30 carbine: dead round?

[PATH]

I love my carbine. No I am not going be accurate at long distance but accurate enough at medium distance( less than 100 yards ). Never was a big fan of the Camp 9. The magazine setup was a bit squirrelly for me. The High Point 9mm was inexpensive but really did not do it for me.
When I am camping or hiking in the boonies I like my carbine as it is nice and light. Just my .02 cents.

 

[CaptainO]

Rightside:

It's the trigger group housing that's made of plastic. Brake cleaner, acetone and these solvents will melt these Marlin parts.

Does this clarify matters?

 

[CaptainO]

I don't care how long I have to wait to afford one, but a decent M1 Carbine will eventually be mine! With the proper ammunition, the .30 Carbine is effective as an anti personnel and medium game round, carrying the energy of a .357 S&W Magnum round at 100 yards.

Don't BS yourself, the .30 Carbine is a rifle cartridge whose power is perched midway between a pistol cartridge and a high-power rifle cartridge. All the BS about the .30 Carbine not having the power to kill out to 200 yards is just that... BS! At 100 yards a 110 grain soft-point can pass through a human body with relative ease. The expansion is sufficient to disrupt body tissues and blow holes in bones without as much as a second thought.

Anyone that tells you otherwise is either deluded, or lying through their teeth.

 

[kraigwy]

I don't see the 30-cal Carbine as a dead round.

The CMP Carbine Matches, plus the demand of the recent release of more Carbines from the CMP shows otherwise.

I don't shoot surplus carbine ammo, but if you don't reload, you can get 500 rounds, manufactured by Aguila. .30 carbine. 110 grain delivered to your door for about $.45 cents per round. That would be about $9 per box of twenty. That rivals the cheap 223 stuff out there.

I shot a lot of Aquila 30 Carbine ammo in matches with my USGI Underwood, I find it quite accurate.

 

[44 AMP]

If you want a .30 carbine, you should definitely get one! It is a neat gun & cartridge, with a noble history for the significant part it played in WWII & later. The .30 carbine works very well, within its limitations.

Unfortunately, a lot of people, including the military, have used the .30 carbine beyond its limitations (a lot), and so for that, the carbine has gotten a poor reputation.

When the M1 carbine was released for civilian sale, a lot of people got them. Nice light rifle, pretty cheap. I remember a lot of Adirondack deer hunters took the .30 carbine to the deer woods for a season or two. Then a lot of those carbines stayed in the closet or went up for sale the next season. Word got around that while the carbine worked, it wasn't really very good for deer.

The standard they were measuring the carbine by was, of course, the .30-30.
And in terms of down range performance, the carbine simply does not, and cannot match the .30-30. As a deer round!

The carbine will do a decent job of putting a hole in people even out to 200yds, at which distance it has the approximate energy of a standard (NOT +p) 9mm Luger round at the muzzle.

The .30 carbine does carry the muzzle energy of ONE .357 magnum loading at 100yds. IF the .357 load is fired from a handgun and the .30 carbine is fired from the carbine barrel.

If you fire the .357 from a carbine length barrel, it beats the .30 carbine handily at 100yds for velocity & energy.

The .30 carbine is a rifle cartridge, no question of that, but so to is the .22 Hornet a rifle cartridge.

The Carbine succeeded brilliantly in its intended role, that of a short, light, high capacity carbine for service troops, a weapon that the majority of people could easily learn to use effectively at ranges well beyond what they could do with a handgun. Powerful enough to stop enemy soldiers at common combat ranges, it became very popular with front line troops as well, and it did a pretty good job, particularly when supported by heavier arms (BAR & machineguns).

The carbine is a long way from the best possible gun for a lot of things, but it's an equally long way from being the worst for a lot of things as well.

 

[taylorce1]

I bought a cheap Universal Carbine a few years back, it's really fun to shoot. It's surprisingly accurate at 100 yards. I'll never hunt big game with it but that isn't what I bought it for anyway. I'd really love to have a USGI carbine, but they've been priced out of what I'm willing to spend on one at this time. If and hopefully when the political winds change the price might come back down on the carbines again.

 

[briandg]

When I posted the question about it being dead, I was thinking about it in terms of nobody caring. It looks like lots of people care. If someone engineered hollow point bullet for it that would function as well as the nine mm rounds we have, it would be in an entirely different category.

My pd carried them.

 

[salvadore]

I took my 44 Inland out to group @50 yds, geezer eye sight, using. Tula and another steel cased round under a different name and some very old reloads. They both chronoed right at 2000fps and grouped into an inch. I expected twice that with reloads and more with the steel cased stuff. The only difference the Russian stuff grouped 3" higher and 3" to the left. Pretty nice truck gun. I hate auto correct.

 

[mavracer]

If someone engineered hollow point bullet for it that would function as well as the nine mm rounds we have, it would be in an entirely different category.

It actually goes fast enough soft points will work and there are a couple companys making good SD ammo for it Speer has a Golddot and Hornady has a FTX bullet that look like they test well. Heck I feel confident in my Prvi soft points. Only problem is I'm not risking having my Nov 1942 5 digit serial inland getting put in an evidence locker when I can build another 300 Blackout AR for a song.

