Whats the best handgun for bears?

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Sgt127

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Who cares! But, the new forum question should be, "Whats the best handgun for Tigers?" How you guys feel about hose little Kel-tec's now? Huh? .380's? NAA Mini revolvers? Feeling a little undergunned? :)


SAN FRANCISCO (AP) - The San Francisco Zoo was closed to visitors Wednesday as investigators tried to determine how a tiger escaped from its enclosure and attacked three visitors, killing one of the men and mauling two others.
Officials planned to conduct a thorough sweep of the zoo grounds during daylight. They said additional victims were not likely but they were uncertain how long the tiger, a female named Tatiana, had been loose near closing time on Christmas Day before she was killed by police.

Tatiana, a Siberian tiger weighing about 300 pounds, was the same animal that ripped the flesh off a zookeeper's arm just before Christmas 2006.

The three men—one of them 19 years old and the others in their early 20s—were attacked just after 5 p.m. Tuesday on the east end of the 125-acre zoo grounds near Ocean Beach, police spokesman Steve Mannina said.

They suffered "pretty aggressive bite marks," Mannina said.

The two injured men were in critical but stable condition Wednesday at San Francisco General Hospital after undergoing surgery to have their wounds cleaned and closed, authorities said. They suffered deep bites and claw cuts on their heads, necks, arms and hands.

The San Francisco medical examiner had not been able to identify the dead man, investigator Tim Hellman said Wednesday. The man did not have any identification and no one had called asking about him, according to Hellman.

The zoo's director of animal care and conservation, Robert Jenkins, could not explain how Tatiana escaped. The tiger's enclosure is surrounded by a 15-foot-wide moat and 20-foot-high walls, and the big cat did not leave through an open door, he said.

"There was no way out through the door," Jenkins said. "The animal appears to have climbed or otherwise leaped out of the enclosure."

The first attack happened right outside the Siberian's enclosure—the victim died at the scene. A group of four officers came across his body when they entered the dark zoo grounds, Mannina said.

The second victim was about 300 yards away, in front of the Terrace Cafe. The man was sitting on the ground, blood running from gashes in his head and Tatiana sitting next to him.

The cat attacked the man again, Mannina said. The officers approached the tiger with their handguns. Tatiana moved in their direction and several of the officers fired, killing the animal.

Only then did they see the third victim, who had also been mauled.

Although no new visitors were let in after 5 p.m. Tuesday, the grounds had not been not scheduled to close until an hour later, and 20 to 25 people were still in the zoo when the attacks happened, zoo officials said. Employees and visitors were told to take shelter when zoo officials learned of the attacks.

"This is a tragic event for San Francisco," Fire Department spokesman Lt. Ken Smith said. "We pride ourselves in our zoo, and we pride ourselves in tourists coming and looking at our city."

There were five tigers at the zoo—three Sumatrans and two Siberians. Officials initially worried that four tigers had escaped, but soon learned only Tatiana had escaped, Mannina said.

On Dec. 22, 2006, Tatiana reached through the bars of her cage and grabbed a keeper, biting and mauling one of the woman's arms and causing deep lacerations. The zoo's Lion House was temporarily closed during an investigation.

California's Division of Occupational Safety and Health blamed the zoo for the assault and imposed a $18,000 penalty. A medical claim filed against the city by the keeper was denied.

Last February, a 140-pound jaguar named Jorge killed a zookeeper at the Denver Zoo before being fatally shot. Zoo officials said later that the zookeeper had violated rules by opening the door to the animal's cage.

After last year's attack, the zoo added customized steel mesh over the bars, built in a feeding shoot and increased the distance between the public and the cats.

Tatiana arrived at the San Francisco Zoo from the Denver Zoo a few years ago, with zoo officials hoping she would mate with a male tiger. Siberian tigers are classified as endangered and there are more than 600 of the animals living in captivity worldwide.

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MrAnteater

New member
Not sure the point of this thread (shooting bears, shooting tigers, or making fun of small BUG's) so I'll take the shotgun approach and maybe answer the question.

Bears - .44 mag minimum
Tigers - Once again, I'll take my S&W 629.
Small BUGs - I'll still carry my P3AT, thank-you.

The two legged predators that pose as everyday people are still way more dangerous than bears or tigers!
 

cavediver27

New member
The report I saw this morning said the police used shotguns with buckshot. The video also showed the police armed with shotguns. There is NO handgun that I would want against a tiger, especially at close range with attacks on-going. I like my pistols just fine but when the 'crap hits the fan' like this situation, give me my Remington 870 12 ga. with extended magazine loaded with 00buck....forget any handgun.

FWIW, I'll still carry my P3AT for those 2-legged animals out there.
 

HammerBite

New member
The best handgun for bears is the Desert Eagle. It is a big gun that fits comfortably in a bear's big paws. Bears are the only ones who can reach the controls without shifting their grip or using the other paw. If I was a bear I would want a Desert Eagle.
 

