A New American Made Single Action

claydoctor

New member
Connecticut Shotgun Manufacturing is about to make available a new Colt SAA replica. I saw one this past January at the Vegas Antique Arms Show and was impressed. By chance, I sent them an e-mail the other day inquiring about its status and was referred to the website
www.stdgun.com . Looks like within a month or so, they will have both the single action and a new 1911 ready for sale. An unconfirmed rumor is that they will be made on former USFA
machinery .
 

Model12Win

Moderator
If they're anything like the old USFA guns, count me in.

The Italian boys do a good work on making SAA replicas, but it would be damn nice to have some Yanks back in the biz.
 
Howdy

I said this when they were shown at the shotshow. They better remove the name SAA from their advertising. Single Action Army is a registered trademark belonging to Colt. By extension, so is SAA. Colt will sue the pants off of them if they continue to infringe on Colt's trademark.
 

ShootistPRS

New member
I think that SSA is a commonly used abbreviation so Colt doesn't have any claim on it trademark wise. Think Social Security Administration, Self Storage Association, Soaring Society of America and a host of others. As for The single action army it was a military classification and never a trade mark. There are a number of firearms manufactured with the type being Single action army. Uberty, Eaa, Genitron, Cimarron Arms and others. The type single action army is much like the type 1911 or the type AR15 as they designate a type of gun.
 
I think that SSA is a commonly used abbreviation so Colt doesn't have any claim on it trademark wise. Think Social Security Administration, Self Storage Association, Soaring Society of America and a host of others. As for The single action army it was a military classification and never a trade mark. There are a number of firearms manufactured with the type being Single action army. Uberty, Eaa, Genitron, Cimarron Arms and others. The type single action army is much like the type 1911 or the type AR15 as they designate a type of gun.

Well, first off, it's SAA, which stands for Single Action Army, not SSA.

Secondly, you are wrong. Single Action Army is a registered trademark of the Colt company.

See it for yourself at the Colt website. That R inside a circle is the symbol for a Registered Trademark. You may also notice the R in the circle by Colt's logo, which is also trademarked.

http://www.colt.com/Catalog/Revolvers/Single-Action-Army



Here is a definition.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trademark

A trademark is typically a name, word, phrase, logo, symbol, design, image, or a combination of these elements. There is also a range of non-conventional trademarks comprising marks which do not fall into these standard categories, such as those based on color, smell, or sound (like jingles). Trademarks which are considered offensive are often rejected according to a nation's trademark law.

As for being commonly used, that is the whole point of trademark law. When other companies use trademarked names and designs, it is up to the trademark holder to defend their trademark. If they do not defend their trademark, the courts will rule that the trademark no longer exists. Unlike patents, which expire after a certain amount of time, trademarks last forever as long as the trademark holder maintains it. Maintaining a trademark includes taking legal action against trademark infringements.

Probably the most famous trademark in the world is the Coca Cola logo. Next time you open a Coke, take a look and you will see the little trademark symbol.

Firearm types such as the 1911 or the AR15 have nothing to do with trademarks. They are simply military designations. The military designation of the SAA in 1873 was Colt Army Revolver, Caliber .45.

At some point Colt obtained a Trademark on the name Single Action Army, and they have been maintaining their trademark ever since. Uberti, and Peitta, NEVER advertise their products as Single Action Army, or SAA, because they know Colt will sue the pants off of them. Colt successfully sued American Western Arms a number of years ago for trademark infringement.

Patents are one thing. They expire. The patents on the SAA expired long ago, so anybody can make a revolver that looks like a SAA. The copies can even have internal parts that function exactly like the originals, because the patents expired long ago. But they cannot use the name Single Action Army or SAA because those names are trademarked.

You will never see this stamped on the barrel of any firearm unless it was made by Colt.

ColtBarrelLegend.jpg



I am pretty sure Colt has trademarked the Rampant Pony too. You will not see it on any products other than those made by Colt.

ColtVerifiedProof.jpg
 

ShootistPRS

New member
The Colt trademark includes the entire phrase "Colt Single Action Army" not the phrase "Single Action Army" and certainly not the letters "SAA".

You can buy a single action army revolver from a lot of different makers just as you can buy 1911s and AR15s from a number of different makers.
 
As I said earlier, Single Action Army is a trademark held by Colt. Not Colt Single Action Army. Single Action Army.

https://trademarks.justia.com/764/38/single-action-76438593.html


Anyone who markets a revolver under the name Single Action Army is opening themselves up to a lawsuit.

As I said earlier, there is no trademark on 1911, it was simply a model designation given to the pistol by the Army. It is not a trademark. The patents on the 1911 expired long ago, so anybody can make a 1911.

