Straight pull bolt actions.

[OkieCruffler]

Just got back from the folk's house after a wonderful Thanksgiving dinner (hope everyone is having a good one). Dad went out and bought himself one of those Swiss K-31's. I've never seen a straight bolt action up close, so of course I spent most of the afternoon just kinda marveling at the design. It doesn't take much to entertain me. Anywho, I got to wondering, why didn't this action catch on? I haven't had a chance to shoot it yet, but the action seems very smooth and super fast. Was there some design flaw that I'm unaware of, or was it that the militaries of the world were mostly useing the bolt action? It's coming out to te house tomorrow for a few quick shots before I tear it down and clean it up. I can't wait.

 

[Sactown]

My Blaser R93 Tactical is a straight pull and is way faster to operate than my Remington 700. I'm thinking that maybe the manufacturing process may have been more complicated. The bolt on my R93 looks more complicated than the bolt on my Remington.

 

[Sactown]

Here's a link to some more information, although judging by your name, you might have already seen this site.

http://www.cruffler.com/Features/NOV-01/review-November-01.html

 

[Wildalaska]

Anywho, I got to wondering, why didn't this action catch on?

Simple answer..complexity or inability to handle combat conditions, either one....

The two most famous straight pulls are the Canadian Ross and the Swiss K-31s.

The Ross, while a unique and accurate design, just couldn't cut it in the trenches of WW1. As in all straight pulls, it suffers from extraction problems. Further, if you reassemble a Ross wrong, upon firing it blows the bolt back into your face. The Canadians dumped em in droves in favour of the Enfield.

Take a look at your K31...all of the fancy maching and precision parts. A nation at war just can't afford to make rifles that nice. And I submit that the reliability of the K31 under combat conditions would be suspect, like the Ross.

The Swiss make nice stuff. Their bayonets are shiny as befits a nation that hasn't fought a war for 500 years.

But Im sure that K31 will shoot accurately, all Swiss rifles do.

 

[Crimper-D]

Combat with a straightpull?

Ask The Austrians - They used their M95's in a lot of combat in WWI. While disassembly of herr Von Mannlicher's straight pull designs are a major headache compaired to a Mauser, they apparently kept on shooting through some nasty trench warfare in the Tyrolean Alps for a couple years.

 

[Watchman]

Was there some design flaw that I'm unaware of, or was it that the militaries of the world were mostly useing the bolt action?

No design flaw. It was an exelllent action. The reason it didnt catch on was because the Swiss have always been neutral and that particular design never had a chance to prove itself on the battle field.

I've got one and it by far the most accurate of all of my milsurps.
With the Swiss match ammo, it is as accurate as any out of the box modern bolt action rifle.

Once you get used to the straight pull design and shoot it for awhile, it actually feels kindof odd to go back to a regular bolt action where you push up and back.

 

[Marko Kloos]

Got a Steyr Mannlicher M1895/34, nice little trunk gun.

The reason the straight-pull mechanism never caught on is twofold: it's more expensive to make than a turnbolt action, and a straight-pull lock was actually found to be more fatiguing than a turnbolt lock. The initial unlocking pull requires a good bit more inertia than the unlocking move on a conventional bolt action.

Try to work the lock on a Steyr straight-pull carbine about fifty times fast, and you'll see what they mean.

 

[Watchman]

That may be true on a Steyr but Im not to sure about the Swiss. Mine is pretty easy to "pull".

I think if one had a bit of adrenaline flow pumping due to the fact that bullets were whizzing around his head and he figured out that somebody really was trying to kill him, the fatigue factor wouldnt be such a big deal.

Unfortunatly, You cant really cycle the action 50 times in rapid succesion due to the fact that the floorplate stops the bolt when the mag is empty.

To me, once you get the hang of the Swiss, its actually easy to shoot and amazingly quick.

 

[Wildalaska]

Ask The Austrians - They used their M95's in a lot of combat in WWI. While disassembly of herr Von Mannlicher's straight pull designs are a major headache compaired to a Mauser, they apparently kept on shooting through some nasty trench warfare in the Tyrolean Alps for a couple years.

Actually the most prevelant WWI Austrian small arm was the Steyr Model 12, a Mauser design. M95s were mostly used by REMFs and police.

 

[Mike Irwin]

There were 4 straight-pull actions that were adopted by military forces around the world.

The Ross.

The Mannlicher

The Schmidt-Rubin

The Winchester Lee Navy

As WildAlaskan notes, the Ross rifles weren't really highly regarded in the trenches in WW I. Too many problems. Sir Charles Ross did have some success in fielding sporting rifles based on this design, but the best use for a Ross was as a target rifle. The Ross action, for some reason, is capable of exceptional accuracy.

