Which is more accurate?

[KMAX]

Which would be more accurate generally from the same platform, single action revolver, 45Colt or 357 magnum? I am considering pros and cons for me in my selection of a SA revolver. I am having a hard time deciding between a Ruger Blackhawk and a Uberti Cattleman. Do I want the transfer bar safety and adjustable sights or do I want the more authentic look of the case hardened finish and hammer firing pin? That is for me to decide though.

Question is about general accuracy of 45 Colt or 357 mag.Thanks.

 

[jmortimer]

They are both worth owning. I don't think there is an accuracy advantage between the calibers. The Ruger cylinder may need to be reemed. The Ruger is a tank and can take the "Ruger only" .45 Colt loads while the Urberti will do standard pressure in .45 Colt. The Blackhawk is more versatile in .45 Colt and could kill anything on earth or shoot mild loads. Why not a Vaquero?

 

[Shotgun693]

I could never tell that one shot better than the other at least as far a accuracy. .357 is cheaper to shoot, .45 is historically correct.
As for which gun, depends if you want a modern gun made to look Old West or a gun that's a fair copy of a real Old West Gun. The new Piettas are really nice too.

 

[aarondhgraham]

Hello jmortimer,,,

The Ruger cylinder may need to be reemed.

Really? Why would you say that?

I'm not arguing with you,,,
I'm just curious as to why a Ruger cylinder "may need to be reemed".

Aarond

.

 

[jmortimer]

Here is link to Cylinder Smith http://www.cylindersmith.com/
From his FAQs on his web site:
"Which Rugers are undersized?
Every gun is a law unto itself. I can say which guns I see the most of, and in what calibers. Far and away Ruger's make up most of my work. Of the Rugers, 90% of them would be .45's. Most new models, as well as some old models. Both blue and stainless.
I've seen a bunch of the new stainless .41 Bisleys.
I've also found that Ruger .32's and 40S&W-10mm-38-40's seem to always be quite a bit undersized, though there aren't as many in circulation. The .30 Carbines tend to run very tight, though we do not offer .30 as one of our calibers."
Here is link to Cast Boolits web Site thread dated 1-9-2010 with more specifics on .45 Colt Rugers.
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=72375
The new Vaquero's specs are right on. For $30.00 plus $12.00 shipping it is a very good deal unless you want to do it yourself.

 

[aarondhgraham]

Well dang,,,

I learned something I never had heard of before.

I wonder what Ruger would have to say about that FAQ statement?

Aarond

.

 

[Bob Wright]

Any revolver I have is far more accurate than I can shoot, and I'm no slouch with the handgun.

I've never had to ream any chambers on my Rugers. Still any of them can put down the steel at 200 meters when I do my part.

Them that talk about hair splittin' accuracy, talk about hair splittin' accuracy.

Bob Wright

 

[James K]

One consideration is that given the same size cylinder and barrel, a .357 is considerably heavier than a .45.

In terms of machine rest accuracy, there is probably little difference, though the .357 will have greater range and also the flexibility of using .38 Special, including target wad cutters.

Single action revolvers are not generally preferred for target work because of the heavy hammer, longer/harder trigger pull, and long hammer fall.

Jim

 

[10-96]

JamesK said:

longer/harder trigger pull,

Sir, of which model does that apply to? Perhaps you've only had a misfurtunate (or two) experience with S/A's. If you ever get the chance to manipulate a Taylor's 1873 clone or any other clone with a proper action job- they are truly amazingly short, light, and crisp in the trigger. Now Rugers from the factory, I agree- I've seen some that are ruther boogerish in the action. I have 2 Remington clones, 1875 and a 1890- they both came from the factory with outstanding triggers- but must confess, the hammer pulls leave quite a bit to be desired.

 

[ThomasT]

Rugers having tight throats is true. I had an SP-101 and a Single Six both in 32 mag that had .310 throats. My buddy bought an SP-101 at the same time and his had a .309 throat. I bought a reamer in .3125 and opened them up. They shot much better. My single sixes with open sights both have .312 throats and shoot just fine.

Dave Scovill of Rifle/Handloader did a piece on the 45 Colt and all the variations of the chambers so get the article and check any 45 you buy. At least educate yourself so you know what you are looking at.

From the same platform with all dimesions being correct and good ammo I doubt there is a lot of difference in accuracy. The lighter recoiling 357 may be easier to shoot but thats not the question is it?

 

[pete2]

I had a .45 Ruger New Model Blackhawk and the chamber throats were oversized by .003". This gun was not accurate. Had .44 Mag. and .357 Mag. Both were accurate. You pay your money and take your chances. Unless you are a reloader buy the .357 as there aren't many factory loads available for the .45 Colt. The 45 makes better holes than the .357.

