Any New DA/SA?

[Cosmodragoon]

corneileous,

Like I say, the height and goofy "grip zone" aren't deal breakers for me. The relative height complaints might seem academic but for some people with certain body types, it might be limiting for IWB. One thing I think Walther got right with its PPS was the graduated grip lengths. It initially came with three different magazine lengths and the grip extensions were really well done. I think it was 4.4" at the shortest and around 5" at the tallest. I can't help but feel that Springfield missed the boat with their choice of 5" and 5.25".

The safety issue is a bit different. The concern comes from seeing real-life defensive encounters where a manual safety caused problems. It wasn't just people forgetting about it in the heat of the moment. It is also a matter of missing or fumbling with the safety, whether due to adrenaline, greasy hands, a compromised position, or whatever else. I know it can be left in the off position but have you ever seen a safety accidentally engaged? This is something that could happen. Long odds or not, you never know in a scramble. Just like internal lock-outs, I feel that manual safeties are unnecessary and potentially dangerous on a defensive firearm.

 

[corneileous]

corneileous,

Like I say, the height and goofy "grip zone" aren't deal breakers for me.

Oh I know, I figured that much but, when I told you that, I was more less telling those who do, to just slap on a talon grip and call it a day.

The relative height complaints might seem academic but for some people with certain body types, it might be limiting for IWB. One thing I think Walther got right with its PPS was the graduated grip lengths. It initially came with three different magazine lengths and the grip extensions were really well done. I think it was 4.4" at the shortest and around 5" at the tallest. I can't help but feel that Springfield missed the boat with their choice of 5" and 5.25".

And that’s perfectly fine, and some ways I agree but, it’s still not an issue... for me...

The safety issue is a bit different. The concern comes from seeing real-life defensive encounters where a manual safety caused problems. It wasn't just people forgetting about it in the heat of the moment. It is also a matter of missing or fumbling with the safety, whether due to adrenaline, greasy hands, a compromised position, or whatever else. I know it can be left in the off position but have you ever seen a safety accidentally engaged? This is something that could happen. Long odds or not, you never know in a scramble. Just like internal lock-outs, I feel that manual safeties are unnecessary and potentially dangerous on a defensive firearm.

I hear ya, and there is always a potential for accidentally engaging a safety but at least the safety lever in my opinion on the XDE is very very low profile enough meaning that you’d have to try pretty hard to accidentally engage it, unlike the big gawky batwing levers that used to be on my Storms.

I feel the same way about manual safeties as you do but it’s just too bad that we can’t convert it to decocker only like I did my storms. But I’m ok with my XDE having a safety lever. I mean, I’d prefer it not to but since it’s the closest I could find to what I was looking for, I kinda had to make do with it. I’ve been carrying it since November and I can respectfully say that I have yet to accidentally flip the safety on, and it primarily gets carried in my pocket.

Manual safeties are your least favorite it sounds like so it’s only fitting that there are other options out there that’s better suited for you. Me, I don’t do striker fired guns and actually prefer hammer fired guns so what I consider a deal breaker, is not the same as you.

Now if beretta would have made a single stack compact Storm that was convertible to a type G, I would have been all over that like a rat on a Cheeto....lol.

***EDITED TO ADD***

But know, something else I just thought of, if that manual safety was really the only thing that was holding me back on this gun, I really don’t think it would be too terribly difficult to take a Dremel tool and whittle down a little on the safety levers to make them even more low profile and a lot less-likely to inadvertently engage the safety. If I hadn’t of been that interested in converting my storms to type G decocker only, I could have just as easily left them as they were and ground the type F levers they came with down quite a bit and made them a whole lot more low profile and less likely to engage the safety on them as well and pretty much accomplished the same thing without spending 50 bucks a piece in parts for each gun. Just a little bit of precise grinding and shaping in target areas, then a little bit of bluing treatment and, viola.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Cosmodragoon]

... unlike the big gawky batwing levers that used to be on my Storms.

I feel the same way about manual safeties as you do but it’s just too bad that we can’t convert it to decocker only like I did my storms...

... Now if beretta would have made a single stack compact Storm that was convertible to a type G, I would have been all over that like a rat on a Cheeto....lol.

I hate the batwing safeties on the Storm but Beretta did something wonderful in making it convertible. Beretta's aftermarket support for the Storm has been great too. Switching to low-profile levers with "decocker only" makes the Storm an ideal full-sized carry gun. The "Compact Carry" model comes that way and with a few other enhancements. It's still a little big compared to the modern micro nines.

