To all of you LEOs out there.

D

DAL

New member
To all LEOs:
IF handgun registration was somehow made mandatory in this country, how many of you LEOs would enforce it? Would you pursue the owners of unregistered handguns as vigorously as you do other lawbreakers? Would you feel bad about arresting someone just because they possessed an unregistered handgun? Where would you draw the line and turn in your badge because of unjust laws?

Even if you're not an LEO, feel free to chime in on this subject.
DAL



------------------
Reading "Capitalism: The Unknown Ideal," by Ayn Rand, should be required of every politician and in every high school.
GOA, JPFO, PPFC, CSSA, LP, NRA
 
T

TAZ

New member
I think most LEO members of TFL would probably do everything in their power to miss those arrests and investigations. At least I would like to think so. The problem does not lie with the local LEOs, but rather the FEDs. Most certainly any such law would be enacted at he federal level and such would be enforced by the BATF, FBI and what ever alphabet soup agency they come up with. We have already seen how much regard these guys have for both human life and the laws of the land (see Ruby Ridge, and Waco). The first thing you would see is a mass campaign to villify gun owners in ANY way whatsoever. Just as they did the Davidians. We have seen what the media thinks of us and how evenly they portray pro and anti arguments. Once this begins, much like the Jews were villified in Germany people will fall in line. If something like this ever happens our biggest enemies are not going to be the local guys, but the media followed by the aphabet soup guys.
 
G

G-Freeman

New member
Every time I see this topic I am reminded of one gentleman's response ,(paraphrased) " It will not be LEO's, but 18 year olds with M16's who have no knowledge of the 2nd who will come for your guns." To me, this is a more plausible and frightening scenario.
 
B

Blue Heeler

Moderator
In practical terms, what it would mean would
be the creation of another reason to arrest.
Even now--in some jurisdictions--LEO's are
well aware of some offenders who have
outstandings-and they let them ride,just in
case they need to pick up the offender.
 
S

sbryce

New member
I don't expect a lot of response from LEO's. Can you imagine an LEO posting here saying that he would enforce such a law? Can you see an LEO risking his job by publicly posting that he would not enforce such a law?
 
4

4V50 Gary

Staff
Unless an officer was specifically tasked to enforce that particular law, or a task force was created within an agency because of brown nosing or politics from the mayor (or equivalent politicians), don't look for Paul the patrolman or Connie the Cop to drop their citebook, ignore the family fight, look the otherway when a crack deal goes down, buzz past the DUI and not respond to a millon other calls for police services just to enforce some gun registration law. Fact is that most working cops are too busy doing regular work and won't devote any enforcement effort on the crime of the week.

[This message has been edited by 4V50 Gary (edited March 14, 2000).]
 
S

SKN

New member
If you use the search engine here you'll find quite a long running discussion of this issue under the thread "A Question to LEOs re: 'War on Guns'" posted by Jeff White on 1.13.00.
 
D

DAL

New member
Okay, so, from the responses I got to this hypothetical situation I surmise I shouldn't have to worry about my local LEO arresting me (they'll probably turn a blind eye to the violation--but wouldn't this constitute them breaking the law also?), only the big, bad feds. I feel much safer now. Thanks.
DAL

P.S. There was a time in this country when drugs were legal to possess and use. Then they were outlawed. Now look at how they are gone after by the authorities. Is gun ownership headed in the same direction?

------------------
Reading "Capitalism: The Unknown Ideal," by Ayn Rand, should be required of every politician and in every high school.
GOA, JPFO, PPFC, CSSA, LP, NRA
 
L

Ledbetter

New member
I say this as a non-LEO who works with them:

While we've got a thread addressed to LEO's here, let's remind them that, until they come for our guns, they're a lot of real decent people who deserve our respect for what they do and our best wishes for their safety.
Thanks.
 
R

Rob Pincus

New member
I think you guys know where I stand on this issue.

Rather than hypothetical laws of the future... I am very distressed by the current Lautenberg Law. Combine it with the mandatory (no officer discretion) arrests in all Domestic Violence cases and you have the one way that I cannot avoid taking away a persons RKBA. :(
 
F

fed168

New member
As an LEO, I am more concerned about the bad guys with guns more than an honest citizen who owns guns. In our city one is supposed to register pistols, but I cannot think of one person who has. To us it is a non issue, we have bigger problems like drugs and bad guys causing problems making life difficult for everyone else. States with CCWs: if one wants to carry, get it. That way you are in the right, sorry to say but there is no good excuse if you get caught and a hardnose LEO wants to press the issue. But most of us understand that a person needs the ability to help themselves, we can only get to you so fast, sometimes too late.
 
D

Dennis

Staff Emeritus
Rob, "... I cannot avoid taking away a persons RKBA."

100% wrong. You can resign, quit, and (in such a situation) remain an American.

Now that you have become a peace officer, remember that, "I was just following orders" has been invalidated many times since the 1940s.

You know this and, if memory serves, such was your opinion early in 1999.