 

[stalkingbear]

If you're a reloader the .45colt is a lot more versatile than the .357 as you can load a Ruger from mild to wild. By the way as long as the Ruger is an option I wouldn't personally think about the others. Again that's my personal choice.

 

[Jim March]

KMax,

Here's the kicker...yes, Ruger .45LC throats are sometimes too tight. OK, they're too tight a lot of the time . But the chambers are generally right and right, and uniform between chambers (as long as we're talking about a mid-frame from 2004 forward (mainly New Vaquero) OR a large-frame made after the 2007 switchover in the cylinder making process.

You can identify the new improved cylinders on the large-frames by where the "lawyer's warning label" on the barrel is. Under-barrel is new (good), side-barrel is old. The new process had all the chambers done with the same bit/reamer set in sequence rather than the old six-at-once process that produced too many mis-matched chambers in a single cylinder .

The "tight throats" issue is annoying. But the more common case with Ubertis is an oversize chamber and that's a lot worse. Undersize you can fix (for cheap at cylindersmith.com!) while oversize...yeah, not so much.

What I recommend is, get a dual-caliber 45LC/45ACP variant. Blued full-size Blackhawks in 4.68" and 5.5" are standard catalog run, stainless are available in special distributor runs...there's one right now through Lipsey's. I'd just go with blue though, myself...for one thing, they're lighter in the large-frames because the grip frame is aluminum.

You can also find dual-caliber mid-frame New Vaqueros right now via Davidson's:

http://ruger.com/products/vaqueroDE/models.html

...BUT note that a mid-frame is only good to loads of around 22k PSI max, much like an Uberti or a post-WW2 Colt SAA. The large-frames in 45LC are good to 33k and some factory loads exceed 44Magnum power levels .

In my view, the best bang for the buck in a single action wheelgun today is a new-made Ruger large-frame Blackhawk in 45LC/45ACP convertible, blue, standard catalog gun. It's lighter than a mid-frame variant, strong enough to rival a 44Mag, very flexible in terms of ammo type, power and cost. Also a good platform for "modding" - alter the hammer, grips and whatever else you want to your needs.

When I was shopping in 2005 that's what I wanted, except the cylinders weren't built as well as the mid-frame New Vaqueros. So I ended up modifying the hell out of a NewVaq357, including sights better than anything found on a stock Ruger handgun period. I'm now converting it to 9mmPara with magazine feeding and gas-powered auto-ejection of empty shells so...it's on the way to being the most heavily modded Ruger SA in history .

Ah yes...you asked about 357 accuracy vs. 45. I suspect the 45 is the more accurate round with some effective handloading and properly reamed throats. And the 45ACP's accuracy isn't bad either - both are meant to shoot through the same barrel specs so there's little if any accuracy loss in 45ACP. In the 357Mag/9mm convertibles, 9mm ammo is actually supposed to get shot through a .355" barrel so there's an accuracy loss when you switch calibers. Not so with the dual 45 setup.

 

[manta49]

Both will normally be more accurate than the shooter.

 

[KMAX]

45acp cylinders

Are there any issues with the 45acp cylinders on the convertibles that might need to be addressed?

 

[rclark]

Are there any issues with the 45acp cylinders on the convertibles that might need to be addressed?

The only issue I had with both of my flattop convertibles is I needed to ream the throats of both cylinders to .452.... No biggie. Took me all of 10 minutes or so (I have a reamer). Note that I shoot only lead bullets from mine (both .45 ACP and .45 Colt) and no factory load has ever been shot from them (or any of my guns for that matter other than .22).

 

[temmi]

Unless you handload I say get the 357/38spl


If you handload then the 45 Colt.


I have a 45Colt and would have nothing else

Snake

 

[Meeteetse]

I've owned both 38/357 and 45/45 Ruger convertibles since the 1970's and have never had a problem with either. I have no idea what the dimensions are of the throats or chambers, but I can tell you they shoot where they are pointed. I have hunted with them and they never missed and if they did it was my fault not the gun. Most of us cannot shoot well enough to tell the difference between guns with undersized throats or not. I spent the money on one gun to be throated and it wasn't worth it. Never done it again.

Find the gun style you like, in a caliber you like and buy it, then shoot the heck out of it. I like Rugers and my favorite caliber is .45 Colt., but the .38/.357 is cheaper to shoot, especially if you do not reload.

 

[Jim March]

Undersize throats aren't that big a deal when shooting jacketed bullets, they tend to "rebound' back from the constriction. Velocity goes up. If you're going to use the 45ACP cylinder for personal defense, you might actually want the gain in velocity at a slight loss in accuracy - esp. if the accuracy loss is only fractional when running jacketed (or all-copper) rounds.

So a lot of people like to leave the 45ACP cylinder alone.

To get the most out of the 45LC, you want to use at least some lead hardcast rounds for hunting or other "big boomer" purposes and that means you want the throats correct.