 

[TimSr]

I have a WWII vintage carbine, and it is an absolute blast to shoot. It's light enough to fire one handed. My wife enjoys shooting it, as she is petite, and the M1 carbine is light, short, and mild to shoot. it works great for what it was made for.

I can't believe that no one one this forum has yet to whine that there should be a lever action in .30 carbine. It would seem that everything else close to a pistol round is a "Must" for lever actions.

I don't see a practical purpose for the round in a lever gun, that another caliber wouldn't do better, and I can't imagine a lever gun more fun to shoot than the original M1 for which it was made. Also, you just don't see many semi-auto cartridges used in lever guns.

 

[kilimanjaro]

The M1 Carbine will still be shooting away long after the .300 Blackout is consigned to the cartridge dustbin of history.

 

[SHR970]

barnbwt wrote: Yes, there are definitely many applications (actually most, I would argue) where a lighter-weight, lower power firearm would actually be advantageous over even something as mild as a 223, but you will never, ever, ever be able to market 'less' over 'more' as a product solution.

I guess you never heard of the FN 5.7 x 28.

 

[Pathfinder45]

As to a lever-action application of the cartridge, as others have noted, it's been done by Marlin. However, the ballistically equivalent, 32-20 is more adapted to traditional lever-guns. And the 357 magnum is better yet for such an arm. I think the 30 Carbine is really at it's best in the M1 Carbine. I also think that deep down, a lot of us who have never had one are thinking, "Some day....". I remember when I was a kid sometime before 1968, Payless Drugstore had some shopping-carts filled with them, just rudely stacked in, M1 Garrands, too.

I think they were like $19.99, too.

 

[CaptainO]

The .30 Carbine

is seeing so much love that Fulton Armory is selling M1 Carbines that have been reconditioned with National Match Barrels and are so good that they are selling for about $1600 each. You may be astonished just how well they are selling! Surprised? You shouldn't be. It has served well in one World War and 2 international conflicts with honor.

Don't sell the "little" Carbine short. At 100 yards it hits as hard as a 110 grain .357 S&W Magnum with similar sectional density. No wonder it regularly kills Whitetail deer at these ranges!

In the words of Mattie Ross, the "little" M1 Carbine really has "True Grit".

 

[kcub]

As a rifle replacement, it lacks.
As a pistol replacement, it excels.

 

[Model12Win]

the .30 Carbine is a rifle cartridge whose power is perched midway between a pistol cartridge and a high-power rifle cartridge.

What is a "high-power" rifle cartridge? At what point does a rifle cartridge become "high-power"? 5.45x39mm? .300 Win Mag?

At best, the .30 carbine bridges the gap between a semi-automatic service pistol cartridge and an intermediate rifle cartridge. It's roughly 900 ft-lbs of muzzle energy places it between something like the 9x19mm NATO round and the 7.62x39mm Soviet assault rifle cartridge.

 

[44 AMP]

Here's something to think about, despite all the good things one can say about the .30 Carbine (and there are several), note that while there are AR's made in a wide range of rounds, both rifle and pistol, you don't see ARs in .30 Carbine.

The M1 carbine and the .30 carbine round are inseparable, but the .30 carbine round by itself doesn't sell much, the Marlin lever gun didn't last, the Kimball pistol didn't last, the Automag III didn't last, as far as I know the only gun NOT an M1 carbine (or variant) to last on the market is the .30 Carbine Ruger Blackhawk.

The .30 carbine is in its own special niche today, a slightly different one than it was when in military service. Its at the point where in guns other than the M1 carbine, the round is either too large and powerful, or not large and powerful enough.

 

[CaptainO]

As it has been said, the .30 Carbine beats all pistol rounds (even the 7.62 x 25 Russian pistol cartridge). It is not a "long range cartridge with 1000+ foot-pounds at 100 yards. As a 50-100 yard combat rifle, it has a lower weight and slightly less recoil than the 5.56 x 45 cartridge. It does have a heavier projectile, and with soft point bullets, it has a significant impact at shorter ranges. and is lighter than an M4.

It requires less training to become proficient with the .30 Carbine and with a 30 round M2 magazine it is easier to shoot and better for civilians to maneuver in a household situation than the M4. That is significant. Not everyone can handle the bulkier M4, but nearly everyone from youths to ladies and even good sized gentlemen handle the M1 with consummate ease and alacrity. This is the very attribute that made it so popular with the "support troops" during WW2, Korea and the Vietnam Conflicts. This confidence makes it deadly in close-quarter gun battles. It also has more power and is more controllable than the Thompson SMG. Such power, utility and easy shooting provide a healthy advantage for the inexperienced shooter and knowledgeable rifleman alike.

This is why it is still useful today.

 

[kcub]

I have a registered full Auto M2 carbine. On full auto it is more controllable than any assault rifle, more like a subgun and yet has more power and/or penetration than other subgun rounds. Further unlike the FN P90 it is possible to legally own one since it was made prior to 1986 (thanks again, Reagan). They are among the least expensive transferables you can own.

 

[Jack O'Conner]

There was a decision made in Washington many years ago to provide enormous quantities of M1 carbines to South Korea. Whether they're still in use is unknown to me. The cartridge itself generates approx. same power as a 357 MAG which is something to be feared on the battlefield.

Jack