First rifle: AK or AR?

AR or AK?

  • AR15

    Votes: 54 84.4%
  • AK47

    Votes: 10 15.6%

  • Total voters
    64
  • Poll closed .

Lee6113

New member
Hey all,

I am looking forwards to purchasing a rifle (may not be soon, but definitely excited!), and I was wondering what the pros and cons would be for buying an AK (74? 47?) or just an AR-15? I'm fairly neutral, just a little experience with ar15, and never touched an AK.

Maintenance is easier for the AK, I'll assume.

Any comments? I know it's a very vague subject, but I've got some time to think about which I will purchase first. Please no flaming on brand or another, I would like intelligent responses regarding both platforms.
 

Pond James Pond

New member
I went through a similar process about a year ago. However, for me it was between the AR and CZ's VZ58.

I'll start by saying that the CZ has a lot to offer and would be worth you looking at.

Where I live, the CZ had the advantage of being far, far cheaper to buy but was less accurate (relatively speaking) and had fewer means of upgrading. It shot far more smoothly than the AKs I tried and I really liked the build of it.

I, ultimately, went for the more expensive AR which I've been enjoying a great deal.

Having seen how both are put together, yes, the AK (and CZ) are simpler to take apart, but that doesn't mean in the slightest that the AR is difficult to maintain.

I was initially flummoxed by the seeming complexity but after some good descriptions in a cleaning thread I'd started and now the procedure is child's play.

For me caliber was a consideration, only being able to get 7.62x39 for the Eastern European models and .223 for the AR, but I expect you can choose either caliber in the AK or CZ.

Do have a look at the CZ.
 

skizzums

New member
I am a much bigger fan of AR15's over AK's. I voted AK even though I have personally purged my inventory of anything in the 7.62x39 caliber. But they were my first rifles, first a couple of SKS' that a had a heckuva time customizing on the cheap and a VZ2008 that was a great price, lightweight and surprisingly accurate for the AK-like platform. I say good first rifles because mainly, the ammo is cheap and widely available. The upgrades and customizations are cheap and widely available. They shoot accurately enough to learn your basic rifle skills and shoot reliably enough to have a blast doing mag dumps and whatever new shooters like to do. Keep it simple, stay with irons at first until you can shoot well with them, then upgrade to a dot if you want, then go crazy with it. I will never own one again, but I have fond memories of them. Nowadays I enjoy shooting slowly at long distances as accurately as possible and the AK doesn't lend well to that. But might I recommend an SKS over an AK? If that's an option, I think it'll serve you better as a first rifle and they are generally slightly more accurate, if maybe only heavier, but have the most simplistic yet rugged design I've seen on a semi auto, and the customizations are literally limited only by your imagination. Good luck and have fun.
 

peggysue

Moderator
I have over a half dozen of each. Including AR/AK pistols. The AR is less expensive, fun to build, and it also has lots of accessories. Like Legos. It is an addiction. Got my SKS when they were going for under $100 LOL..AK is better.

I say AR for a first timer.
 
Last edited:

Panfisher

New member
Between the two for me it would be the AR hands down. Never liked the feel of the AK's, although an SKS might not be a bad compromise. AR's are cheap, and available nowadays. Depending on what you want to do with it, you could easily get a bolt action rifle and low end scope for the same money.
 

rickyrick

New member
I'd say AR because the prices may not ever be this low again.

But get the one that most appeals to you.

No fun having the one you settled for and not the one u wanted
 

9x19

New member
AK first, then an AR: You'll be thinking why did I waste so much time on an AK?

AR first, then an AK: You'll be thinking why did I waste so much AR money on an AK?

:D

AR first, then another AR... makes you :)

Yeah, I have a preference... :p
 

Art Eatman

Staff in Memoriam
So what's the intended use? Casual messing around as a range toy? Serious paper punching for tight groups? Hunting? Home defense?
 

pilpens

New member
+1 AR. Approx $500, you can get a decent basic AR with plenty of accuracy.
=======
I went AR 5.45x39 (when surplus was cheap) over AK for my first carbine.
AR just felt better to me.
 

doofus47

New member
I've become a fan of the AR platform over the past couple years.
Not perfect, but functions well.
I have never fired an AK; I was an early adopter of the SKS and liked the heck out of that, so I never had the need to AK-up.
I graduated to the next-gen SKS, the VZ58, and never looked back.
For my need-to-hit the 4" circle shooting, like hunting in brush, I shoot an AR.
For, scaring tin cans and gallon jugs in the woods with my friends, I shoot the vz.
If you know what you want to do with your rifle, those are my two suggestions.
 

