Winchester 1876 repro: .50-95 WCF
- Thread starter kcub
- Start date
I bought one of the Chaparral Model 1876 22 inch barreled 50-95 Winchester's back when CDNN was blowing them out at $599.00.
Although there were some people who had mechanical problems with their Chaparral 1876's (with serial numbers below 1000) mine was good right out of the box as it's SN was 2xxx.
I was fortunate when I bought my 50 95 in that Buffalo Arms and brass and bullets in stock so I could take it out and fire it immediately upon receipt of my gun.
When I purchased components for my 50-95, I was sure to buy lead bullets in diameters .510" .512" and .513" in hopes of finding a size that would provide a closest fit to my rifles bore and throat diameter.
Sadly though, none of those diameters gave me anything remotely usable reference accuracy.
Groups from 6" to 6 feet in diameter were common at 50 yards with all those diameters irrespective of powder( 5744, 4198, Traiboss, FFg and FFFg black powder were all used) and as you can imagine, I was quite disappointed.
I finally decided to spring for some Barnes original .510 JSP's in .510 diameter and with a moderate dose of smokeless powder I was able to get my groups to shrink to 1.5" at 50 yards (about 3" at 100 yards) with the crude factory sights.
At that point I figured out the rifle would shoot; so I backed up and did some digging and was able to determine that the throat of my particular rifle was way oversized at .515" and required a fatter lead projectile (than those I had on hand) to get it to shoot accurately.
Once that particular nut was cracked and using bullets to fit the throat, accuracy was no longer an issue with my rifle and I am quite pleased with my purchase.
It is an attractive rifle and is quite a pleasure to shoot.
My standard plinking load is a 350 grain flat point bullet (of proper diameter)using Hodgdons Varget powder giving me an average velocity of 1450 fps.
Accuracy is good with that load giving me about 3-3.5" groups at 100 yards.
As I mentioned before, it is an attractive rifle but it is rather large (even with it's 22" barrel) making it hard to get all of the rifle in a single picture with any degree of detail.
My rifle weighs exactly 9 pounds on my bathroom scale and 43 inches long from barrel tip t the toe of the stock.
Here are a few pics of the receivers case colors and some of the barrel markings:
Although there were some people who had mechanical problems with their Chaparral 1876's (with serial numbers below 1000) mine was good right out of the box as it's SN was 2xxx.
I was fortunate when I bought my 50 95 in that Buffalo Arms and brass and bullets in stock so I could take it out and fire it immediately upon receipt of my gun.
When I purchased components for my 50-95, I was sure to buy lead bullets in diameters .510" .512" and .513" in hopes of finding a size that would provide a closest fit to my rifles bore and throat diameter.
Sadly though, none of those diameters gave me anything remotely usable reference accuracy.
Groups from 6" to 6 feet in diameter were common at 50 yards with all those diameters irrespective of powder( 5744, 4198, Traiboss, FFg and FFFg black powder were all used) and as you can imagine, I was quite disappointed.
I finally decided to spring for some Barnes original .510 JSP's in .510 diameter and with a moderate dose of smokeless powder I was able to get my groups to shrink to 1.5" at 50 yards (about 3" at 100 yards) with the crude factory sights.
At that point I figured out the rifle would shoot; so I backed up and did some digging and was able to determine that the throat of my particular rifle was way oversized at .515" and required a fatter lead projectile (than those I had on hand) to get it to shoot accurately.
Once that particular nut was cracked and using bullets to fit the throat, accuracy was no longer an issue with my rifle and I am quite pleased with my purchase.
It is an attractive rifle and is quite a pleasure to shoot.
My standard plinking load is a 350 grain flat point bullet (of proper diameter)using Hodgdons Varget powder giving me an average velocity of 1450 fps.
Accuracy is good with that load giving me about 3-3.5" groups at 100 yards.
As I mentioned before, it is an attractive rifle but it is rather large (even with it's 22" barrel) making it hard to get all of the rifle in a single picture with any degree of detail.