Also, as WA notes, some of the early-model Ross rifles could be assembled incorrectly, leading to catastrophic failures and potential loss of life.

It's easy to make sure this doesn't happen, though. If you take apart and reassemble your Ross, as you push the bolt forward, watch the locking lugs. If they don't rotate fully into engagement, you've screwed up.

The primary problem with ALL straight pulls is lack of primary extraction with a sticky cartridge. This is another problem the Ross rifle had in the trenches.

Luckily there's usually enough bolt handle that you can kick open a straight pull if necessary.

 

[gordo b.]

I have hanging on the wall of my den a : 1911 Schmidt Rubin Carbine with saw tooth engineers bayonet, a Mod 95 S type short rifle with bayonet and a .303 Ross rifle with bayonet, I have shot each enough to know thir characteristics and I keep at least 100 rounds for each. I like straight pulls and I think they are shining examples of a bygone era of craftsmanship and ingenuity. BTW that 1895 Steyr sure backs off the bullet of those 1938 8x56R cartridges, jeez the R.E.M.F. that fired those mustve been recoil insensitive!

 

[OkieCruffler]

Well, 60 rds worth of ammo and I'm sold. My best 5 shot group was around 2.25 inches at 100yrds. No doubt that group would shrink some with a better shooter. The action was silky smooth and alot quicker than any of my rifles. The only real complaint I have is that it isn't as well balanced as I think it could be. Anyhow, now it's time to take it apart and clean it up, but that should be a quick job. Dad took the cheater's way out and bought one already degreased. Now where's the fun in that?

 

[raktrak]

K-31's and 1911's---------Swiss

Those rifles will shoot a 1"-11/2" with care and patience.Clean,clean and clean the bore with hoppes # 9. I let mine sit 4 or 5 hours and patch then wet it again and brush 50 strokes with a nylon brush and wait and wait then start over. If you are a reloader then load mild and seat deeper than you think it should be. The ogive on a swiss ball ammo is long and lean. I get my best groups outa a mild 130 gr hollow point load. I will let u decide on that volume for your perticular rifle. It likes Reloader 22. Cleaning can take several days. Once its pristine and with a handload youv'e got a fine watch quality rifle.


CLEAN CLEAN CLEAN CLEAN

 

[Tamara]

I have a fair amount of "hands on" time with both my Schmidt-Rubin M96/11 and my Steyr-Mannlicher M95/30, and while they're both fascinating, reliable, and accurate, I think neither stacks up to the best of the turnbolts (Mausers and Enfields) as a general-purpose fighting rifle...

 

[deadin]

There were 4 straight-pull actions that were adopted by military forces around the world.

The Ross.

The Mannlicher

The Schmidt-Rubin

The Winchester Lee Navy

Mike, there was another, the Mondragon of Mexico. (another Swiss design).
They even had a switch for "Walking fire". The troops were to advance holding the rifle at waist level and just work the bolt. It would fire every time the bolt locked.

BTW. It was the M1910 Ross that had the bolt that could be assembled wrong and would fire in an unlocked condition. There was an armourer solution that involved putting a rivet in the bolt body that wouldn't allow incorrect assembly. The 1910 also had the "cannon breach" locking lugs that were almost impossible to keep clean in trench conditions.

Dean

 

[Toney]

Don't have the leverage of a bolt. with that handle you can force the action closed, with that slide when you pick up some crap or a dented round you can't

Aint nothing shoots better than my 31! Only bad thing is wal-mart does'nt carry ammo for it

 

[BlueTrain]

I suspect cost is always a factor and even now, a K31 carbine is way more expensive than, say, a run-of-the-mill Mauser or Mosin-Nagant. Lee-Enfields in decent shape are getting scarce, too, as a matter of fact.

Another factor that may enter into the matter is the home-grown product, if any, always has a head start. It has usually worked that way here. Most countries that had a firearms industry have generally used guns designed at home, although there are plenty of exceptions to that, such as the Krag. It usually doesn't make a great deal of difference with what the troops end up with, at least at first, but sometimes it looks like they might have done better. Just as often the guns are rather better than we think, like Carcanos. And sometimes there is no choice.

 

[sleeping dog]

A disadvantage of the Swiss K31 (maybe the only one) is lack of stealth. Unlike a Mauser or 1903, you can't slowly and quietly chamber a round and rely on it being seated. You have to slam it home with the same gusto as setting down a beer stein at Oktoberfest. Wham!

That's a minor "flaw". I like mine, it shoots great, right up there with the Swede Mauser.

Regards.

 

[smince]

The only real complaint I have is that it isn't as well balanced as I think it could be.

Funny, to me it's one of the better balanced mil-surps I've handled. Feels a lot lighter than it is to me because of it's balance.