Bears? How 'bout freakin' coyotes?!

[Buzzcook]

I doubt that many state restricts the harvest of coyote.
So calling them coy-dogs won't do anything to make it easier to shoot them.

It will take a serious effort of trapping and poisoning to remove coyote from urban and suburban areas. The problem is that coyote breed like rabbits when the population gets stressed. A bigger problem is that we are feeding the coyote. There is a reason that they have moved into proximity with humans and that's because they have food sources. That's not just puppies and kitties and little children.

 

[Beentown71]

I have had a huge growth of the coyote populations in our Central Ohio farm lands. I killed 13 off one property (230 acres out of 4600) last year. I gave myself a big pat on the back...well this year I had my trail cam up for one week and had 230 pictures of yotes. I could tell the difference in at least 11 different individuals. This is just on one parcel.

I started hunting them proactively last year after they would follow me out of the stand after bowhunting. They are getting very brave/curious. In every instance of first hand observation they have always had at least one hunting "partner". They are fun too hunt.

This pic is 75 yards from the house. Could here them howl that night!

Beentown

 

[roy reali]

Personality

One book I read on wolf behavior suggests that different wolf packs have very different personalities. Even the alpha's display different behaviors. Even the levels of aggression seemed different between packs. I guess certain wolf packs might just get along with coyotes more then other.

That video clip I linked above was from a whole show about wolves. That very same pack has an alpha female that they named the coyote assassin, she didn't tolerate any anywhere near the pack. She would bee-line straight at any coyote that she sensed. Wolves being the pack animals they are would follow her and help in the kill.

I find wolves to be fascinating creatures. I have no such interest in coyotes.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

The problem is that coyote breed like rabbits when the population gets stressed.

Actually, no they don't. You may have confused litter size with breeding rates.

It is unusual for a coyote pair to have more than one litter per year and pups won't reach sexual maturity for 6-9 months. The litter is dropped in the spring after two months of pregnancy and the litter kept through the fall before it disperses. The litter size may vary widely, but not the breeding rate. While the litter size may vary, I can't find anything to suggest more pups are born when the population is particularly stressed. Instead, it would appear that population density affects litter size. Low population density (which does not necessarily mean stress) correlates with larger litter sizes and vice versa. Typical litters are about 2-6 pups with up to 19 being documented. Pups require parental nurturing for survival during the first 6+ months of their lives.

Rabbits such as cottontails, however, have a gestation time of just 28-31 days and typically can breed anytime during all but the coldest of months. Typically, they have 3-4 litters per year (maximum of 8 documented) and offspring can be sexually mature within 3-6 months and leave their mother within 2-3 month. Litter sizes are from 1-12 with 3-5 being typical.

Jackrabbits have a longer gestation of about 45 days, but still have about 4 litters per year of comparable size. Extra time in the womb means jackrabbit kits are precocious and strike out on their own soon after birth.

Simply put, coyotes really can't reproduce like rabbits.

 

[2DaMtns]

Pregnancy itself places enormous stress on an animal, and in most species, extreme stress will drop the reproductive rate/litter size. From a survival standpoint, reproduction is a luxury (I'm sure everyone has an off-color joke for that one), and it is often one of the first things to be sacrificed if an animal meets extreme conditions, as the cycles themselves take a toll on the body, let alone the actual support of a fetus from conception to weaning.

 

[Deerhunter]

PK

The studies I have read say that the coyotes moved up and cross breed with wolves from Canada. I haven't read anything that says there are no wolves in NY so that may very well be the case. Seems though from what I have read that wolves and coyotes have been breeding where there are limited numbers of wolves. Out West the coyotes are much smaller. The one my buddy shot in PA a couple years ago was a male that wieghed about 65 pounds and they think he was only about 2 years old.

We hunt in PA outside of Valley Forge (for some reson they won't let us in there to hunt, even with a bow) and we are starting to get more coyotes around. I haven't seen one yet but I have heard them. A few people that hunt a farm near where we hunt have seen them.

I think my Sig 229 in 40 will do just fine if I come face to face with one though.

 

[Buzzcook]

Double Naught Spy: You're right that I misused the term breeding. It was hyperbole.

While I can't find the original article that used the term "stressed" to define the effects of population reduction. This article just uses the term reduction.

http://www.coyoterescue.org/bob_crabtree.html

The with population reduction there are larger litter sizes and non-alpha females that were formerly "behaviorally sterile" become breeders.

(5) Reductions cause an increase in the percentage of females breeding. Coyote populations are distinctly structured in non-overlapping but contiguous territorial packs. Over 95% of the time only one female (the dominant, or “alpha”) breeds. Other females, physiologically capable of breeding, are “behaviorally sterile”.

Admittedly I just quote mined the article to support something I read many years ago. There may be information out there stating the opposite of my opinion, which is that reducing urban populations of coyote in a haphazard manner might have the opposite effect intended.

 

[The Canuck]

Around here the Hutterites have a CDN$65.00 bounty on winter pelts...

 

[zukiphile]

Bears, mountain lions, wolves, coyotes, feral dogs, groundhogs, and rats are all easier to appreciate on the animal planet channel than actually living anywhere near me.

I can't imagine having a family in an area with enormous meat-eaters that might consider me, my wife or children a tasty treat. I would make it my job to eradicate them, and feel very frustrated if the government told me I shouldn't shoot a one ton monster with claws and big teeth because there were few examples left.

If we relocated bears to manhatten apartment buildings, would they still be a protected species?

 

[GLK]

roy really wrote;

I find wolves to be fascinating creatures. I have no such interest in coyotes.