My rifle weighs exactly 9 pounds on my bathroom scale and 43 inches long from barrel tip t the toe of the stock.
Here are a few pics of the receivers case colors and some of the barrel markings:
Mike Irwin
Staff
I SOOOO wanted a .50-95 back when CDNN had them, but I just couldn't afford it at the time.
Actually, I was really waffling between the .50-95, the .45-65, and the .40-60.
Any of those would have thrilled me to pieces...
Actually, I was really waffling between the .50-95, the .45-65, and the .40-60.
Any of those would have thrilled me to pieces...
I took the 76 out to a little range time this afternoon.
After a few rounds I was able to settle down a bit (although it's big it does have a snappy recoil with my plinking load) and was able to get 5 rounds offhand on my 12 inch swinger at 100 yards. (This of course was my best 5 rounds at 100):
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The next 15 rounds were all hits but not near that tight ( the single round at 11 o'clock was course was flinched into that spot)
.
After a few rounds I was able to settle down a bit (although it's big it does have a snappy recoil with my plinking load) and was able to get 5 rounds offhand on my 12 inch swinger at 100 yards. (This of course was my best 5 rounds at 100):
The next 15 rounds were all hits but not near that tight ( the single round at 11 o'clock was course was flinched into that spot)
.stubbicatt
New member
Lovely! Really nice. Good shooting too! ATCDoktor, you ever consider casting your own? Ever try a case full of black powder? I'll bet it is a hoot!
Thanks kcub, I assure groups like that reference my offhand shooting at 100 yards are the exception vice the rule.
I have considered casting my own bullets for this rifle and I believe I would be best served by using a custom mold reference that endeavor.
Getting a bullet of proper diameter to fit my rifles throat with a nose profile that will allow for smooth feeding (that has the crimp groove in the correct spot) is my goal and I have been eyeballing some profiles to build upon over at Accurate Molds.
Here's a pic of the factory cast bullet I'm using in my 50 95:
Short and fat with a giant meplat and crimp groove that will allow me to secure the projectiles in the case so they don't move under recoil and give the the proper OAL for feeding.
Here's a loaded round compared to 45 70:
Reference using blackpowder, I tried both FFg and FFG blackpowder during my accuracy work and it was definitely a hoot.
I never chronographed any of the blackpowder loads I fired but based on recoil I would say that they were comparable in velocity and energy to my smokeless reloads.
I was definitely surprised at how the rifle bucked and roared with approximately 82 grains of BP under a 350 grain bullet.
http://www.uberti.com/product-reviews?field_product_firearms_target_id=1485
On this link there is another link to a pdf of a guns and ammo article about the Uberti 1876 with interesting load data for a much heavier bullet, 400 or 450 grains which got me wondering about overall length and twist.
Of course there may be a difference between Chapparral and Uberti.
We all have humbling groups that never get committed to jpg.
On this link there is another link to a pdf of a guns and ammo article about the Uberti 1876 with interesting load data for a much heavier bullet, 400 or 450 grains which got me wondering about overall length and twist.
Of course there may be a difference between Chapparral and Uberti.
We all have humbling groups that never get committed to jpg.
My 76' is in 40/60 caliber which is pretty anemic for a rifle this large. When i reloaded it with Trail Boss the maker told me to fill the case until the seated bullet just touches the powder. That is max load then reduce 10% for minimum load, believe me the max is not exactly a tooth rattler and minimum is like a .22. To fully enjoy this cartridge load with black powder and it is a new shooting experience.
my original 76 in 45-60 made in 1883 is as easy to reload for as the 45-70. i shoot 350gr soft lead bullets at .458 for 1300-1350 fps and i have killed deer with that load and it shoots just about one hole 3 shot groups at 50 yds from a rest. and after owning it for a number of years i could sell it today for over a thousand dollars more that i paid for it. eastbank.
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=527427309
I just bought a Uberti 1876 50-95 on gunbroker. I think this will be the final push to get me into reloading.
I just bought a Uberti 1876 50-95 on gunbroker. I think this will be the final push to get me into reloading.
