Terrorist Attacks Can Affect Our Freedom

Will this affect our 2nd Amendment Rights?

  • Yes

    Votes: 51 68.9%
  • No

    Votes: 14 18.9%
  • I don't know

    Votes: 9 12.2%

  • Total voters
    74

GeekWithGun

New member
Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2001 16:22:11 -0400
From: Eric S Raymond <esr@thyrsus.com>
Subject: Decentralism against terrorism -- First lessons from the 9/11 attack
Organization: Eric Conspiracy Secret Labs

Some friends have asked me to step outside my normal role as a technology evangelist today, to point out in public that a political panic reaction to the 9/11 terrorist attack could do a great deal more damage than the attack itself.

Today will not have been a victory for terrorism unless we make it one. If we reward in any way the Palestinians who are now celebrating this hideous crime in the streets of the West Bank, that will have been a victory for terrorism. If we accept "anti-terrorism" measures that do further damage to our Constitutional freedoms, that will have been a victory for terrorism. But if we learn the right lessons, if we make policies that preserve freedom and offer terrorists no result but a rapid and futile
death, that will have been a victory for the rest of us.

We have learned today that airport security is not the answer. At least four separate terror teams were able to sail right past all the elaborate obstacles -- the demand for IDs, the metal detectors, the video cameras, the X-ray machines, the gunpowder sniffers, the gate agents and security people trained to spot terrorists by profile. There have been no reports that any other terror units were successfully prevented from achieving their objectives by these measures. In fact, the early evidence is that all these police-state-like impositions on freedom were exactly useless -- and in the smoldering ruins of the World Trade Center lies the proof of their failure.

We have learned today that increased surveillance is not the answer. The FBI's "Carnivore" tap on the U.S.'s Internet service providers didn't spot or prevent this disaster; nor did the NSA's illegal Echelon wiretaps on international telecommunications. Video monitoring of public areas could have accomplished exactly nothing against terrorists taking even elementary concealment measures. If we could somehow extend airport-level security to the entire U.S., it would be just as useless against any determined and even marginally competent enemy.

We have learned today that trying to keep civilian weapons out of airplanes and other areas vulnerable to terrorist attack is not the answer either -- indeed, it is arguable that the lawmakers who disarmed all the non-terrorists on those four airplanes, leaving them no chance to stop the hijackers, bear part of the moral responsibility for this catastrophe.

I expect that in the next few months, far too many politicians and pundits will press for draconian "anti-terrorist" laws and regulations. Those who do so will be, whether intentionally or not,
cooperating with the terrorists in their attempt to destroy our way of life -- and we should all remember that fact come election time.

As an Internet technologist, I have learned that distributed problems require distributed solutions -- that centralization of power, the first resort of politicians who feed on crisis, is actually worse than useless, because centralizers regard the more effective coping strategies as threats and act to thwart them.

Perhaps it is too much to hope that we will respond to this shattering tragedy as well as the Israelis, who have a long history of preventing similar atrocities by encouraging their civilians to carry concealed weapons and to shoot back at criminals and terrorists. But it is in that policy of a distributed response to a distributed threat, with every single citizen taking personal responsibility for the defense of life and freedom, that our best hope for preventing recurrences of today's mass murders almost certainly lies.

If we learn that lesson, perhaps today's deaths will not have been in vain.
~ Eric S. Raymond [geeks with guns group]
 

Fly320s

New member
Our rights will be affected. Whether it's a good change or a bad change is too hard to tell.

Hopefully, cooler heads and common sense will prevail.
 

Art Eatman

Staff in Memoriam
Libertarian, I flipped channels from around 9AM until 11PM.

What I mostly heard from "The Leadership" was that we CANNOT let this sort of terrorist attack scare us into foolishness.

I was quite pleasantly surprised at Senator Biden's comments. He sounded very much like one of us in his support for our Constitutional way.

Of course, I don't doubt that the Schumers and Feinsteins, et al, will claim that "real" gun control would have prevented all this...:)

Art
 

GeekWithGun

New member
Blades67 said:
Thank your lucky stars that al gore is not the President of the United States.



My comment: I am almost certain that NO former or wannabe US President would want this burdon of the hightest order on their shoulders.

This could make or break G.W. in the next election... But then I predicted that Bush Sr. would have won a second term based apon his handling of the Gulf War.

Why didn't it matter? Likely because the war and his highest approval ratings were gone and over by the end of the first half of his term... You all know how fast we Americans forget.

If G.W. can, in 3 years from now, show a significant lowering of terrorist threats, I belive he will retain the presidency. That is the one thing that can be positive over this event, in regards to G.W's chances for re-election.

What might happen? America could look feeble before the world if we DON'T take on terrorists with an act of war. If we just attempt to bring the guilty to trial, it may take years to complete and our resolve will crumble.

What an act of war does is untie our hands in the realm of assasination. The U.S. may not assasinate or take part in the assistance/hiring of assasinations. Give us a war, and we can move against the enemy with support like extra funding and media blackouts.

Last night I went to the gas station while prices were still $1.28 a gallon and mentioned to the female cashier that I believed we would declare war. She said "Good! I hope so. I feel bad about wanting war, but it's an eye-for-an-eye... They kill our childern, we should kill them."

Is this the opinion of all America? Not likely, but fortunately many American's are now behind a single cause.

We are now truely the "UNITED States of America":mad:
 
P

PreserveFreedom

Guest
Every public event seems to affect our rights. Wether it will affect them in a positive or negative manner is yet to be seen.
 

Tom B

New member
Geek is absolutly correct! What Bush does now will make or break him. If he tries to find someone to bring to trial he is sunk! This was not just a criminal act but war brought upon us. We need to "light somebodys a$$ up" big time over this and soon! Maybe the good that will come from this will be that Americans wake up to the fact that the government cannot protect them and they had better learn to protect themselves. Only time will tell. :confused:
 

boogalou1

New member
I hope that the events of Tuesday will wake our society up to the fact that the State cannot protect us and that we have a personal responsibility to protect ourselves and our neighbors. One person in each plane armed with a handgun (CCW, security, crewmembers, or LEO) could have prevented the horror of yesterday. We have been brainwashed into being passive when confronted by attackers. I'm sure that the hi-jackers knew this and counted on it. Unfortunately, we are so afraid of the consequenses of possible civil suits if something goes wrong that we do nothing. The fact that these madmen used knives to take over the planes just sickens me. This is another example of the wisdom of the 2nd admendment and an event that wouldn't have happened if our Government had followed it to the letter.
 

David Park

New member
I voted yes but I hope that it will be a positive effect. I was pleased to see Dan Blather and his like repeatedly shot down by pundits and legislators when they mentioned the need for more security at the expense of freedom. Most leaders emphasized the need to preserve freedom, civil liberties, and the Bill of Rights or else the terrorists would win. Hopefully the people who rushed to buy guns yesterday will remember this in the future, even if they eventually sell their guns. I am also hopeful that current security measures (no knives on airplanes, Humvees on DC streets) are only short-term reactions.
 
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