Fishbed77

New member
Having (and loving) both, I'd have to say the AR-15 is the better choice for a first rifle. It's just more versatile for me, parts and accessories are plentiful, it has better ergonomics, and it's easier to shoot well.

That last part is important for a first rifle. It's harder to improve your skills when you are fighting against the system as well.

(In all honestly, your first rifle should probably be a .22LR of some variety, but that's beyond the scope of this discussion).


Maintenance is easier for the AK, I'll assume.

Not necessarily.

While is certainly takes longer to clean an AR than an AK, it's not like you really have to clean it all that often, as an AR will run fine as long as it's properly lubed.

If a part breaks on an AR, replacement is something you can do easily yourself with a few hand tools and maybe a vice. Not so with an AK.
 

Regular Joe

New member
I got the AK first. A Yugo M70 AB2. At the time, AR's were expensive, and the Yugo was $485, brand new and out the door. It's heavy for the size, but everyone who shoots it says it's the tightest AK they've seen.
If you just want a "fun gun", and something to carry along when you think there might be something bad nearby, it's good to have.
I've since moved on to a pair of AR's (rifle and carbine), and I prefer them, but I can't part with the AK.
If I didn't have one already, I probably wouldn't get one, now that I've become "an AR guy".
I got this:
http://palmettostatearmory.com/index.php/ar-15-05/barreled-upper-assemblies/psa-16-mid-length-chf-5-56-1-7-upper-with-bcg-and-charging-handle.html
It's worth waiting until they become available. There's nothing left to want in a carbine upper, and that's the heart of the gun. I mated that to the PSA blem lower:
http://palmettostatearmory.com/index.php/catalog/product/view/id/14434/
You can't do better than that, whether you build or buy new.
 

Lee6113

New member
So what's the intended use? Casual messing around as a range toy? Serious paper punching for tight groups? Hunting? Home defense?
___________

Pretty much a range toy. Useable should shtf.


(In all honestly, your first rifle should probably be a .22LR of some variety, but that's beyond the scope of this discussion).
Honestly I may get a .22 rifle before one of those, but it wouldn't be an Ak or Ar, haha.



CZ's VZ58.

I'll start by saying that the CZ has a lot to offer and would be worth you looking at.

Haven't even thought of a CZ rifle. I'll have to look into this.
 

T. O'Heir

New member
"...Pretty much a range toy. Useable should shtf..." AR. It's way better for target shooting, serious competition or not. Buckets of daft aftermarket stuff available too.
The AK is not and never will be anything but a battle rifle. It(and the SKS) was designed to be issued to illiterate conscript who could be trained to use it as fast as possible. Accuracy was not a requirement. The sights and triggers are crappy anyway.
In the highly unlikely event of a total collapse of Western civilization, it's far more likely that you'll be able to find .223/5.56 ammo in North America than 7.62 x 39. Despite current supplies. You won't find 5.45×39(AKM) at all. Little or none of that round now.
"...Maintenance is easier for the AK..." No moreso than any other rifle.
 

tirod

Moderator
Breaking it down:

First of all, caliber counts, What you are going to shoot determines what cartridge determines what kind of rifle. With "plinking" it's a toss up. With "self defense" both are capable. Costs of ammo, about the same, they compete for cheapest on the earth because both are government subsidized.

With AK ammo you have to watch for any future bans. With AR ammo you have to watch for any future bans. Kind of a draw.

Ballistics, the 5.56 has longer, flatter range and is more lethal. Really. Sorry AK fans but the low powered import junk that powers them isn't up the level of XM reject government wholesale products dumped on the market by the contractor. AR ammo at the lowest cost is better. Move up to $1 a round commercial hunting or precision loads and sorry, the AR is still flatter, more accurate because of that, and can deliver lethal amounts of power to it's outer range. It can do that because AK ammo has more bullet drop which causes it to be less capable and have less range.

Just because it's .30 doesn't make it better. Sorry. It's why we weren't pinned down in Afghanistan with AK's - the insurgents didn't even try, they moved way up to Russian .50 cal to have a decided 1,000 yard advantage.