That is a beautiful rifle and the Uberti's (I believe) are the top of the mark reference 1876 repro's.
The case colors are extremely nice and the wood is finished about 100 times nicer than the Chapparals.
The price you paid was extremely fair for a New Old Stock Uberti 76.
Well done.
Hand loading is the only way to go to get the good out of this caliber (especially if you plan to shoot it on a regular basis).
Unless you're independently wealthy I'd start looking at equipment, dies and components.
Again congrats on your purchase and let us know how it shoots when you receive it.
The case colors are extremely nice and the wood is finished about 100 times nicer than the Chapparals.
The price you paid was extremely fair for a New Old Stock Uberti 76.
Well done.
Hand loading is the only way to go to get the good out of this caliber (especially if you plan to shoot it on a regular basis).
Unless you're independently wealthy I'd start looking at equipment, dies and components.
Again congrats on your purchase and let us know how it shoots when you receive it.
Just as I start to consider reloading violating a 45 year promise I made to myself based on real life experience I read this.
http://www.leverguns.com/articles/taylor/blowups.htm
http://www.leverguns.com/articles/taylor/blowups.htm
Just talked to a guy at Buffalo Arms about reloading. I'm considering reloading with black powder thinking it is safer/more forgiving/easier to get an accurate load. Is this correct?
He said with black powder you have to be careful about not leaving space as air has a different burn rate.
I'm way excited about this gun! A friggin' 50!
He said with black powder you have to be careful about not leaving space as air has a different burn rate.
I'm way excited about this gun! A friggin' 50!
Mike Irwin
Staff
"He said with black powder you have to be careful about not leaving space as air has a different burn rate."
Air... has... a... different... burn... rate...
-CENSORED--CENSORED--CENSORED-???
No. The burning rate of black powder is such that any air between the charge and the base of the bullet is compressed so quickly that it can ring the chamber before the bullet starts to move.
Air doesn't burn.
And, a lot of people will tell you that there is NOTHING easy about getting accurate loads with a black powder rifle. I know more than a few Black Powder Cartridge Rifle shooters who, when they started out, were shooting groups most accurately measured in time zones, not in inches.
LOTS of trial and error over bullet sizes, lubes, powder densities, grease cookies, base wads, powder types, crimp, etc. etc. etc.
Air... has... a... different... burn... rate...
-CENSORED--CENSORED--CENSORED-???
No. The burning rate of black powder is such that any air between the charge and the base of the bullet is compressed so quickly that it can ring the chamber before the bullet starts to move.
Air doesn't burn.
And, a lot of people will tell you that there is NOTHING easy about getting accurate loads with a black powder rifle. I know more than a few Black Powder Cartridge Rifle shooters who, when they started out, were shooting groups most accurately measured in time zones, not in inches.
LOTS of trial and error over bullet sizes, lubes, powder densities, grease cookies, base wads, powder types, crimp, etc. etc. etc.
Mike Irwin
Staff
Oh, and with black powder, you cannot use your run of the mill powder thrower. You need to use those specifically designated for use with black.
And, finally, remember that black powder doesn't burn. It explodes. It's not at all like smokeless powder in that sense.
And, finally, remember that black powder doesn't burn. It explodes. It's not at all like smokeless powder in that sense.
The classic BP measures (no steel-on-steel) are:
- Lyman 55 BP (at WalMart of all places)
- Hornady's Dupe of the 55
- The Harrells (note the BP measure just replaces the poly bottle w/ an aluminum tube)
- The CLASSIC Belding & Mull design now made by MVA
.... or.....
Your friendly $9.95 Lee dipper set.
(and no, you cannot overcharge BP by any stretch of the imagination)
- Lyman 55 BP (at WalMart of all places)
- Hornady's Dupe of the 55
- The Harrells (note the BP measure just replaces the poly bottle w/ an aluminum tube)
- The CLASSIC Belding & Mull design now made by MVA
.... or.....
Your friendly $9.95 Lee dipper set.
(and no, you cannot overcharge BP by any stretch of the imagination)