I used to feel the same way about many creatures including coyotes. They(coyotes)are an amazing animal. Once I saw an actual coyote running wild in NY C's Central Park I knew they were the ultimate survivor and the masters of adaption. Long after mankind has destroyed the planet and killed off our own species, coyotes and la cucaracha will be splitting up whatever is left. Seriously I have a very high level of respect for coyotes even though I do love putting a little lead pill through them. I look at them as evidence from God that varmint hunting is okay.

Zukiphile wrote;

Bears, mountain lions, wolves, coyotes, feral dogs, groundhogs, and rats are all easier to appreciate on the animal planet channel than actually living anywhere near me.

I can't imagine having a family in an area with enormous meat-eaters that might consider me, my wife or children a tasty treat. I would make it my job to eradicate them, and feel very frustrated if the government told me I shouldn't shoot a one ton monster with claws and big teeth because there were few examples left.
If we relocated bears to manhatten apartment buildings, would they still be a protected species?

Personally I am glad your not in charge. I like living in a world where there are apex predators scavengers varmints and vermin(no not the human kind). BTW no where in this country will you be in trouble for killing a animal that is a direct threat to you and or your family. As far as bears in Manhattan apartment buildings, why do that to the poor bears.

I feel the most alive and excited knowing that when I go into the swamps or dive the rock piles in the ENP I may encounter a 12 gator or a 400 LB bull shark. I want a chance encounter with bears and wolves rattlesnakes and such. I would not want to live in a totally safe sterile world where all my safety needs have been looked after.

 

[LightningJoe]

I've seen one with rocket-powered rollerscates. If he ever gets better organized, he'll be dangerous.

 

[gyvel]

For all of you who think that a human is the apex entity in the food chain, I got news for you: A virus can kill you very easily.

 

[stevelyn]

I doubt that many state restricts the harvest of coyote.

Funny you should mention that. Coyotes are considered an invasive species in Alaska, although I think a more fair and realistic description would be that they are expanding their range.

The ADF&G manages them as furbearers and sets hunting and trapping seasons for them. In most GMUs there are no limits, but once the season closes the only way you can kill them is a DLP shooting.

Personally I am glad your not in charge. I like living in a world where there are apex predators scavengers varmints and vermin(no not the human kind). BTW no where in this country will you be in trouble for killing a animal that is a direct threat to you and or your family.

I agree, although you can keep your snakes toothy fish and giant lizards down there. I like the idea of sleeping outside on the ground and not having to worry about Jake No-Shoulders wanting to share my sleeping bag with me.

 

[Bud Helms]

Thread Veer Alert!

For all of you who think that a human is the apex entity in the food chain, I got news for you: A virus can kill you very easily.

If your species holds a position in the food chain, then your species targets certain other positions in the chain as food. Some species target more than one other food chain position as food. A species' position in the food chain is not a static position, as in a hierarchy diagram.

Viruses use the food chain to find their hosts. Viruses exist at every level of the food chain and as far as we know, can enter the chain at any point. Some viruses do not threaten the food supply. Some viruses insure the health of a food supply.

The point is, to assign a dominance in the food chain to a virus, or to viruses as a life form, is misrepresentation of the role of viruses and the food chain.

It's a fine one-liner, but ignores the structure of the food chain and how it works. May as well say, "For all of you who think that a human is the apex entity in the food chain, I got news for you: a strong enough magnetic field could strip electrons from orbit in the molecules in your body and then your total body chemistry would be changed."

This is about bear vs coyote as a threat to humans, not all threats to humans.

Back to the topic ... Bears? How 'bout freakin' coyotes?!

 

[Tom2]

Gee Bud, maybe I should not have started this thread. I hate long long threads. I guess it shows that the wide expansion of these wild doggies is annoying alot of people. Especially since now they are in areas that do not promote controlling them very well. Or allow the (click-clack) means of doing so. Maybe some high ranking US official in a nice neighborhood will have his mini poodle devoured and awareness will increase.

 

[Bud Helms]

Well, it's not firearms related in the strictest sense, but there's no harm in it.

Just to contribute, I came to Georgia from NW FL in 1987. Three or four years prior to that move, I noticed an upsurge in coyote sightings in the NW Florida woods. After I came to GA, I was traveling beck to FL twice a month to satisfy an AF Reserve commitment back in FL.

On that drive down to FL from middle GA, I started to notice coyote on the shoulder and in the median of I-75, on GA two lanes and especially around the Chattahoochee River crossing as you passed from GA to FL (GA Hwy 91 to FL Hwy 2) and then all the way to my destination in FL (Niceville). There were times I counted maybe 40-45 on that trip. No telling how many I didn't see because it was dark and my headlights didn't illuminate them.

Once in FL, I saw a small herd of Whitetail along side Hwy 285, north of Eglin AFB Reservation. As I followed a sharp turn in the road, I spotted 3 or 4 coyote low-running the opposite direction, making a beeline for the deer I had just shined.

I sure would have liked to watch that action.

'Course the only bear I am aware of here in GA and down in FL is the American Black Bear. They are easily avoided as they seem to be shy and recluse by nature. 'Don't know that they have ever been a problem. But they are omnivores, not strictly vegetarians as some believe. I wouldn't try to strike up a petting session with an American Black in the wild. And I have given up my deer stand in an area where I spotted a momma with a cub.

 

[Parapliers]

A farmer close to Richmond, Indiana shot a tagged wolf a couple of years ago that had migrated down from Wisconsin. Had to negotiate a lot of trains and highways and civilization to get that far. It was hard for me the last time I traveled that way. I say if he's that much of a man then leave him alone.

 

[grey sky]

"That much of a man" LOL Like Rory Calhoon?
I have seen them all around town here Coyotes that is. Haven't seen any that appeared threatening though.