If you could find a Finnish Valmet in 5.56 and shoot it side by side against an AR , then the gun itself becomes an issue. The AK does not help the shooter - if anything, it defies you to being capable within a few hundred rounds. The AR was designed to become easy and familiar very quickly. First, the magazine catch can be operated by the trigger finger when it won't be doing something else, and does NOT require you to remove your hand from the grip. Second, the bolt hold open - the AR holds the bolt back on the last shot. Push button, drop mag, insert other with off hand, hit bolt catch with off hand, BCG chambers round, and you don't even drop your eyes from the sights.

AK? Sorry. You have to drop the mag with the paddle catch off hand, then insert the magazine AGAINST THE CLOSED BOLT, which adds the spring pressure of forcing a fully loaded magazine up against it. Then the bolt handle has to be grabbed by the trigger hand to cycle it to chamber a round, which loses seconds getting it back in action. Your hand is off the grip and your eyes are often off the sights.

AR's are easy to keep in action firing rounds, AK's defy you to be either good or fast. But if it's a plinking rifle that is moot. Combat speed isn't critical.

Self defense? Not. It's critical, and it's one reason why you see very few AK's in the upper ranks of 3Gun competition. It's usually as a statement of principle than one of being better.

Accessories? AR hands down. Far more of them, and when you look at AK accessories none are coming in from overseas. They are all derivatives of AR gear adapted to the AK with workaround mounts.

Brings us to optics - the AR has a picatinny quick mount rail on the top of the upper receiver, the AK has a bolt cover that isn't suitable for much else as it's not secure and wobbles. AK optics are about as easy to mount as red dots on lever actions. You can use the same ones, but the mounting plates and adapters are low production higher cost units.

Maintenance? They are both self loading actions, which means they both dump gas residue from the barrel past the brass as it opens the action. Both do it, just like the HK or FNFAL or ARX or any other blowback, including all the auto loading pistols. The action will get dirty regardless. With the AR you shotgun the upper, pull the BCG, tear it down, and when you extract the bolt you are cleaning the gas pistol and cylinder.

Do that to the AK and once the bolt is out, you still have to pull the upper handguard off to get to the gas cylinder. AK maintenance is actually more complicated and requires more work. Not much more, but it's more none the less.

However, most fans won't accept these facts and complain it's trash talking. Sorry, facts are facts, and it's why even the Russian Staff is trying to get away from the AK altogether. Budget and tradition make it hard, but they are in print saying they would like a "modern" firearm. China DID, the AK is built for export, not for use by their armed forces. They moved to a locally designed bullpup. But that's fodder for another thread.

When people ask "Which is better?" there is always an unspoken element of "Which gun does everyone think is superior, which will reflect on me as being the better smarter guy?" Well, depends. Some don't actually want the better technologically superior piece, they give bonus points to tradition, or thumbing their collective noses at certain groups associated with a guns use. In that, nobody can give which is better.

Focusing on the gun along, it's the AR hands down- which is why more nations are adopting them while those with AK's are looking around to give them away. Only in America do free citizens see the AK as something good - everywhere else in the world, not so much. It's either the symbol of an existing oppressive government, or a symbol of the one that's to come. At least the AR already established itself as the symbol of America, for what it's worth. And it seems from the number of people trying to get here that it's not so bad after all.

Hey, they could own one themselves. Or an AK. It's a free country. Buy what you want, your reasons are good enough for you.

For further commentary reaching back before the internet was started up:http://www.bing.com/search?PC=WCUG&FORM=WCUGDF&q=AR+vs+AK&conversationid=
 

bfoosh006

New member
AR15... hands down.

Right now they are a dang good deal.... you can turn them into EXACTLY the rifle you want.

Buy now prior to the next big "gun scare"....( and the election )
 

dakota.potts

New member
If you're looking for an AK-like rifle, I'm always quick to recommend the VZ 58. It's lighter and more accurate, has a milled receiver, bolt holds open on the last shot etc. but optics mounting sucks.

Really, though, the AR15 is probably your best bet for your first rifle. I shoot my VZ 58 a lot more than my AR 15 now, and it's probably the first rifle I would grab if something serious happened, but the AR15 is very forgiving for a first time shooter and anybody can be taught to shoot one quickly. AKs tend to be heavy, less accurate for target shooting, etc.

Not that there's anything wrong with any of them. Depending on your price range, you may find even more options than just AR or AK
 
Top