Best Cartridge for New England White Tail

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Brian Pfleuger

Moderator Emeritus
Daryl said:
In my state (Arizona) and some others I've hunted, they can cite you if you waste ANY edible portion of a game animal. I've seen it happen in Colorado to some fellas who'd cleaned up their deer pretty well. The warden salvaged a small ziplock baggie of meat, and cited them for it.

I can't imagine throwing away the front shoulders. I like venison too much for that, and the meat is precious little as it is.

Daryl
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If the law is really that vague, it's insane. What is "edible"? Certainly the heart, liver and tongue would qualify. There is muscle structure all over an animal.... head/face, lower legs.... People eat pigs feet. Are deer feet "edible"? Some people eat brains. Is a brain considered "edible"?

Insanity.
 
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ZeroJunk

New member
I don't see anything in state law here that addresses how much of the animal you have to keep if any. I know people who love neck roasts, ribs, pretty much keep everything.

I really need to kill more deer than I want. They are a nuisance. A farner friend of mine and his son killed forty some a couple of years ago, and they aren't even hunters per se, they are farmers.

I do feel obligated to keep most of the meat, but not parts that I am not fond of.

My original point was that if I blow a shoulder it is not a deal to decide what cartridge I am going to hunt with. That whole argument is overblown IMO.
 
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Daryl

New member
If the law is really that vague, it's insane. What is "edible"? Certainly the heart, liver and tongue would qualify. There is muscle structure all over an animal.... head/face, lower legs.... People eat pigs feet. Are deer feet "edible"? Some people eat brains. Is a brain considered "edible"?

Insanity
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There's nothing vaque about "any edible portion". Arguable, perhaps, but nothing vague.

And yes, that's what it says.

Insane? Hardly. It helps prevent folks from wasting a natural resource, and I see that as a win-win situation. If I were ever cited for wasting game over a tongue, I'd take it to court. That "arguable" thing would very likely prevail.

That law is one reason I take my animals out as whole as possible; field dress, quarter if necessary, and pack 'em out. I enjoy the meat from what I hunt, so the law isn't a burden to me.

Daryl
 
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Brian Pfleuger

Moderator Emeritus
"ANY edible portion" is EXTREMELY vague and WIDELY open to interpretation.

Fat is edible and you'd better scrape those ribs clean. I don't think you can even argue against heart, liver and tongue. Those things are WIDELY considered edible.

If someone was truly cited for a "small baggie of meat" then ANYONE could be cited, any time, every time. Neck muscle goes all the way up to and attaches to the skull. Better get it all off.
 
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ZeroJunk

New member
I've eaten sauteed deer heart, fried elk heart, and fried elk mountain oysters. It's all good.

Might have to pay court cost, but a judge would kick that baggie thing out if you wanted to pursue it for the simple reason that a law is unconstitional if it is ambiguous. Dpends on how far you want to push.
 
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Shotgun693

New member
I've killed a bunch of deer with .45-70 and .45 Colt, rifle and revolver. The deer die quickly and there's very little bloodshot meat. Use a flat ended lead bullet, it's all you need. BTW, every deer I took with the above rounds was 30 yards or less.
 
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Hog Buster

New member
“I've never seen a deer here in New York more than fifty yards and most I've take between 25 and 40 yards. Last year was my closest shot at about 10 yards. Now the .270 drops them in their tracks but sure makes a mess. I usually loose the better part of a front shoulder to blood shot.”

Say what?..... Good Lord Man, shoot ‘em in the head at those distances....... No wasted meat.
 
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treg

New member
I've had excellent results with Remingtons Managed Recoil loads under the conditions you describe.

My hunting territory sounds a lot like yours and I had the same issues with my .30-06. Didn't like the meat damage after years of shooting them with .44 mag pistols. The MR loads from Remington are well balanced between velocity and bullet design making them very effective on deer without the overkill of standard loads at short to medium range. They perform as advertised, just what the doctor ordered.

Here's a link - http://www.remington.com/products/ammunition/centerfire/managed-recoil/managed-recoil.aspx

and another http://www.chuckhawks.com/rem_managed_recoil.htm
 
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Todd1700

New member
At those very close ranges and with excessive meat damage being your listed concern then you are making a case for one of the old big and slow calibers like a 44 mag, 45 Colt, 35 Rem, 444 or even 45/70 if you don't mind recoil. You can get them in short easy to carry lever actions that would be fine for the distances you are shooting from. At those distances you could shoot irons sights or just put a straight 4 power scope on it. Old timers call those big slow cartridges "eat right up to the hole" guns. LOL!
 
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hooligan1

New member
Well here's my three cents worth of deer killin knowledge.

First of all, contrary to what anybody says, the .270 win is NOT overkill....;)

Second of all proper shot placement reduces meat loss.....;)

Thirdly and lastly, Try another type of bullet in your rifle for pure penetration and pass-through, not explosiveness......;)(like peetza said)
 
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Daryl

New member
Well here's my three cents worth of deer killin knowledge.

First of all, contrary to what anybody says, the .270 win is NOT overkill....

Second of all proper shot placement reduces meat loss.....

Thirdly and lastly, Try another type of bullet in your rifle for pure penetration and pass-through, not explosivenous......(like peetza said)
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And what I said, before peetza said it; but what's the fun in that if the OP wants an excuse for a new rifle-gun to hunt deer with (hey, I've used worse'n that!).

Old timers call those big slow cartridges "eat right up to the hole" guns. LOL!
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And usiing hardcast bullets you can do just that. With the big bores, there's no need for expansion or excessive velocity. They're juust long range punch-presses that leave a half inch hole coming and going.
 
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hooligan1

New member
Daryl his reason wasn't creative enough!!!:D:p;)


"Cause I can" is what I prefer to use as an excuse to add to my collection!!:cool:
 
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Rich Mc

New member
Use a less reactive bullet. The Barnes bullets should drop all their expansion and then just the base flies thru the out shoulder.

I was raised in New England with a 30-06 - also taught to take out a shoulder - no tracking even on the big boys.

I've dropped to a .243 and .357 magnum rifle, depending on range. All 3 will jelly up some meat but if it is just a shoulder, you don't lose much.
 
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Cascade1911

New member
Lots of good stuff. After reading all the posts and doing a bit of thinking here's what I think:

1) What the heck, so what if I blood shot a shoulder, the sucker dropped in it's tracks and if a longer range shot does arise.......

2) I like the idea of the Barnes bullets.

3) I never need an excuse to buy a rifle, just a direction.

4) A 45/70 lever gun would sure be sweet.

Thanks all.
 
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jimbob86

Moderator
Now the .270 drops them in their tracks but sure makes a mess.
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Placement is everything. Don't shoot the meat.

It is fine if all it makes a mess of is the lungs and heart. It may not drop to the shot, but it won't go very far...... 30-40 yards. I had one go almost 200 yards once, but it was 460 yards from the muzzle when I shot it...... and the bullet went through both lungs.....
 
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