Beretta makes a subcompact Storm but it's a different animal. I really wish they'd release a little single-stack version of the Storm but I don't know the geometry required for the rotating barrel system. By that same token, I wish Sig would have made a polymer analog to their P239 or a DA/SA friend for the P365. Ever since the PPS came out, I've wished that they would have made a single stack version of the P99.... Any other pipe dreams come to mind?

 

[corneileous]

I hate the batwing safeties on the Storm but Beretta did something wonderful in making it convertible. Beretta's aftermarket support for the Storm has been great too. Switching to low-profile levers with "decocker only" makes the Storm an ideal full-sized carry gun. The "Compact Carry" model comes that way and with a few other enhancements. It's still a little big compared to the modern micro nines.

Beretta makes a subcompact Storm but it's a different animal. I really wish they'd release a little single-stack version of the Storm but I don't know the geometry required for the rotating barrel system. By that same token, I wish Sig would have made a polymer analog to their P239 or a DA/SA friend for the P365. Ever since the PPS came out, I've wished that they would have made a single stack version of the P99.... Any other pipe dreams come to mind?

Actually, they probably could with the sub-PX4 because it’s the only model in the lineup that doesn’t have that rotating barrel technology. But, since the majority of the market wants them damn striker guns, it seems to me they put their single-stack effort into the Nano, and the APX Compact, unfortunately.

Sig had a bunch of Da/Sa models to chose from at one point but they discontinued them so it’s really no surprise that they didn’t make a Da/Sa polymer counterpart to the 365.

But no, that about wraps it up for a wish list....lol.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[JJ45]

As I said I have the 3.8 and really like it. Only 300 rounds so far of various ammo but I've only had it a month. No malfunctions of any kind.

The 3.8 has NO "Grip Zone"

I think it would be nicer w/o a thumb safety but then you would probably get Springfield's ubiquitous grip safety I find neither of these safeties an actual problem or hindrance in the least though. You might have an accident of some kind with the thumb safety but you might also have an AD by an inadvertent trigger nudge with a striker without a safety.

The XD-E;
Double or Single action carry
Cocked and locked option
Can rack slide with the safety on
Can manually cock the pistol with the safety on
Can de-cock the pistol safely
It is a relatively "thin" pistol and I haven't found the "tallness" to be a problem and I've been carrying this weapon daily in and outside the waist band sine I got it. I am of medium build.

I don't think there are semi-auto pistols that are more reliable than Springfield's polymer framed strikers or the XD-E. There are certainly pistols that are just as reliable and have different features that some will prefer. That's why the make all kinds of guns.

 

[Cosmodragoon]

It isn't just that the PX4 is easily converted to decocker only. It's that the conversion is part of a routine change/upgrade using factory parts. That's a beautiful thing.

With some guns, I'd be tempted to "delete" the manual safety, internal lock, etc. However, some people have raised valid concerns about what an unscrupulous or politically motivated prosecutor could do with that. You don't want to follow up a win on staying alive with a bankrupting assault on your freedom.

 

[corneileous]

It isn't just that the PX4 is easily converted to decocker only. It's that the conversion is part of a routine change/upgrade using factory parts. That's a beautiful thing.

Exactly. At first I thought about just doing the simple conversion where all you do is remove the steel ball and sprung that holds the F levers down in the safety on position but it didn’t take long to where I talked myself outta that because to me, that was too much of an actual modification to where replacing the F levers with the low profile G levers was using factory parts and unless somebody ran the serial number to data from the manufacturer, they’d never know that gun didn’t come that way because it was still in factory form if it would’ve been bought that way.

With some guns, I'd be tempted to "delete" the manual safety, internal lock, etc. However, some people have raised valid concerns about what an unscrupulous or politically motivated prosecutor could do with that. You don't want to follow up a win on staying alive with a bankrupting assault on your freedom.

That’s true because like I said above about doing the type G conversion on a PX4 Storm the other way, that’s considered a “modification” from factory design and could come back to nip you in the butt.

But as I said, the safety/decocker levers on my XDE don’t concern me at all. I have no reason to believe at all that they’ll ever get flipped on by accident.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[jr24]

But as I said, the safety/decocker levers on my XDE don’t concern me at all. I have no reason to believe at all that they’ll ever get flipped on by accident.

Different strokes, but I could never live with that possibility. My philosophy is to always train for the safety as part of my firing grip so the possibility of it not being disengaged is as reduced as possible.

I'm just too quasi-OCD paranoid to do it any other way.

The XD-E is kinda interesting but I found it pretty big and heavy for it's capacity, and would prefer a used Sig 239 (better trigger) or CZ RAMI.

But that's just my preference, it seems like a well made gun.