Sgt127

New member
It just seems I always see people asking about what gun to use against bears...(Almost a legendary question on some of the forums) Who would think you would need a gun to defend yourself against a tiger!
 

Tom2

New member
Oh, gawd not another.... If you search here with keyword BEARS you get 3392 hits. Gotta be someone who has an answer about the bears question that matches your ideas, anything from 50 cal to 7.62 Nagant(penetration!) I think it must be bear trolling as entertainment for bored gun nuts, myself.
 

RsqVet

New member
Not very relevent but I have to say, if you respond on call at the zoo for a escaped tiger and you DON"T bring whatever long arms your agency has seen fit to mount in your cruiser then you ought to get fired.
 

Doublestack

New member
Oh, gawd not another.... If you search here with keyword BEARS you get 3392 hits. Gotta be someone who has an answer about the bears question that matches your ideas, anything from 50 cal to 7.62 Nagant(penetration!) I think it must be bear trolling as entertainment for bored gun nuts, myself.
__________________

Didn't read the opening post did ya Tom? :)

On to the great Tiger debate!

I too would choose my 870 Rem. 12ga. "handgun" loaded with 000 Buck or slugs! Maybe a .44Mag with 300+gr. full house loads for back-up!

DS
 

Socrates

Moderator
I talked with the keepers a long time ago. Tigers and Lions can easily jump out of the grottos there. Awhile back, one of the tigers jumped out, and was pacing between the iron railing and a hedge. Kids and parents were petting her. She jumped back in.

It's sad they got a mean cat, and it had to be destroyed.

Howdah pistols were designed for tigers. Think double barreled shotguns, chopped to 8" barrel length, shooting 375 and above solid bullets.
 

Tom2

New member
Yea I read it. The "best" gun for bears is debatable. The best gun for tigers is improbable. On this continent. And if you go hunting tigers overseas, you will not do it with a handgun unless you are on the back of an elephant and then you might take the aformentioned howdah pistol if you are willing to sacrifice some flesh instead of just putting the dang thing down with a good rifle. However I suppose now that everyone is considering the wild possibility that a lion or tiger will escape the local zoo and rampage in the suburbs. In which case you should go inside and lock the doors, keep an eye out and for the absolute worst case scenario, keep a big old shotgun stuffed with slugs or at least buckshot at hand. I assume this thread will eventually begin to resemble the locked thread from this year about what to use to shoot a certain dinosaur, which I believe morphed into another berserk zombies thread. Ugggh.
 

Sport45

New member
HammerBite said:
The best handgun for bears is the Desert Eagle. It is a big gun that fits comfortably in a bear's big paws. Bears are the only ones who can reach the controls without shifting their grip or using the other paw. If I was a bear I would want a Desert Eagle.

Makes sense. But wouldn't you have to modify it by cutting the trigger guard off? Or should we expect them to have enough control slipping a claw in there?

With their lack of opposable thumbs would propably also mean bears (and tigers) would need special grips that would somehow clamp onto their palm or wrap around their wrist.:):):)

I'll pass on hunting either of the critters with a handgun.
 

Socrates

Moderator
I'm actually an advocate of arming bears. If they could shoot back, there would be more bears, and fewer hunters. Plus, it would really put the teeth, paws and claws in the term dangerous game. I think this would probably be the best weapon for them size wise, for a handgun:

http://dillonaero.com/
 

RsqVet

New member
Socrates ---

Holy crud that's alarming. Seriously, Socrates I wish that it was not true... I have seen a number of your posts and I have the utmost respect for you as is possible in the online world.. so I do believe what you report....

I am no expert on enclosure design however I do work with dangerous species on a regular basis and if that happened anywhere where I work it would be fixed IMMEDIATLY, not wait and see what happens next.

Again if that is true the bums responsible have human blood on their hands and are responsible for an animal meeting it's demise as well.

This in a city that is hard at work keeping it's citizens from owning handguns....

Sorry I want to vomit now...

It makes me sick.

Frankly I find the idea of escape from an enclosure as it's described hard to believe but then anything is possible.... also possible is some one screwed up and is keeping mum as possible...

As to a mean cat.... I'd consider that one up for debate... so much of the response of wild animals in captivity is due to how we handle them... if we build a small area in the enclosure to lock them in before bad things happen to them, then they will freak when they get cinfined there if that;s all that ever happens there. It's as simple as pavlov's dog.

While none of us can comment on this untill the facts are more known believe me I'll be watching this one close.
 

EricN

New member
So there I was....

So there I was sitting in the employee cafeteria when this exact news clip appeared on the television.... were my first thoughts about the victims or the dangers of zoo attendance? NNNoooooo!

My first thoughts were what was everyone on TFL going to suggest to carry when attending the zoo. I need a life.

EricN
 
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