k]

I'd get the sig.

btw, why would you walk around the house with a holstered gun? you live in the ghetto?

-d

 

[CZ_]

Both will serve you well.

I prefer the Sig, it fits the hands better and is more accurate for me. The Glock is a nice gun as well, and if you plan to shoot it heavily it is likely a little more durable than the Sig. The Glock is definitely better at rust resistence. Try both out and buy what you like best.

 

[cslinger]

Both do the job perfectly and are

completely different. Are you more comfortable with traditional double action or Glock Safe Action. I personally prefer TDA and I think SIG makes about the best combat handgun out there.

I have owned Glocks but when it comes down to it, I just don't like the triggers, too weird and too light for my tastes. Certainly not bashing them though, as they are about tough as rocks and shoot pretty well too.

Chris

I would go SIG 228 one of the finest the world has to offer.

 

[branrot]

I've got a 229 in .40 and a Glock 23. Both are excellent guns. However, for a carry gun, I'd go with the Glock. Slimmer and lighter than the Sig. I also think the Glock (especially with regards to its finish) is more durable. Either one will serve you well.

 

[meat]

In response to edamon2k, I wouldn't say that I live in the ghetto, but crime is definitely on the rise around here. Lately, carjackers have been stealing cars and dropping them off on my street. As a matter of fact, I caught one trying to steal my brother's friend's car who was over visiting the other night. I talked to the police about it, and now they patrol our street. But the amount of riff raff coming through the neighborhood is on the rise (gangs and whatnot), and it does have me concerned. I want one of these 9mm handguns so that I can keep it handy and will probably keep it out of the safe and in a holster by my bed when I sleep. Believe me, I'm not the Mall Ninja type, I just want to play it safe until I can afford to move out.

I guess my main factor in choosing between these guns is reliability when it counts. Plus I want it to be durable. As I've stated, I own a glock 17 and a Sig 220, but would like a compact for the house (I shoot the others for fun). I shoot both equally well, but my main concerns are in my original post (see above). I look at this purchase as a life saving tool and as an investment. I want the best bang for my buck, no pun intended. However, the more I read about these phase 3 problems w/ the glock 19, the more I lean towards the Sig : http://communities.prodigy.net/sportsrec/glock/gz-phase3.html

Thanks for the responses so far. Please keep them coming.

 

[spleenandideal]

I'd go for the P228. It is one of my favorite handguns. If the thickness is of concern, consider the P225. You do lose the higher capacity, however. Rust shouldn't be an issue if you care for the pistol properly; with that in mind consider the stainless P229....basically the same size as the P228 but an ounce heavier.

 

[Kilroy]

I would go with the Glock. Fewer parts, easier to manage trigger, thinner profile for concealment, more durable and has a longer service life. Consider the ergonomic size of trigger to grip length. From an ergonomic study, that length on the Glock will be 3.36 inches. The Sig is as 3.64 inches, almost the same as the Glock 21 at 3.60.

It would seem that going with an easier to manage trigger with a shorter reach length would be better then a longer reach and heavier trigger. I just wore a 228 for eight days in an IWB, and rust was definitely an issue with that gun.

Good luck on your choice.

Kilroy...
...was here

 

[Ala Dan]

Either Will Serve You Well, But-

quite naturally, I would go for the Sig P228! Why?
Cuz I'm already acustomed to the P228's big brother,
the P220.

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

 

[Sierra]

If reliability is the question either would be a fine choice. The phase III malfunction seems to be only occurring with the NYPD and at Gunsite. My G19 has given me 12 years of superb service and my Sig 220 has had similar performance over 10 years. Personally, I would worry more about muzzle flip than the phase III malfunction.

 

[Greg Bell]

228/229

In the end, the Sig will be more accurate and reliable. If you are used to both of them then pick the Sig. The Sig has one, and only one, drawback as a combat handgun--da/sa transition. Muzzle flip is a true non-issue in the 228/229 9mm. The whole "high bore axis" thing smells of the lamp. I'm sure you won't have any problem maintaining it rust-wise. If Sigs are the choice of the SEALS and SAS then I'm sure they can handle a little house weather.

GHB

 

[9mmMike]

I have both. I carry the 19 more often. I carry a Glock 26 the most. The Sig is a nice shooter and I use it quite a bit as an "intro" gun for novices.
It is very easy to shoot accurately but I do not think that the 19 is less accurate though.
I do not understand how anyone can claim one is inherently more accurate than the other.
I carry the Glock because it is less maintenance. The Sig requires a wipe down when you take it off, at least around here, especially in the summer.
The Glock comes off at night and goes back on in the morning. I can wear it while doing yard work and I worry more about the holster than the pistol.
I shoot about once a week and it gets cleaned/inspected after each trip to the range.
For me it's really that simple.
Mike

 

[CAP1]

P228

My P228 will be one of those that stays with me for the duration. Hopefully to be passed on to one of my kids. I am really wanting a second and am still kicking myself for not getting one at the gun show a few weeks back for $569 NIB. They are hard to find here if you want a new gun. Used police trad-ins are available from $400 up. There are still some 13rd magazines available if you hunt around on the web.
The SIG is hard to beat.
Get both. Just get the 228 1st.
CAP

 

[edamon2k]

meat,

amazingly you had a good answer. I was actually expecting something along the typical lines of "someone could break in at anytime during the day, I need to be prepared!" lol.