------------------
Either you believe in the Second Amendment or you don't.
Stick it to 'em! RKBA!
 
G

Gunslinger

Moderator
Dennis, in Rob's defense (not that he isn't perfectly capable of defending himself) there are many laws, while not gun related, have a direct impact on gun ownership.
The particular law he is referring to states an officer shall arrest the primary physical aggressor when responding to a domestic disturbance. The law was designed for those (mostly women) whom will not press charges out of fear of retrobution from the accussed. This applies to any person involved in even a verbal altercation whom have either had a child together or coinhabitate. Because of the wording it is often abused by those simply wanting to have the other placed in jail. However as you know anyone convicted of a domestic violance offense is prohibited from owning a handgun. The officer can no longer use his own discression in whether to make an arrest or not. While the law is sound in it's intent it is flawed (in most states) in it's wording and therefore leads to bogus arrest that are simply out of the officers control.
If every officer that felt it wrong to make arrest based on this looked for another line of work we (the public) would be left with only the very officers that are complained about here on TFL (and rightfuly so).
Heretofore I had not responded to this thread however I can say that before my retirement I exercised alot[/i] my own discression when it came to making arrest. I did not then nor would I now make arrest simply based on some unconstitutional gun law. However there are times that an officer is forced to make an arest that will have a direct impact on that persons RKBA. Fortunately in most cases the persons RKBA is questionable at best. Unfortunately the domestic abuse laws that are in nearly all 50 states now do create a situation that takes away some individuals RKBA that are not right.

The short answer:
"Sorry Sergeant, I was just too busy today to kick in any doors and look for unregistered guns...maybe I can get around to that tomorrow."

------------------
Gunslinger

We live in a time in which attitudes and deeds once respected as courageous and honorable are now scorned as being antiquated and subversive.
 
L

Libertarian

New member
Well, you know Rob... The Alexandria police didn't arrest Moran when he beat the living snot out of his wife last year. She was able to dail 911, but the responding officers did nothing. I heard she has since moved out and filed for divorce (but don't know for sure).

So I guess even the mandatory Lautenberg is discretionary.
 
6

6forsure

Moderator
If it's a law, there will always be someone around who will enforce it. LEOs enforce weapons related laws all the time. I would venture that most TFL cops have enforced them too. Some won't, but most will. The government isn't your friend, and neither are its employees.
 
G

Gunslinger

Moderator
Libertarian, it is not a law in every state that the responding officers shall make an arrest. For officers working in those states that the law does exist it has taken the discression away from the officer.

6forsure, you are absolutely correct. I was shot twice while performing my duties as a police officer and was more than happy to enforce the weapons laws that those two particular persons violated. In the first case the weapon used was returned to the perpetrators widow. In the second the weapon was returned to the person it was stolen from in a residential burglary.

It has been said here and on other boards many times but for those that are still believing the media rhetoric: The vast marjority of rank and file police officers are pro-gun, pro self defense and pro concealed carry. The LEO's on this board are certainly pro gun or they would not be here!
Do not alienate your fellow patriots in the RKBA cause simply because they happen to be LEO's.

------------------
Gunslinger

We live in a time in which attitudes and deeds once respected as courageous and honorable are now scorned as being antiquated and subversive.
 
D

DorGunR

New member
Gunslinger:
Quote;
--------------------------------------------
The vast marjorityof rank and file police officers are pro-gun, pro self defense and pro concealed carry. The LEO's on this board are certainly pro gun or they would not be here!
--------------------------------------------

I wanted to say that....thanks for saying it for me. :)

Take care.

------------------
"Lead, follow or get the HELL out of the way."
 
G

Gunslinger

Moderator
6forsure, actualy I have "caught" people carrying concealed unlawfuly. In some cases I have made an arrest, in others I have let them go about their business after informing them of their risk of being arrested.
Was I within the law in letting them go? Probably not. Was I in violation of department policy? Certainly. Would I have been fired or suspended without pay if a supervisor would have known? Definately. Was I doing my job? Damn right. I was serving a citizen and giving them the opportunity to protect themselves when there is no officer around, which is the case most of the time.
You see in spite of living and enforcing the laws in a state with no provisions for concealed carry I realize the safety that concealed carry affords it's citizens and the need for it. I refuse to take the protection from them.
It all depends on the circumstances that the person is "caught" violating a gun law. That is where the officer discression comes in. You would be surprised how many officers feel the same way....especialy those on this board.


------------------
Gunslinger

We live in a time in which attitudes and deeds once respected as courageous and honorable are now scorned as being antiquated and subversive.
 
D

DAVE MOON

New member
I've arrested numerous people for CCW. All were righteous crooks or gangbangers.

The few I didn't arrest had no CCW license. They were good citizens that for one reason or another, I saw their gun. If they've got their act together and and don't have a felonious or dope background, they get a pass, even w/o the license.

All were surprised I let 'em go, but it was the right thing to do. Took some **** from a supervisor here and there, but I can live with that.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top