Testing .45 ACP Loads

[Jammer Six]

I'm interested in how you test .45 ACP loads.

I'm interested in accuracy. I'm not sure I care about velocity.

So, you've got your 1911. You've chosen a powder, a bullet, brass and a primer.

You've looked up a starting load. You know what the max is.

Now what?

Do you go out and shoot 300 of them, then say "yup, feels fine!" and go on?

Or do you have a rigorous testing protocol that determines which load is really more accurate?

If you do, how do you go about it?

 

[Tim R]

If they my loaded ammo hit were I'm aiming at would conclude how the round did accuracy wise. If you are shooting a 230 gr lead R/N, try 4.6 grs of Bullseye in your 1911. This is an old tried and true Bullseye load.

 

[buck460XVR]

No way would I ever load 300 of anything until I was sure my gun and I liked 'em. Could end up being a waste of time and good bullets. Knowing my guns, I generally start somewhere in the middle of a load recipe unless I am lookin' for powder puff loads. I then will work up in stepped increments to just under max and go with what shoots the best. Since loading recipes vary greatly, I generally source three references and average 'em out for min and max. I found that in my guns, the majority of the time, the most accurate loads are between 75 and 95 % of max.

 

[kraigwy]

My 45s are mainly set up for Bullseye shooting so, is picking a load, I try for accuracy at 50 yard using the NRA Slow fire pistol target.

 

[medalguy]

My procedure is to load 10 rounds in each increment starting low and load up maybe 6 increment steps. I shoot each group over a chrono to first determine which load achieves the velocity I want. After I determine this, I start working up and down on .01 gr increments to see where the best accuracy is.

When I start a load I always check the fit to my pistol before loading more than 2 or 3 rounds. Pull the barrel out and drop the finished rounds into the chamber and see if the "plop" is heard. One time I loaded 60 rounds without checking and I had not removed enough mouth bell, and none of the rounds would drop into the chamber. I didn't discover this until I was at the range ready to shoot, so I had to tear everything down, go home, and crimp the rounds a little more. This time I checked them before returning to the ramge (35 miles one way).

 

[Jammer Six]

Okay, I think I worded my question poorly.

How do you determine which load is more accurate than another?

It doesn't seem to me that scoring a target would do it.

 

[Ralph Allen]

I do like medalguy says. Load small #'s of 5 or 6 different powder charges. Then it's off to the range I go. Which one does my gun like? Which one has a good grouping and goes where I am aiming? None of the above, then more testing. 45ACP should be fairly simple to find the load for you as there's about a gazillion different combos and opinions out there.
Ralph

 

[Eazmo]

I'm interested in accuracy. I'm not sure I care about velocity.

It doesn't seem to me that scoring a target would do it.

I'm a little confused
If your test rounds function your gun and are all in the ten ring I'd say you have a winner with that load

 

[dacaur]

How do you determine which load is more accurate than another?

Just the way you would think... shoot them at a target..... You need a fine point to aim at, not just a big circle, something no bigger than needed to easily see at a distance. shoot 5-10 rounds, shooting at the same spot each time. THe load that makes the smallest group is the most accurate....
Unless you have really steady hands its tough to do without a rest of some sort, as you wont know for sure if a bad group is caused by a load the gun doesn't like or by your shaky hands....

 

[nate45]

As has already been suggested you load 10-15 rounds with various powder charges and test them.

Lets use the .45 ACP cartridge you are interested in for an example. They way I would do it is pick out a powder and bullet combination from the load manual that I liked the look of and got me close to the velocity I was interested in achieving.

Lets say that load was 4.5 grains of Bullseye and a 230 grain bullet. I would then load 10 with 4.0 grains, 10 with 4.5 and 10 with 5.0. Then from a solid fully supported rest, such as sand bags on a bench, I would test them for accuracy. Probably at 15-25 yards distance, but 10 yards would work, remember I'm just trying to see which load makes the tightest group.

