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30-30 or 45/70
- Thread starter Rob96
- Start date
I only voted for the .45-70 because I have one. Either caliber is good for what you want to use it for. The .30-30 will run considerably less for ammo and will have less recoil, the .45-70 is..well it's a .45-70. It'll take any North American game animal and has the nostalgia factor. Frankly they are both good rounds.
I would pick the .30-30 because it is enough for the game you normally hunt and it's considerably flatter shooting plus shooting it doesn't make you feel like you've just been in a car wreck.
If you have a single shot 12 gauge shotgun around, shoot some slugs through it like you would shoot a rifle, from a rest or some field position, carefully aiming and slowly squeezing the trigger. This will give you a good preview of what shooting a .45-70 carbine is like.
If you have a single shot 12 gauge shotgun around, shoot some slugs through it like you would shoot a rifle, from a rest or some field position, carefully aiming and slowly squeezing the trigger. This will give you a good preview of what shooting a .45-70 carbine is like.
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For your uses, .30-30 will be perfectly fine. .45-70 is a great deal more expensive to shoot and is a bit overkill for those game types.
Edit: Missed the bit about elk hunting. .45-70 would be somewhat better suited for that, but how long a shot is it? If it's long enough, you may be better off saving up and buying another gun just for the elk hunt if and when it happens.
Edit: Missed the bit about elk hunting. .45-70 would be somewhat better suited for that, but how long a shot is it? If it's long enough, you may be better off saving up and buying another gun just for the elk hunt if and when it happens.
Kreyzhorse
New member
What type of range are you looking for out this gun? If its 150 yards or less, I wouldn't rule out a 45-70 govt. With the various loadings available for modern rifles, the 45-70 is great gun for feral hog on up. With a modern rifle, Buffalo Bore and Garret make some hot loaded ammo that actually puts the 45-70 into the lower end of the 458 Winchester, not that you need that much, but, it does show how many roles a 45-70 can play.
I'm not comfortable with mine past 150 yards due to bullet drop, but it certainly isn't overkill for hogs or whitetail. Its a big slow moving bullet and with soild points, it doesn't do much damage to the meat.
Recoil will be a harsher with the 30-30, but I don't think it recoils much harder than a 7mm Rem Mag or a 30.06.
I'm not comfortable with mine past 150 yards due to bullet drop, but it certainly isn't overkill for hogs or whitetail. Its a big slow moving bullet and with soild points, it doesn't do much damage to the meat.
Recoil will be a harsher with the 30-30, but I don't think it recoils much harder than a 7mm Rem Mag or a 30.06.
pilothunter
Moderator
I know you said a choice of 30/30 and 45-70, both found in Marlin lever rifles. I'll suggest a brand new caliber, just out in the Marlin, the .338 ME., and available in the .338 MX rifle with 22" barrel. This rifle is handy and powerful, basically mirroring the ballistics of a 30/06 w/180gr loads, and using a 200gr bullet. Well over 1500 FPE @ 400yds, makes it a great all-around choice for all the hunting you mentioned.
The ballistics basically mirror the .338 Fed, and the rifle is their tried and true Marlin 336 platform. There is another, .308ME also available, but the .338 would be my choice in an all-round rifle. I have a .338 Fed., and it's recoil is pretty much exactly the same as a 30/06 shooting 180gr bullets in a similar rifle, which would be a good bit less than the 45-70.
http://www.rifleshootermag.com/ammunition/RS_338_122008WO/index.html
The ballistics basically mirror the .338 Fed, and the rifle is their tried and true Marlin 336 platform. There is another, .308ME also available, but the .338 would be my choice in an all-round rifle. I have a .338 Fed., and it's recoil is pretty much exactly the same as a 30/06 shooting 180gr bullets in a similar rifle, which would be a good bit less than the 45-70.
http://www.rifleshootermag.com/ammunition/RS_338_122008WO/index.html
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Para Bellum
New member
.30-30. You have far more reach and less recoil with it.
Check Hronady's LeverEvoluition ammo. Makes it a 250yds rifle.
Check Hronady's LeverEvoluition ammo. Makes it a 250yds rifle.
Up until you mentioned that part about the possibility of an elk hunt, I'd have gone with the .30-30. The elk hunt kinda nixes that, maybe unless you handload. .30-30 really isn't intended for larger elk sized game, although Nosler does make a partition bullet for it, and Barnes makes an X bullet as well -- either of those can be made to do the job if you handload. Personally, I do handload so if it were me I'd just go with the .30-30 since it will easily do the bulk of what you want to do and can handle the elk hunt with proper handloads.
.45-70 will get the job done as long as the range isn't too long. It is more expensive to shoot and has more recoil, if that matters to you. Personally, I'd rather not have to deal with the heavier recoil when at the range or hunting lighter game, and I'm kind of a cheapskate.
In both cases, keep in mind that using Hornady's new LE ammo stretches your effective range about another 50 yards.
Since you are looking at a lever action rifle, you might want to check out the newer offerings that Marlin/Hornady have come out with. Both the .308 ME and .338 ME offerings are a significant step up from the more mundane .30-30 and may be more along the lines of what you are looking for. My only gripes about them is that they are so new that ammo and bullet offerings haven't really caught up with then -- yet. For the most part, you have the choice of the Hornady LE ammo (which is good stuff, even in .30-30 and .45-70) or handload with bullets that aren't really intended for the platform.
