Why Isn't the .38 Spl SP101 +P Rated?

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ScotchMan

New member
Just curious why the SP101 line includes a .38 Spl-only revolver but doesn't specify that it is +P rated? I think most people agree you can fire +P out of these.

It also weighs EXACTLY the same as the .357 model in the same size/configuration (26 oz, 2.25" barrel, with hammer). Comparing the two, its not like the .357 is built any stronger. So why not stamp the +P on the barrel?
 
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ScotchMan

New member
There are a few of us who like firing the caliber the gun was designed for. I never intend on firing .357 out of a 2" barrel.
 
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shootniron

New member
My only point is that they are the same price as the .357 and the .357 would hold resale value better than the .38sp. Most people that buy the .357, do so with no intention of firing the magnum rounds except perhaps occasionally.
 
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ScotchMan

New member
I got a good deal on a used .38. And I understand that there are some very minor downsides to firing .38 out of a .357 due to the slightly shorter cases. So if everything else is equal and you have no intention of firing .357, .38 is the better choice, barely.

And I got a good deal on it.

But this isn't about justifying my purchase, I'm asking if anyone knows the story behind the decision not to call it +P rated.
 
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ColColt

New member
I'd load up 38+P and never think twice about firing them in the SP101. If you can do that in a S&W Model 15, I feel sure the Ruger would take it as well. There's not that much difference in pressure.
 
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Cowboy_mo

New member
If I was really concerned about +p loads in the weapon, I would give Ruger a call and ask their customer service dept.
 
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DPris

Member Emeritus
The practice of stamping +P on a barrel originated with S&W, and it's a marketing-only deal. No difference in the +P marked guns vs identical earlier non-+P marked guns other than the barrel markings.
Unless a maker specifies otherwise in the manual, all current .38s should be considered "rated" for at least occasional use of +P. Every Ruger .38 ever commercially sold was.

Why bother to specifically stamp it on every .38 barrel?
Of course the SP in .38 can handle +P stuff. The fact that Ruger doesn't stamp it such has nothing to do with what it can or can't handle.

You may notice that technically most (if not all) S&W .38 Specials since the 1950s were & are capable of dealing with +P pressures, but only recently did the company start stamping +P on some of 'em.
You don't see Ruger marking Blackhawks ".45 Colt +P", even though they can certainly run those safely.

You don't see .380 pistol makers stamping +P on their guns that can use +P ammunition.
Or 9mm pistol makers so stamping their guns.

Denis
 
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ScotchMan

New member
Interesting, thanks Denis. The LCR is stamped +P, and while I hadn't thought about the semi-auto world, you're right, no one else puts that on their barrels.

It still begs the question though, if S&W is stamping +P, and they put it on the LCR, why not their other offering in .38 Spl (which is actually stronger than the LCR, I'd guess).

I'm sure the answer is its not worth retooling the line, but that's not nearly satisfying enough.
 
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DPris

Member Emeritus
Again- why bother?

Some of the lightweight Smith snubs are stamped +P because they're so light that the crimps on standard velocity loads may not be enough to hold the bullet in place under recoil. On those, there's a reason for the stamping. My Scanditanium .38 has that on the barrel for that reason, meaning S&W recommends you ONLY fire .38 +P jacketed stuff through it.
Other Smith snubs don't have a +P jacketed warning on them.

On steel Model 64s, I believe the current guns have that +P stamping now (among other models), and in that case such new 64s handle +P pressures no better than my 31-year-old Model 64 that doesn't have +P markings.
Both are +P "rated".

Since there's no real reason to stamp +P on every gun that CAN shoot +P, there's just not much sense in doing it. Those that SHOULD shoot +P, I can see.

As far as the markings on the LCR, probably just a reaffirmation to new owners wondering if the plastic & aluminum can tolerate +P pressures, whereas the assumption may be that of course the steel guns can, most people wouldn't question it.

Glocks are fully rated for 9mm +P, but Gaston doesn't see the need to stamp every one that way. :)

Denis
 
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Lost Sheep

New member
Care to expand on that?

CajunBass said:
Because 38 Special p+ is 38 Special. Nothing more.
Click to expand...
Would you expand on that statement, please?

If +p is the same as 38 Special, why waste the ink on the extra characters? It was my understanding that +p is about 10% higher than standard ammunition and +P+ designated higher-than-S.A.A.M.I approved pressures.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overpressure_ammunition states that +p ammunition is the same as the pre-1972 ammunition (when ammo manufacturers lowered their pressure specifications) but this is news to me (and Wikipedia is not an official source, but a concensus based on casual sources, so may not be authoritative.)

Thanks in advance for the enlightenment.

Lost Sheep
 
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comn-cents

New member
The way I remember it, some of the first sp101's were not +p rated or recommended to shoot light 110 or 125 grain out of them.

The notion that stamping +p was a gimmick is absurd. It was put there because some guns could not hand the extra power

Some people don't want to mess with cleaning chambers after shooting a lot of 38spl in a 357 cylinder, so they purchase a 38 only gun.
 
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DPris

Member Emeritus
As I said, on those lightweight S&Ws the barrel marking is there as an advisory TO use only +P jacketed.
The steel S&W guns don't need to be marked +P because they were already +P.

Same with the steel Ruger .38s.
Denis
 
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CajunBass

New member
Would you expand on that statement, please?
Click to expand...

There is nothing to expand on. It's just 38 special with a press agent.

In the car world it's putting fancy wheels and a stripe on a Dodge Neon and calling it a GT. It might look hot, but it's still a Dodge Neon.
 
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RsqVet

New member
I was under the impression the only reason the 38 spec sp101 exists is to meet the carry parameters for back up / off duty carry of some police departments.

This makes sense to me. Why else make a gun identical save for what chamber reamer they use? Heck the 101 is beefy enough why not 6 shot 38? That I would buy!

In this case marking it 38 special may fit with the parameters of the department / need.

Oh and it may just be a roll mark... Have seen ond that would easily chamber 357. Maybe someone modified or ruger screwed up. Who knows?
 
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comn-cents

New member
The cylinder lengths are different & so are the frame lengths. You can't chamber a 357 in sp101 marked 38spl.
 
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