In addition to the sig, you might want to look at the new beretta vertec - I took a look at one today and it's alot smaller then the old 92F and quite comfortable and they are about as accurate as the sigs.

-d

 

[IanS]

First, I'd like to state I'm a Glock fan. But I don't know if the NYPD G19 malfunctions are merely overblown or something to be concerned about. Mainly, because either extremes (as usual) are so entrenched in their opinions that its difficult for the truth to come out.

Personally, I wouldn't hesitate to buy a G19 for defense if I was in the market for a 9mm. Whatever pistol I intend for defense gets shot extensively for reliability before I rely on it anways . But if you're used to the Sig DA/SA for defensive shooting, go with the P228 if it will allay your "doubts" imagined or not. But if these Phase 3 malfunctions are truly overblown it would be unfortunate that you were swayed away from a choice that was better for you. But you can't go wrong with a Sig P228, it truly is one of the best 9mm's in the market. Not much of a help, I know. But hey you're talking about two of my favorite 9mm's next to the BHP.

 

[meat]

Thanks for all of the replies. Just for your info Ian11 , I just came back from a job trip which happened to be in NYC. I got to talking to a couple of the officers there and asked them politely about the whole NYPD glock 19 phase 3 stuff. They confirmed for me that it is in fact a real problem. But not for all of the officers that use the glock 19. As a matter of fact, one of the officers I was talking to loves his. He said that there are quite a few officers that experience problems w/ their G19's though. Glock does have an on site facility to help w/ problem guns. But the officer was not sure (and I don't think that Glock is either) what causes these phase 3 malf. What they think causes it has to do w/ the rapid cyclic rate of the shorter slide and the wear on the extractor (and some mumbo jumbo about the harmonics of the weapon ) . Also, firing out of battery can really be a potential cause for this, so Glock has modified the design of the barrel hood and thinned the portion of the slide that rubs the barrel hood to ensure a good battery lock up. I guess it's kind of a crap shoot if you buy a glock 19, huh? Basically, the only way you can find out if you have a good one, is to shoot it often. I'd love to know how many consumers of the glock 19 (non law enforcement) have actually had problems w/ this regarding their G19......

 

[IanS]

meat,

I know this has been discussed to death here and everywhere. But this is why "I" wouldn't hesitate to buy a G19 for myself. While I don't doubt NYPD's problems with some of their G19's could be very real it does seem to be an isolated case exclusive to the NYPD. If there was an inherent problem with the G19 in terms of reliability I think we would have heard about it a lot sooner than this. The G19 is one of Glocks "oldest" (relatively speaking) models and it has been issued to many other police dept's and some military. I frequent Glocktalk and other places and it just doesn't seem to be an issue relative to the frequency the NYPD seems to be having with theirs. The NYPD also has the trigger modified. I'm not a Glock armorer and am not qualified to say this but I'm guessing it might be a factor. If I were to buy one today and leave it unmodified I'm guessing I'd be satisfied with its performances like most others are. By the way I used to own a G19 about 7 years ago. It hiccuped once in its first 300 rounds (it might have been my fault) and was fine the next 1000. I traded it in for a .40 Sig P229 on a whim Then "went back" to my now trusty companion the Glock 23. I've now decided to stop switching guns and just focus on being good with what I've got.

I'm not trying to sway you toward the Glock. If I was in your shoes I'd probably end up flipping a coin.


edit: By the way I saw a full nickel P228 last month here in Calif! Tears were welling up when I saw it. It was beautiful man. And I don't usually go for shiny guns. But $850!? Yikes.

 

[Hard Ball]

When you buy a pistol for self defense you are literally betting your life on it. The SIG is more reliable and usually more accurate, AND it is not subject to hard jams that can only be cleared by disassembling the pistol (phase III malfunctions). Whay is your life worth to you/ Get the SIG!

 

[FPrice]

meat...

From what I can tell, Phase III malfunctions seem to be VERY rare in the NYPD, and even rarer outside. In fact, it seems to have originated with the NYPD. I wish that I could give you a reference for Pat Rogers' posting on this somewhere here on TFL.

Either gun will serve you well, but my vote is for the G19. I have had three and have never had problems with any of mine. Many Glock owners can tell you the same thing. My personal opinion is that you have to do your research, try to buy intelligently, then practise and become very familiar with any gun you decide to carry. And keep it clean.

If I were given a P228 to carry I would not feel "under-gunned" or any other form of inadequacy. In fact I have my eye on one on my local dealer's wall. It just that other guns keep getting in my way.

But between the two I would give the nod to the G19.

 

[meat]

Thanks for the personal accounts. This is what I'm looking for. But 850 for a shiny new nickel sig 228??? NO WAY!!!! I'll stick w/ the regular model.... If that's what I decide to get