And while we're at it, AR-15 is also a trademark owned by Colt.

https://trademarks.justia.com/722/53/ar-72253092.html

However the trademark specifically includes the hyphen between AR and 15. The patents on the AR15 expired long ago, so anybody can make one. But they cannot call it AR-15. If they do, they are opening themselves up to a lawsuit.

https://www.quora.com/Who-owns-the-rights-to-the-AR-15-rifle-design
 
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Ozzieman

New member
1500 for a NON COLT
I will stick with all my Rugers for less than half that.
Glade to see an American manufacture building them but if they really want to make a splash keep them well under 1000
 
Driftwood Johnson said:
I am pretty sure Colt has trademarked the Rampant Pony too. You will not see it on any products other than those made by Colt.

And a bazillion or so 1911 magazines made somewhere in China ...

It's also worth noting that "Single Action Army" was not a military designation. The SAA revolver was adopted as the "New Model Army Metallic Cartridge Revolving Pistol," Model of 1873.
 
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Bob Wright

New member
I've seen many Colt copies, made in Belgium around the First World War era that danced all around the Colt trademarks without actually duplicating them.

Terms like "Frontier Ranger" or "Cowboy Six Shooter" appear on the barrels, and the hard rubber grips have a buffalo in the cartouche.

A gun I bought as a kid was actually a double action, about the size of the Lightning DA model, but with a grip patterned after the Single Action. The legend on the barrel proclaimed "Cowboy Ranger" and was chambered for .38 Long Colt, .38 S&W, and .38 Special. (Yes, it did chamber .38 S & W cartridges.) I gave something like $10 for that gun and sold it as a wall hanger for $50.

Bob Wright
 
It was difficult to enforce US patent and copyright laws in Europe. Smith and Wesson revolvers were copied all the time in Europe.

This is a cheap Belgian copy of the S&W New Model #3.

belgiancopy_zps332b28a9.jpg








This is a cheap Turkish knock off of the S&W Russian model, right down to the spur on the trigger guard and the big hump on the grip.

turkish%20copy_zpsbfl9bre5.jpg



Some of the counterfeit Smiths were so brazen they stamped Smith & Wesson right on them.

Daniel Wesson did succeed in forcing one Belgian counterfeiter to stop making copies, but that was just about the only success he had with European knock offs.


Later, Spanish copies of S&W revolvers flooded the US market.

orbea%20hermanos-01_zpsicfnwipw.jpg





S&W went so far as to trademark their color case hardened hammers and triggers, in an attempt to prevent cheap Spanish copies from being imported.

MPRoundButtHammer-1.jpg




This strategy worked for a while, but eventually the courts threw it out.
 

mhblaw

New member
I have several USFA single actions. None cost $1595. I suspect there is a pretty small market for this item at that price.
 

jackmoser65

New member
You guys need to keep up. Colt is a long way from keeping up with demand and the current SAA starts at 1500. They're three years behind in shipping them. There is definitely a market for these guns, even if they don't have "Colt" stamped on them because if they are anything like USFA, they will be better than a damned Colt and not take three years to get. Plus people are now paying 2.5k to 3k for USFA guns that used to be 750-1200.

ShootistPRS, I don't know where your information comes from but it's wrong. "Single Action Army" and its "SAA" abbreviation are wholly owned by Colt and they will sue anybody that uses it. Period. End of discussion. Driftwood is right, as usual.
 

DPris

Member Emeritus
DJ is dead on here.
You put either Single Action Army or SAA on a clone & you can expect contact from Colt attorneys.

Back when Colt was very aggressively going after anything even close to its trademarking (remember AWA?) I was proofing articles for one mag editor.

One writer who'd certainly been around long enough to know better (won't mention his name or confirm his possible WC initials) had written up a piece on one of Cimarron's latest repros & was saying "For convenience sake, I'll just refer to it as an SAA for the rest of this article", and he did.

I edited that out in the proof corrections, omitted all additional "SAA" mention, and advised the editor to be damn sure those changes were included prior to publication, or there'd be a guaranteed legal response from Colt.
All references to "SAA" were duly made to vanish in the final printed article.

And if you think Colt is anything but serious about such things, I have an inch-thick transcript copy of the court hearings in Colt vs AWA.
That suit was one of the things that contributed to AWA's then-ownership leaving the biz & selling the dregs of the company to the "gunsmith" who'd worked for them for several years.
Denis
 

Model12Win

Moderator
they will be better than a damned Colt

Nothing could be better than a true Colt's SAA. If it doesn't wear the pony, it's not a true Colt's and the quality and collector's value will never be the same.
 

FrankenMauser

New member
Instead of talking about whether or not it might be a good revolver, let's just continue arguing about trademarks and a litigious company, and how only the NAME matters ....


Quality? What's that? I only care that it says COLT'S!

:rolleyes:
 

jackmoser65

New member
Nothing could be better than a true Colt's SAA. If it doesn't wear the pony, it's not a true Colt's and the quality and collector's value will never be the same.
They could stamp "COLT" on a Heritage Rough Rider and some people would still guffaw with this nonsense. :rolleyes:

Others need a little more than just a name. :cool:

Here's a shocking newsflash, people are presently paying more for USFA's than they are Colt's. Which kinda shoots down the "collector value" drivel. :cool:
 
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