6mm Creedmoor or .243 Win

[taylorce1]

I really don't want to start a Creedmoor (Manbun) thread, but I'm wanting a fast twist 6mm, for deer pronghorn, and coyotes. I'm thinking either in a 20" threaded for my suppressor barrel, would make a nice lightish rifle. I have a lot of components for the .243 since I've had one for nearly 30 years, but dies aren't expensive for the 6 CM and all I'd need with them is brass. I have some parts on hand, so I listed the options that make the most sense to me in the order I'm leaning.

Option 1 buy 6mm Creedmoor Howa semi-heavy contour barreled action from Brownells. Cut barrel back to 20", then bed in Bansner Alpine stock I have.

Option 2 buy M700 ADL Walmart special, take it to a gunsmith with the #3 1:7 twist barrel I have installed cut to 20" with basic blueprint and chambered in .243 Win. Then bed in B&C 2950 Mountain TI stock that I have on hand, and install a new trigger.

Option 3 send barrel I have back to manufacturer and have them make it a 20" .243 Win Rem-age barrel. Buy the same Walmart ADL rifle, skip the blueprint, replace trigger and bed in my stock.

 

[MarkCO]

If you already have .243 Win and can get, or have a fast twist 6mm barrel, stick with .243Win. No reason at all to switch calibers as long as you have the right twist rate.

 

[taylorce1]

The only .243 I own anymore is an old Parker Hale 1200 on a long action Mauser, I don't have a desire to change it to a fast twist. So I'll be buying an action either way, the Howa just seemed like less work.

 

[precision_shooter]

I agree to stay with .243. Factory ammo is more pletiful than 6mm creedmoor for if you need it. Since you handload, I don’t see much, if any, difference in performance between the two. You already have all you need to load .243...

 

[jmr40]

Since you hand load buy the Creedmoor. Even if you went 243 you're going to have to load completely different loads for the fast twist 243 than what you'd shoot in the older gun. Might as well have different cartridges.

 

[stagpanther]

I had McGowan custom make a 6mm creed barrel for an AR10 build--shoots great, but I'm guessing you want a bolt gun--I'd go at least 22" if so. Starline 6mm creed brass is very cheap--so forget about "exorbitant" costs.

 

[Tallest]

The 6mm CM is a far cry from the Manbun in my book. I would opt for that. Nothing against the lovely little .243, but I think the 6mm CM is a more direct route to what you want.

 

[44 AMP]

I don't see the point in semi-neutering a deer, pronghorn and coyote cartridge with a 20" barrel. Not that short barrel carbines aren't handy in the woods, but if you are in more open country, why throw away some of the possible velocity??

 

[std7mag]

I'd go with option 4...

Use Bansner stock with a Savage action (heck, your doing all kinds of work anyways, may as well inlet too...) and a 24" Proof Research barrel in 6mm Rem.

Thenat least, we wouldn't be calling you "Stubby"...

And you don't need a haircut!

 

[LineStretcher]

Everything you intend to use it for indicates it's a hunting rifle. Why shorten it up and why go with a bull barrel unless you plan on missing a lot and don't want a hot barrel.

The .243 is basically a 6mm and both the win and Creedmoor are based off the .308.

It sounds to me like you'll have around 1200.00 in the rifle when you get done if you go about it the way you're talking. Based on the deer and speed goat hunting desires I might suggest you go have a look at the range certified Weatherby Vanguard .257 Magnum. It's light, fast and a will drive tacks provided you can. Recoil is light but it's more than a .243 or a 6mm. More like a .308. I have the Mark V Deluxe version and it is an amazing cartridge.

Oh yeah, Yotes don't like it at all but I shoot them year round so I use a Tikka T3x Lite Stainless 22-250 for them.

 

[Jack O'Conner]

My hunting buddy and I head west for pronghorns every time we are drawn for non-resident tags. My rifle is a tack driving older Remington 760 but my buddy hunts with a Browning bolt action. These .243 rifles are super accurate with 95 grain SST bullets as loaded by Black Hills ammo.

I suggest spend your extra money on an out-of-state hunt instead of buying another rifle.

Jack

 

[jmr40]

I don't see the point in semi-neutering a deer, pronghorn and coyote cartridge with a 20" barrel.

Taylorce1 knows what he is doing. A 20" medium contour barrel makes a lot of sense. Plenty of velocity and the slightly heavier barrel helps with accuracy and balance. The other options are longer heavier barrels, which mean a poorly balanced rifle. Or a longer skinny Mt weight rifle barrel that will not be as accurate.