.45-70 will get the job done as long as the range isn't too long. It is more expensive to shoot and has more recoil, if that matters to you. Personally, I'd rather not have to deal with the heavier recoil when at the range or hunting lighter game, and I'm kind of a cheapskate.
In both cases, keep in mind that using Hornady's new LE ammo stretches your effective range about another 50 yards.
Since you are looking at a lever action rifle, you might want to check out the newer offerings that Marlin/Hornady have come out with. Both the .308 ME and .338 ME offerings are a significant step up from the more mundane .30-30 and may be more along the lines of what you are looking for. My only gripes about them is that they are so new that ammo and bullet offerings haven't really caught up with then -- yet. For the most part, you have the choice of the Hornady LE ammo (which is good stuff, even in .30-30 and .45-70) or handload with bullets that aren't really intended for the platform.
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azredhawk44
Moderator
.30-30 really isn't intended for larger elk sized game
The native elk to Arizona were all hunted to extinction in the late 19th and early 20th century. Lots and lots harvested with thuddy-thuddy. They actually had to bring in foreign elk to repopulate the state's wildlife. All the elk we now have are descended from about a hundred Rocky Mountain Elk brought in from Colorado or Wyoming, IIRC.
.45/70 can be shot quite comfortably if you handload. Much less vicious than a 12 ga slug. I've shot a .450 Marlin and a 3" magnum 12ga slug... I'd much rather shoot the .450 Marlin again... and the .450 is a "magnumized" .45/70.
Either will do the job just fine.
While that is true, it doesn't mean that the .30-30 was intended for use on that size of game. People tended to hunt with what they had on hand, and lots of folks had .30-30s and still do. Fed right, properly handled and at appropriate ranges they'll get the job done today just like yesteryear. That said, I don't think I'd choose to go on an elk hunt with my .30-30 stoked with ordinary factory ammo. I'd at least want to load up some of those 170 gr Nosler partitions. No point hampering myself by hunting game like that with bullets intended for thin skinned deer if I don't have to, and I don't have to. Now, if it were a case of that's all I had, and I had a hungry family to feed, and the opportunity presented itself (which is largely the case of what happened yesteryear), then so be it -- I'd take the shot without hesitation.The native elk to Arizona were all hunted to extinction in the late 19th and early 20th century. Lots and lots harvested with thuddy-thuddy.
How right you are. That's especially true here in Tx, where the deer tend to run on the scrawny side. For deer, I happen to believe that the .30-30 is quite adequate unless you are hunting in open country where you really do need to take shots out over 200 yards. It isn't that the round doesn't hit adequately hard because it does, it is that it isn't a really flat shooting round. Those who are hunting deer at those longer ranges don't really need their ubersuperoblitheratumagnums, they need something more along the lines of a .243 Win or a .257 Roberts. Even a .308 will do.With full scale magnumitis rampant in the shooting community, a lot of people have forgotten just how powerful and adequate a .30-30 really is. I would love to have a dollar for every hunter who seems to think that it takes a .300 Winchester Magnum to kill a whitetail deer.
Heck, a .308 will do the job on a elk, for that matter. As long as you use an appropriate bullet.
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I had an itch for years to buy a 45-70 to put alongside my Marlin 336A. there is no denying the historical romance and intrigue of the veneralbe 45-70. But after firing a few rounds of 45-70 in a friends gun, I eventually decided I'd dance with the one who brung me.
Never hunted elk, but my old 30-30 did everything I ever asked of it. And it's just a lot of fun to shoot without the muzzle blast, recoil and extra expense. I may still have to scratch the itch someday but that 30-30 will serve you well.
Never hunted elk, but my old 30-30 did everything I ever asked of it. And it's just a lot of fun to shoot without the muzzle blast, recoil and extra expense. I may still have to scratch the itch someday but that 30-30 will serve you well.
Swampghost
New member
+1 for BLE
"I would pick the .30-30 because it is enough for the game you normally hunt and it's considerably flatter shooting plus shooting it doesn't make you feel like you've just been in a car wreck."
I compare the 45-70 to a .300 Wby., too painful to have fun with.
"I would pick the .30-30 because it is enough for the game you normally hunt and it's considerably flatter shooting plus shooting it doesn't make you feel like you've just been in a car wreck."
I compare the 45-70 to a .300 Wby., too painful to have fun with.
.300 Weatherby Mag
New member
With full scale magnumitis rampant in the shooting community, a lot of people have forgotten just how powerful and adequate a .30-30 really is. I would love to have a dollar for every hunter who seems to think that it takes a .300 Winchester Magnum to kill a whitetail deer.
I don't feel this way and I own magnums... I want to shoot one in the worst way with my 30-30.. Knowing that option will require better field craft on my part...
I compare the 45-70 to a .300 Wby., too painful to have fun with
Swampghost,
I beg to differ.... My .300 wby weighs seven pounds and I enjoy shooting it... Maybe I'm a glutton for punishment, I shot a 6.5# .375 H&H and now I want one of those too... The 45-70 with the 405 gr loads at trapdoor pressures are pleasant to shoot....
El Paso Joe
New member
Just my opinion - get the one you will practice the most with. I would vote for the 30WCF. I have several and several 45-70's. The 45-70's are a hoot but a bit punishing to keep well practiced. I will generally shoot the 30WCF more and be better with it.