Lets for the sake of argument say 4.5 grains delivered the tightest group. Well, if you wanted to get fancy and more precise, you could load 10 with 4.4 grains, 10 with 4.5 and 10 with 4.6 and see if that varied the accuracy. I doubt I would do that, because I'm not a bullseye target shooter. I'm only interested in combat and hunting accuracy with a handgun.

 

[Unclenick]

Jammer Six,

You've run into a terminology problem. There are actually two proper terms to consider: accuracy and precision. Most of us are in the bad habit of using "accuracy" for both. Technically though, accuracy is just how well the center of your group coresponds to your intended point of impact. The group could be big or small, but if its center is perfectly coincident with the point you are trying to hit, then you have the best possible accuracy. Accuracy is corrected with sight adjustments as needed.

Precision is determined by the size of the group, without regard to where its center is located. When you work up loads you are looking to find the one with the greatest precision. The accuracy can be fixed by sight adjustment later, so don't worry about where the bullets hit; just how close to their average position all the holes are.

 

[Jammer Six]

Unclenick, I think you hit the hammer like crap through a goose!

Or in the head of a duck...

Or something. I think I had a problem with words.

Yes, it's precision I'm looking for!

If I can count on the load and the weapon to deliver precision, I can move on to adjusting the sights. That's it exactly!

So, you shoot groups of, say, ten, and measure the group size?

What role, if any, would a chronometer play in this testing? What does knowing the speed of the bullet tell me?

 

[rclark]

15-30 rounds per load. Run over the chrono. I don't look much at 'accuracy' as much as look at SD and ES. If it doesn't have a good ES, it won't be that accurate. As one knows different velocities means different POI, so smaller ES means better accuracy potential. My rule of thumb is anything over 50fps ES is not going to be a good load. Over 75fps and it is automatically eliminated. Next time I go out I again shoot 18-30 looking for accuracy without the distraction of the chrono with the loads that 'should' be good loads. That is how I do it now. Before I had a chronograph it was just go out and see how it shoots.... Basicly shooting 'in the dark'...

 

[Jammer Six]

What are "SD" and "ES"?

And the million dollar question, if you have a load you think is good, and you go out and shoot a ten round group "for score", so you can "score" how big the group is, how do you tell the difference between a bad load and a bad shot?

And would you really take a load that had "good" "SD" and "ES", whatever they are, but shot a bigger group?

 

[nate45]

Its SD(standard deviation) and ES (extreme spread).

Standard deviation is how close the velocity of each shot is to the average shot.

Extreme Spread is the difference between the slowest and fastest shots.

You don't own a chronograph, so as useful as the information may be. You have know way of determining it.

 

[Jammer Six]

What does knowing these numbers tell you about a load?

 

[nate45]

Here I found the article below with google. It explains chronographing.

Chronograph’s (without tears) by David Moore

Its my opinion that, no offense intended, chronographing is a little beyond the handloading level you are at...but what do I know. You may want to buy a chronograph and start testing your handloads that way.

I have a Pact 1 XP that I mount on a camera tripod. Its not as fancy as the ones some people use, but it works and was reasonably priced.

 

[Jammer Six]

I wouldn't understand, huh?

Okay...

I read the page you linked. It doesn't answer my question.

Do you have an answer to my question?

 

[nate45]

When did I ever say you wouldn't understand?

What does knowing these numbers tell you about a load?

You'll find the answer to that question in the Using the Results section of the article I linked to. I linked to that article so you could learn about chronographs , so I wouldn't have to type four, or five paragraphs. Besides, the author of that article did a better job than I would have.

 

[Mike38]

I got lucky when making up an accurate load for my M1911. I loaded ten rounds of .45acp that I intended to use. Clamped the handgun in a Ransom Rest, and set it off ten times at a 50 yard target. All ten rounds hit within the ten ring (about 3 inch groups). Done.

Tried it again with a friends load. Again, all ten rounds within the ten ring.

FYI. My load was 4.0 grains of Titegroup under a Shooter’s Choice 200 grain LSWC, mixed brass.

Friends load was 4.0 grains of Clays, Bull-X 200 grain LSWC, mixed brass.

The only true way to get the human error factor out of a handgun is by using a Ransom Rest.