The whole point of using high BC bullets is that they don't need muzzle velocity to retain speeds down range. Even with a 20" barrel the better 108-115 gr high BC 6mm bullets from the 6CM will still be supersonic to almost 1600 yards. A 24" barrel would give about another 50 yards. Why worry about a few inches of barrel.

 

[taylorce1]

Had to pick my daughter up from livestock judging practice so I had most of this written before jmr40 responded with the practical side of things.

I don't see the point in semi-neutering a deer, pronghorn and coyote cartridge with a 20" barrel.

I'm adding a suppressor and I don't want 28-32" of barrel and can out there. At 20" my total length will still be around 26+" with a Silencer Co Omega attached. That's the reason I want to run higher BC bullets since they'll retain there speed better giving me down range energy.

Use Bansner stock with a Savage action (heck, your doing all kinds of work anyways, may as well inlet too...)

I'm done with Savage unless I can pick up one real cheap. It's now about the same price to buy a Rem 700 and Timney trigger as it is to get a Savage. Plus I have better options with the M700 footprint, so the price difference is a wash.

I might suggest you go have a look at the range certified Weatherby Vanguard .257 Magnum. It's light, fast and a will drive tacks provided you can. 

I have no issues with people who like magnum cartridges, they just aren't for me. I like economy cartridges and I haven't had one let me down yet as long as I do my part.

I suggest spend your extra money on an out-of-state hunt instead of buying another rifle.

Well I live in Colorado, there isn't much I have to travel out of state to hunt.

 

[Colorado Redneck]

I have considered rebarreling my 243 to 6mm CM. Both the 6mm Remington and 6mm CM send a 95 gr. projectile about 100fps faster than a 243 Winchester. If your building the rifle from scratch, do what you want. The 20" barrel will decrease velocity a bit, and the 100fps boost would maybe alleviate that. I like my 243, but its a 10 twist, so limited on bullet choices. If I do rebarrel it will be 6mm CM.

 

[Colorado Redneck]

Delete
Double post.

 

[Mobuck]

I don't see what you expect to gain.
1: 6mm C is nothing more than a fast twist 243
2: a 20" 243 is pretty much gelded so a 20" 6mmC will also be
3: trying to shoot heavier bullets from a shorter barrel is a losing endeavor

 

[stagpanther]

McGowen cut my barrel for my AR build to 23" using a 1:7 twist and rifle+2" gas port. So far, the best results I've had are with bullets in the 103 to 108 gr range.

 

[Don Fischer]

Well I'm a bit ignorant here. What is the need for a fast twist barrel in 24 cal rifle? I think a lot of people get fast twist barrels because they are cool when standard twist barrel's will do all they need! I have heard that the 100 gr bullet's might, might, be able to use a fast twist but I never found the need myself. Don't know of a lot of bullet's over 100 gr for 24 cal but do have a box of 105 gr Hornady's. Been sitting aloud here for 30 yrs, still brand new! Don't even know if they make them anymore. Seem's to me the other bullet's that might be out there over 100 grs are match bullet's! Maybe wrong abut that. Heaviest bulet's I use in my 243's anymore is 87gr.

 

[taylorce1]

I don't see what you expect to gain. 
1: 6mm C is nothing more than a fast twist 243
2: a 20" 243 is pretty much gelded so a 20" 6mmC will also be
3: trying to shoot heavier bullets from a shorter barrel is a losing endeavor

1. I know they are pretty much the same, that was never the question. The main question was is it worth going the factory Creedmoor route vs. a semi custom .243, to get a rifle capable of shooting the 103+ grain hunting bullets?

2. Is getting in the 3000 fps range with 105-107 grain bullets really gelded?

3. You're looking at this far differently than I am. I'm not approaching this as a long range rifle, I'm coming at it from the perspective of what I want to carry when I'm hunting. Which isn't a 24-26" barreled rifle with a 7" suppressor attached!

If I get 3000 fps with an 103 grain ELDX at 600 yards I'm -11 MOA elevation, 3.3 MOA wind, and still 1000 ft-lb energy, going 200 FPS faster with a longer barrel only gives me -9.4 MOA elevation, 3.0 MOA wind, and 1,164 ft-lbs energy at 600 yards. That might be enough difference for you to justify a longer barrel, to me it's not. I also don't see my hunting style changing which makes my list of kills on big game beyond 400 yards very, very small.

 

[stagpanther]

With my barrel I have surpassed 3000 fps with 110 gr bullets--but the really sweet spot is in the 105-107 gr +/- range. My attitude about fast twist is the opposite of most--as long as it doesn't adversely affect most bullets--why not have it--especially if you plan on pushing out the range eventually.